P-Scrap

[Hermes]

Can p-scrap price in alpha go back to normal now?

Ask for something to be nerf'd , you will find better results
but asking to buff back p-scrap is not the right thing to do i guess... i think p-scrap should be worth 1.000 or maybe 500 credits in alpha
so the bad congress guys don't jump trade using it ...

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[Sciamach]

i think p-scrap should be worth 1.000 or maybe 500 credits in alpha

I'm sorry, what?

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[ sci·am·ach ]
/sīˈamək/

A simple, angry man casually working his way through life on a personal quest to acquire copious amounts of street cred.

[FynnMcScrap]

/sarcasm , Scourge

[Pancakes]

In fact, checking it over again, Texas to Gamma is one jump less than Texas to Alpha.

Texas to Omicron Alpha is 8 jumps, Texas to Omicron Gamma is 7.

I just don't see how any of the complaints about the Gamma route are valid, except for the decrease in OC smuggling activity. Which should come from the OC side, rather than the Junker one

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BLOOD FOR THE BLOOD GOD

[FynnMcScrap]

Or at least , if you insist to have P- Scrap at Alpha upped to about the levle it is at Gamma :

Please do NOT touch the gallic ports.
They make for great trading,
and I still dont understand why there are not more foks flying there.

Creeping through the minefield to Lorraine is incredibly dense in a transport,
and I thoroughly enjoy dodging gallic Patrols in my Serenity .
Heck if I knew who gave those damn GB´s a CD I´d vote him as Dev of the jear !
Or you sneak past Kusari so as not to provoke questions... very nice ... and there is a Hogosha hotspot near, too ! And the Tau route is great, same as the Orkney run.

Sure, gallia is quite serene and calm if you want to have the long route back, but you have 3 routes possible, pass through many a pirate and / or wartime focus points AND if anybody ceeps a watchful look at the player list he should know where to be able to catch you.

Nothing to bring back ? WRONG !

Samarium sells well and is cheapest in Burgundy with Council,
Promethenum and Prometium sell well,
Fugitives are an option, and if you insist on smuggling : take a look at NOX.
And the TAUs are not very far away, with mineable ores to be found...

Oh I forgot : No Cardamine.

Cardamine, Cardamine, everybody wants Cardamine...

Set them the price at la Valetta back to 9.800 or 10.200 , I will not mind.
But I sure hope you will keep Charlon-en-Champagne and the royalist port of call,
for I would rather fly to Gallia. And for the 11.000 at Champage I would continue to fly there, even if somebody faction-boosted Alpha back to 14.000.
It might be a long route, and I might not fly there every day because for normal trade I make about as much cash in a time/cash ratio if I trade in a Scrap <> H3 doublette ,
but If I have some time its a fine route to fly both in convoy or alone.

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FynnMcScrap, Foreman of Tinkers Haven

[Wesker]

I mean the trip to alpha was fun in a salvy. But now I just fill up my 5ker with p-scrap and take it to gallia instead it's longer and more boring I only do it once in a while. Also OCs have so many enemies and an actual need for a fleet inRP so I think p-scrap prices at14k make sense

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[Highland Laddie]

the Tau route is great, same as the Orkney run.

I would disagree. The Gate into Languedoc via Tau-23 now makes Orkney almost completely useless, whereas before, when it was the only route into Gallia, you would be more likely to catch transports coming into/out of there and it was a great piracy spot, or even a nice place to combat GRN warships.

As it is now....transports go right from the short lanes in Languedoc right to Tau-23, where there is a nice Gallic npc BS for them to dock on if they run into pirates on the other side, not to mention 2 friendly stations around 40k or less away they can run to if there's trouble.

I would rather you eliminate the Tau-23 > Languedoc gate, and increase sell prices in Gallia accordingly to still make it well worth the trip.

[Lythrilux]

to quote myself from the jump drive discussion :

oK... does it really "suck for Junkers" ?

I have a ton of scrappers interacting with us Tinkers, and not all are in our group.
( actually, most are not... jet. )
We even mine / scrap as group rather regularilly as the Haven is wiped clean of 100.000 units of scrap in about 24 hours at the moment.
Using whatever scrapper is around to help, and whatever trader is around to haul.
Even ending up to throwing scrap into the Spire for fun.

Junkers can evade Kusari, fly to GMG and sell there.
Can sell it at the Brunswyck shrine for 7000
( ... funny, only us Tinkers doing that somehow, ehy ? Not enough profit ? )
Can find other groups to interact with , settle a deal with Council, deal with Gallia...

Lost of possibillities with only 1 single drawback : No Cardamine...

Leave the scrap as it is,
its working fine to ensure exactly that what was intended :

generate more interaction

Leave JD´s for 4 sectors to hop over a focus point, fine

and leave scrap be scrap

Balancing is quite good at the moment
Just give it a chance and dont work alone

There are good routes for silent lonesome traders,
but like all good routes they are only very good one way.

If you want a very good trade route both ways : Interact, trade, and cooperate.
Works well

The balancing sucks Fynn. Have you not seen the posts in the mining feedback thread? Premium Scrap isn't viable for Junkers as a mining commodity compared to everything else. I gave it a chance and now that time has passed my conclusion is that it needs to be reverted.

Sure, you get lots of Scrappers. Beaumont Spire also gets lots of Scrappers. Are they Junker ID'd though? No, they're not. Spire mostly sees corporate 5ks taking Pscrap to Yokohama or ALG (and other Gallic friendly ships) taking Pscrap to Gallia.

Hell, you even describe one of the problems with the nerf. Now Junkers no longer have any reason to fly through Kusari, or systems where many Kusari factions can interact with Junkers.

Claiming that PScrap is a 'good route for silent lonesome traders' isn't a viable argument that you can pinpoint on Pscrap alone. You get this with every commodity, so we just need to swallow our pride and stop nitpicking in that regard. Pscrap brought loads of interactions. Players would mine it in Texas, which would possibly attract Xenos. Pirate ID'd (independents and house) would also get involved in the trade, giving lawfuls something to shoot too. On the way to Alpha CR, UC, IMG, GRN, Hogosha, Exiles, KNF, KSP, indie pirates would all be waiting to pounce on Junkers hauling PScrap up to Alpha. Factions like OC and JM would log in to protect them, further adding to the activity. Now that PScrap is nerfed, all of that is gone. The Taus were once active and now they're deader than ever.

Jump Trading is what killed it and I'm glad it's been crippled. Now we can finally look at getting Pscrap back to what it was, without all the negatives that poisoned it.

Its not unbearable, but I've found that ever since the change I've seen less big convoys (conventional, not jump convoys) and I miss the old routine and routes! Yes i know change is inevitable but I feel the alpha run was one of the best routes i've ever participated in as both trader and escort. I know the activity gets spread around more, but also feels a bit diluted. I'd have rather seen pscrap stay the same and the addition of other similarly profitable routes for the Corsairs and Gallia to compete, instead of replace. We took one route and split it up, and as such the activity seems all over the place when it comes to organized effort. I know its not likely to change back very soon, if ever. And for the record, not sure if any congress folk have spoken up, but in the defense of jump trading, it's not all about fast and easy profit. All of the players involved buy the scrap at lower prices for jumps to be fair and make room on bases for other people to continue mining and supplying them in their immediate environments. Everyone involved benefits from it in the end.

Ignoring your points about jump trading, what you said has truth. It brought activity, good activity for that matter (when it wasn't jumped).

Why did it have to get nerfed and furthermore why did we have to lose all this activity?

Contrary to the popular belief Premium Scrap isn't economically less viable. Platinum ore that I have seen being compared to requires the exact same amount of jumps, only with a greater risk.

That's only because Platinum has been recently nerfed. Beforehand when Pscrap was 14k Platinum was still more OP than Pscrap. Uncut Diamonds have always been more OP than Pscrap.

You also seem to forget to take in account how far safer it is to mine Premium Scrap in comparsion to normal mining, which is also a very important factor. You simply cannot compare a Salvager (3,300 cargo, GB guns, medium size model) with Hegemon which is gigantic, terrible gun arcs, normal transport turrets, and just 2750 cargo space.

Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand therefore it's a ship problem, not a problem with the route. I have been yammering on for the Salvager to get nerfed because it IS OP for trading.

Right now Premium Scrap is at last balanced.

It's not though. It's pointless for Junkers and the only merit there is to it is doing it with an ALG ID. Furthermore the nerfed killed the positive activity associated with it.

You have 7 jumps to Omicron Gamma from Texas to sell it for 10k, or 5 jumps from Texas to sell it in New Tokyo for 9k. Seems rather fair to me.

Are you serious? 2 jumps for an extra 1k, you're not even taking into account that there's A LOT more flying through empty space without lanes from Texas to Gamma than Texas to New Tokyo.

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[Chuba]

make all house shipyard buy p scrap for 10 thousand

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[FynnMcScrap]

The balancing sucks Fynn. Have you not seen the posts in the mining feedback thread? Premium Scrap isn't viable for Junkers as a mining commodity compared to everything else. I gave it a chance and now that time has passed my conclusion is that it needs to be reverted.

Sure, you get lots of Scrappers. Beaumont Spire also gets lots of Scrappers. Are they Junker ID'd though? No, they're not. Spire mostly sees corporate 5ks taking Pscrap to Yokohama or ALG (and other Gallic friendly ships) taking Pscrap to Gallia.

Hell, you even describe one of the problems with the nerf. Now Junkers no longer have any reason to fly through Kusari, or systems where many Kusari factions can interact with Junkers.

Claiming that PScrap is a 'good route for silent lonesome traders' isn't a viable argument that you can pinpoint on Pscrap alone. You get this with every commodity, so we just need to swallow our pride and stop nitpicking in that regard. Pscrap brought loads of interactions. Players would mine it in Texas, which would possibly attract Xenos. Pirate ID'd (independents and house) would also get involved in the trade, giving lawfuls something to shoot too. On the way to Alpha CR, UC, IMG, GRN, Hogosha, Exiles, KNF, KSP, indie pirates would all be waiting to pounce on Junkers hauling PScrap up to Alpha. Factions like OC and JM would log in to protect them, further adding to the activity. Now that PScrap is nerfed, all of that is gone. The Taus were once active and now they're deader than ever.

Jump Trading is what killed it and I'm glad it's been crippled. Now we can finally look at getting Pscrap back to what it was, without all the negatives that poisoned it.

Actually, why should only Junkers carry PremScrap ?

Junkers can mine it best, and always will.
But why not cooperate ?
I would gladly agree to setting back a higher price at La Valetta if the prices at other places would stay, and I see no reason to "only let Junkers carry scrap" ?

Let the corporates haul it if they want , why not ?
You can always pirate them with a different ship if you like, or get some peaceful interaction while scrapping. And more diversity with the ships coming to fetch scrap means you get more different opportunities to interact ?

I read the posts in the feedback, and do not agree with everything.
And I will not launch into a balancing discussion with you.
My point only is :

Interaction does not only mean shooting or piracy, even in a space shooter game.

Fact is : I fly in Texas all the time.
I see more Interaction since the change, not less.
Kusari has come back to life, there is some more reasons to fly to Gallia too,
and Outcasts seem to be the only faction loosing something.

Outcasts, not Junkers or JM|

Sure, Tinkers profit greatly, the change could have been tailored to us.
( And I do not think it has been, by the way. Even if I suggested the sellpoint at Council space in Champagne )

So I still say : Add a higher sellpoint at La Valetta again if you insist and can convince Dev´s and Balancing team.
But please : leave the gallic sellpoints alone, they are fine !

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FynnMcScrap, Foreman of Tinkers Haven