[High Priority] Capital Sci data code guns change discussion

[sindroms]

These cap ''codes'' were supposed to be standard guns added to the mod. They were going to be ''tested'' by giving them as goodies to people who found scidata and used it - this was before the fact that the scidata became a valuable commodity sold for billions of credits. Basically they were going to be a teaser.

Then someone had a brain fart later on and decided to use science data for stuff other than cosmetics in the form of trails, engines and event items and unique guns that were a worse clone of existing weapons. I am still rather pissed off that this happened.

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[Nerva Regis]

I don't pvp, but I like having codes on my ship because they are different.

If someone wants to have Codes without the RP hassle because they want to focus on pvp, let them do that. But I would like to see that RP focussed players have the option to use Sci-Data and RP to get them at a discount. ( Yes, I know that qualifying RP as Good is a hassle, but I am sure there can be a minimum threshold established for that)

[Lucas]

So we went from saying "make these a moneysink" to "but waahh I dont want to play the game so make them cost 20x less please" in an era where we have missions, trading and scidata mining to make money?

Grow a pair and play the game to get the items that you want

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Last words are for fools who have not yet said enough.

[Hubjump]

So we went from saying "make these a moneysink" to "but waahh I dont want to play the game so make them cost 20x less please" in an era where we have missions, trading and scidata mining to make money?

Grow a pair and play the game to get the items that you want

Excuse you.

Who ever thought it was a good idea to use pvp as a money sink must've been smoking something really damned strong to not forsee the lack of balance this would cause as not only does it make the weapons far far harder to acquire but it also means that with less people there is less chance it'll be exploited to its greatest potential and you're left with sleeper overpowered weapons and loadouts. Don't get me started on the possible load outs which won't be properly tested for years at the rate of average cap pilots just failing to squeeze these weapons of their full potential. PVP is more dynamic than numbers against a wall and you can only test so much with conventional thinking testers in a CONTROLLED enviroment. All these overpriced weapons do is prolong their balance phase from weeks to years. It's a complete ideological F up. And you should know that. But we all know it's too late as you can't exactly undo this with the money that has already been sunk into it.

Some of the biggest cap code collectors agree, but why disadvantage ones self for some sense of honour, Whilst it exists use these guns. Please just abuse these guns as much as you can to get my point across.
My excuse is that I'm a lazy twat but I've spent hours grinding recently just to try and get the ships and armour I should've had years ago.

All that could be said by the worst possible player and still hold up.

Edit:
I'm sure the devs know they'd have to refund the excess money spent, I'd suggest setting sci data avg price to 3mil and work on refunding from there and either deleting or making the cap codes normal priced. That is the only way to heal this scar, if it continues it'll become even more deformed down the line.

Before anyone puts words in my mouth, I'm exposing the options and not saying they should be deleted.

[Laz]

Purely from a game design perspective, sci-data being used as a non-cosmetic credit sink is literally one of the worst possible game design decisions possible.

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[Shiki]

Local dev man be like: Wait, what do you mean pay to win is not a good idea?

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[Dan.]

So we went from saying "make these a moneysink" to "but waahh I dont want to play the game so make them cost 20x less please" in an era where we have missions, trading and scidata mining to make money?

Grow a pair and play the game to get the items that you want

Totally Agree

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[Lucas]

Disregarding the fact that some Capguns are quite OP (which I haven't said because it has been stated like 10 times on one page if you look through the thread) then I would like to remind people that this system has worked with Snub Codes. There has never been one time where a snub scidata weapon has been outright OP to a point where there was a clear opinion in the community that said so. The only thing I can recall is the TGDWM5K being stronger than Deb's for a while after they were just too bad but other than that there really isn't anything that would have made anyone say "Hey, I think this is a necessary weapon for combat" and as such I think Pay2Win can be avoided when people actually care to look at the codes that have been left in a broken state for way too long

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Last words are for fools who have not yet said enough.

[Hubjump]

Due to the faster pace of snub combat it's harder to identify the finder details. Snub combat cares less about efficiency and god forbid magical desync shots flying who knows where than cap combat does.
Comparing the two when, as a cap player who hasn't felt out the balance of snubs in a very long time, one is broken and the other is far less broken isn't going to get you anywhere.

And sure some weapons are underpowered but that isn't an issue until later because RIGHT NOW you've got op "pay2win" guns actually killing people.

People wouldn't complain about landmines as much if they didn't kill as many people. Bit of an extreme example but phased out trashy guns can come in after the absurd ones have been tuned. If a man has two guns, ones a pellet gun and the other is a 9mm glock you're going to care more about him pointing the 9mm glock than the damned pellet gun. I can't keep making crazy metaphors,scenarios and comparisons you should get the point. Underpowered doesn't justify overpowered.

Apologies if I offended any snub players I have absolutely 0 feel in that field so I don't know how broke it is. But I'll still argue the same if it is.

[Haste]

The main difference between the cap and snub sci data weapons is that the snub ones are actual sidegrades. Sure, they sometimes had a unique combination of stats, but the 'fancier' ones tended to do either abysmal damage or use craploads of energy. If anything they were mostly bad prior to the latest gun balance pass. They're still perfectly fine after the changes, though.

Anyhow, I'm surprised that people in this thread think greater availability of sci data weapons somehow makes them more pay to win. It doesn't. What's the difference between getting Cruiser Blasters with Sci Data and some paper thin roleplay reasoning, or getting them with credits? If anything more 'proliferation' will make it easier to tune these weapons properly as we get more data.

Regardless, I think prices in the 'couple hundred million credits' range are perfectly fine and acceptable. Credit income is at all all-time high right now and people should have something to spend them on. I do believe it's very important that we continue balancing these weapons and make sure they're no better than regular 5-20 million credit NPC-sold weapons.

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