I would add another point, 8. DON'T build a PoB, for much of the same reasons as 5. DON'T make a faction unless you know what you're doing. and 6. DON'T go after the biggest, shiniest ship.
Many new players see building a PoB as the ultimate goal, as the main or even only reason to play on the server.
Unfortunately, they will likely become frustrated quickly when they're forced to roleplay with house governments and pirates to avoid it being sieged, and by the huge amount of time investment required to maintain and expand a PoB not operated by a well-established group. PoB building is "expert mode" and should not be attempted by new players.
It's a good guide, although sadly the type of player most in need of it is unlikely to visit the forum at all, much less find a thread like this. A few days ago, I was helping a few new players with mining and stuff, and they were in desperate need of understanding all these points. But I'm pretty sure they hadn't visited the forums at all, their English was so bad that they wouldn't have even been able to read the first point about sufficient English language skills. I'm pretty sure they didn't understand the concept of RP either, and they definitely hadn't read the rules. I imagine they'll be in Bastille soon enough.
The sad truth is that a lot of the players that regularly violate these rules just don't belong here to begin with, because they're looking for a casual experience that just isn't compatible with this server.
(10-04-2017, 01:38 PM)Karst Wrote: The sad truth is that a lot of the players that regularly violate these rules just don't belong here to begin with, because they're looking for a casual experience that just isn't compatible with this server.
With point 8 almost every reason why 99% of noobs would realistically try the mod is on the "DONT DO IT NOOB!!!" list now.
If people are really serious about it (which unfortunately many here are), just writing the following in the server description in the player list and on ModDB page would make it much easier and effective:
"Don't log on unless you're willing to read 10 pages of rules, learn and follow unwritten rules told to you by veteran players, write in flawless English, fly the crappiest ships, follow official's instructions, smile while getting pirated, lose every single fight unless picking on players newer than you, and not try to contribute anything apart from obeying orders for at least a year. Failure to comply will result in veteran players finding ways to get rid of you, one way or another."
I also wonder how many vets, devs, and admins started playing here planning to make it the life-encompassing commitment that it turned into for them, and how may started looking for a casual experience.
Mind you, I agree that many things on list are genuinely good advice because of the state of affairs here, unfortunately. But they would better be avoided through game mechanics and official rules (for example point 8) than letting them be handled by "dont do it noob!" lists, or enforced by skype contact lists of shady individuals and cliques. It's pointless to try and change noobs. They keep coming the way they were. Adapt to them, be prepared for them, change the vets by changing their expectations.
I'm not trying to be a cynical bittervet, I'm just being realistic. No, I didn't plan on making it a seven-plus-year commitment when I started, but I had an easy time because I was very familiar with both Freelancer and roleplaying.
Nobody is expecting new players that aren't either of those things to act like model members immediately, but new players need to have realistic expectations of the game.
Those people I mentioned that I was trying to help out, the sort of people that should be looking at this list, probably won't ever fit in.
They were having trouble with two BPA (who they referred to as "freelancers", because the concept of somebody playing a lawman didn't exist in their heads), and were outraged when they got shot after completely ignoring them and their demands, which they couldn't respond to because they don't speak a word of English. They didn't see it as policemen doing their jobs, but simply players harassing other players for no reason. They were totally mute in-game, pop culture ship names, returned after dying, wordless engaging, breaking pretty much every rule in existence because their idea of the game simply had nothing to do with Discovery RP 24/7.
If they eventually understand how the game actually works (which I doubt they will) and that the way they're doing it won't work on this server, I'm 99% sure they won't be playing anymore. Not being able to speak a word of English disqualifies them from playing here to begin with, but even if they did, they are playing a different game, one that doesn't have a place here. That is what I was talking about.
(10-04-2017, 02:18 PM)Karlotta Wrote: It's pointless to try and change noobs. They keep coming the way they were. Adapt to them, be prepared for them, change the vets by changing their expectations.
(10-04-2017, 02:18 PM)Karlotta Wrote: It's pointless to try and change noobs. They keep coming the way they were. Adapt to them, be prepared for them, change the vets by changing their expectations.
Also complete agreement.
But it comes with a suggestion: vets and in general every player that knows better could make more of an effort to try to be helpful towards inexperienced players.
I agree with Karst that some players will never fit in and they will leave sooner or later anyway. See them as NPCs, and you won't be disappointed. NPC-level influence is what they can have on your Disco experience - actually none if you do not allow for it.
However, years of working with newbies and training them, hundreds of times of explaining roleplay and of setting up correct ships have taught me that there are many new players who can learn the ropes quickly and who can become valuable, fully integrated members rather quickly. It takes guidance however.
And THAT's the job of veterans, of factions. I mean, realistically... if I had not been picked up by an IMG| while fighting Mollys who pirated my IMG-IDed, Lib-Navy-IFF-ed armorless Hegemonminer in Dublin after I shot their NPC GB patrol because it attacked me... I would have qualified as exactly that same category of noob and would likely have left at some point because the real learning process of "what Disco is like" only started after having been picked up and having been taken by the hand by vets.
We can do more, as veteran players, as factions with visibility, to transform the newbies into real-Disco players. That's what everybody should do.
(10-04-2017, 02:18 PM)Karlotta Wrote: It's pointless to try and change noobs. They keep coming the way they were. Adapt to them, be prepared for them, change the vets by changing their expectations.
We can do more, as veteran players, as factions with visibility, to transform the newbies into real-Disco players. That's what everybody should do.
Not everyone has to do something to help noobs all the time, but it would be great if some vets and devs stopped doing everything in their power to make noobs as miserable as possible with the following:
-"I should be able to win a 5 vs 1 against 5 noobs"
-"get gud"
-"you cant use numbers/caps to compensate or I'll bully you until submit"
-"you have to obey my lore-breaking commands because I's more official than you and I have our common IRP enemy on skype"
-"you cant do this and you cant do that, not because game mechanics or rules, but because some pros will screw you over if you step on their turf"
It's also mind-boggling how little (with little I mean NOTHING) the dev team does to make it easier to teach noobs lore and game mechanics. Even if you saw noobs as sub-human scum, the superimportant supervets would benefit from that because it keeps noobs in their meddlesome subhuman state less long.
Over the years I've brought this up again and again, I've written bar rumors, ingame help systems, improved server messages, history items.
All it required for devs to do was literally a copy-paste job, or at least say what could be improved if it wasnt good enough.
But they did: Squat.
I wrote more which I think needs to be said, and needed to be said and done years ago, but decided against it because it'll only upset some people into using it as a pretext to ban me again, and it's really more than too late to do anything anymore anyway.
and probably you must be well armed with patience, not to be french or have a perfect english, accept all the admins décisions, accept to be called lier, accept to be ruined several time, accept to have base and fleet destroyed and all accounts too, *en bref* shut your mouth and say thank you with smile.
(10-04-2017, 02:18 PM)Karlotta Wrote: It's pointless to try and change noobs. They keep coming the way they were. Adapt to them, be prepared for them, change the vets by changing their expectations.
We can do more, as veteran players, as factions with visibility, to transform the newbies into real-Disco players. That's what everybody should do.
Not everyone has to do something to help noobs all the time, but it would be great if some vets and devs stopped doing everything in their power to make noobs as miserable as possible with the following:
-"I should be able to win a 5 vs 1 against 5 noobs"
-"get gud"
-"you cant use numbers/caps to compensate or I'll bully you until submit"
-"you have to obey my lore-breaking commands because I's more official than you and I have our common IRP enemy on skype"
-"you cant do this and you cant do that, not because game mechanics or rules, but because some pros will screw you over if you step on their turf"
It's also mind-boggling how little (with little I mean NOTHING) the dev team does to make it easier to teach noobs lore and game mechanics. Even if you saw noobs as sub-human scum, the superimportant supervets would benefit from that because it keeps noobs in their meddlesome subhuman state less long.
Over the years I've brought this up again and again, I've written bar rumors, ingame help systems, improved server messages, history items.
All it required for devs to do was literally a copy-paste job, or at least say what could be improved if it wasnt good enough.
But they did: Squat.
I wrote more which I think needs to be said, and needed to be said and done years ago, but decided against it because it'll only upset some people into using it as a pretext to ban me again, and it's really more than too late to do anything anymore anyway.
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