Generic IDs - Indie Traders/Smugglers

[cmfalconer]

Interesting perspective Blodo. Might I pose this query then.

I had (had as in he retired) a trader who was mostly lawful, an independant, who flew EVERYWHERE. made several trips to Malta, and more-than-several trips to crete with "toys for the kiddies".

Now Yes, when he left these hot-beds of unlawfulism, he had a hold full of these Hispanian's finest wares bound for the core systems.

Should this individual still be sporting a TraderID? I had no tag, and worked to keep it that way for the 125+ hours I had him tootling around Sirius. Or should he have gotten his SmugglerID and been the object of scorn and ridicule by the over-ambitious denizens of the Core systems (you know who i'm talking about).

$.02

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[Kuraine]

I would personally have the smuggler ID removed, but since it won't be, I opted to nerf it slightly. If we're going to nerf the Trader ID, then the Smuggler ID will need to be nerfed also, or it will get spammed by every trade whore in existence simply for its ability to "land" at lawful and unlawful bases. Have to keep them balanced.

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Kuraine (Zoner tagged Trader)
Ravenholm (Zoner tagged Zoner Destroyer)
Bill Mason[Arms.Dealer] (Zoner tagged Arms Dealer)
LR-Drax (Liberty Rogue tagged Cruiser)
LR-Dravis (Liberty Rogue tagged VHF)
[RHA]Wilhelm.Wettin (Red Hessian tagged VHF)
[GC]-Ai.Takeda (Golden Chrysanthemum tagged VHF/Bomber)

[Spear]

Yes, but Spear does that mean that smugglers that aren't Junkers are something unheard of? Because somehow I'm not up to that thought. Anyone can be a smuggler, as long as he has friends in the right areas, and the smuggler ID allows just that. My Junker smuggler isn't a trueborn Junker, he's an eccentric from Rheinland who hung around Junkers for long enough to get acquainted and earn some friends. Hence the smuggler ID as opposed to the Junker one. I can clearly see untagged smugglers making their way through Sirius just as easily.

Well under the current rules you have no alternative but to use a Smuggler ID, I still see it as unnecessary in terms of RP. An ID that marks you out as a little bit of a chancer.. Smugglers shouldnt be drawing attention to themselves by having something that says "I AM A SMUGGLER, WOO HOO!" on board! :D

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=LSF=

[tfmachad]

In my opinion the problem is not with the ID itself, it is the fact that 95% of the traders in disco are independent, that is not in anyway realistic, I would imagine (in my non-scientific opinion) that the proportion should be much closer to 75%affiliated 25% non-affiliated. As it is now, there is very little rp going on with traders because they are all independent, a huge portion of the factional rp is gone, because so few people want to use trader faction id's.

It's a matter of incentives, to be honest. You can't blame people for using the generic IDs when the faction IDs promote a lot of restrictions (ZoIs, available routes, possible business partners, aimed attacks by specific groups) and little to none incentives. Not only that, if a player is serious enough to get through the hassle of correctly tagging and IDing a trader ship, he will be turned down by the lack of reasonable (both in profit and in sense) routes he is able to do. Right now, the game doesn't provide much lucrative and sound routes for faction traders to explore. So, you decide to tag and ID your trader ship after a company, just to discover that there isn't a good route for that company. Not only that, trading is a boring business most of the time. One way to put a little excitement to it is by changing the scenery, something that isn't supported when you're trying to portray a company with a specific niche.

You can say, "If only it wasn't the vast majority of traders as independents, but only a few." And then I ask, "Who decides?" If it's more interesting for one person to be generic, then perhaps it is for everyone. Unless there are attractive RP routes (a situation that will fortunately be corrected by the group dedicated to the trade routes) there's little to none incentive for people to tag and ID their traders after a certain company. And I'm talking about players with some RP concern. Either way, you'll always have power traders, unless you make them go faction (which the cargo size limitation will do). Not that this will force them to RP anything, it will just make their ships "prettier".

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Meet the Kriegers - The story of a family and of two men that shared more than just a name
Fantasmas de la Nube Siniestra
I Mon'Star: The Strange Case of Elizabeth Wallace

[Blodo]

cmfalconer: I believe he should've gotten a Smuggler ID. I've flown way over 200 hours on my train, which has had a Smuggler ID since the very beginning. Never really had a problem, only got caught smuggling a single time. Although NY is an ocean of piss, even then nobody really could or did try to destroy me, even though I dock on Manhattan regularly. And it's not due to "fast docking lol" either, factions treat Smuggler ID like Trader ID (the proper way to do it) and stupid untagged fighters sometimes do yell in exasperation, but nothing ever comes out of that. They are bound by the rules just like anyone else.

Spear: Except you miss the fact that in RP you cannot just "scan and read ID". The ID is there for char RP identification, in this case to solidify that this persona is a shady and possibly untrustworthy to lawful characters. It is NOT a actual IFF that characters ingame would ever be able to see, the reputation tag plays that function and is recognised by the HUD accordingly. Technically my transport is just like any other one when I pass nearby, unless of course I have contraband onboard. The Smuggler ID, like Joe said earlier, to you indicates nothing else but some suspicion with no proof.

[El Nino]

Here are some of my thoughts on the subject.

Generic traders should be limited to freighters only. Sort of Freelancers, buzing about... the notion for 3600 cargo is also acceptable as atleast the power traders might not use it as willingly.

Smugglers should be limited to smuggler ship (as in not the advanced train), in turn they would be the only ones allowed to smuggle. It should be writen somewhere as a server rule that a trader must not by any mean smuggle. As right now with traders smuggling there is no real need for a smuggler ID. Smuggler ID, vastly improves the roleplaying part of your trading. Suppose a RM stops your smuggler ID'd ship, scanns your cargo a little, sees everything is in order but still suspects you that something is amiss. Smuggler ID reflects that you've done some smuggling, that the LAW has an eye on you. In reality probably all house police would have records of all smugglers ever captured on scans. This ID shows exactly that you were once scanned, and found with contraband. You are to be examined at length for possible contraband... but if you don't have it you're free to proceed.

It should be nerfed just as much as the Traders ID, otherwise it would be overused much like the trader ID is right now...

Much good on the subject can be read in the New ID proposal...

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My primary char: Jose El Nino - Corsair Elder captain of the SS Greenhawk

Currently Inactive due to pursuit of life long dreams, will be back...*edited* As promised am back.

[Culebra]

I was on another character that had a smuggler ID and no IFF. A KNF officer told me to leave Kusari becuase they did not like smugglers and I was lucky that I didnt have any goods.

In RP i tried to explain that I was not a smuggler. His response in RP was well you have a smuggler ID so you are a smuggler. I guess my ship really does have a sign on it that says I SMUGGLE GOODS.

[Blodo]

Just remember guys that too many rules is not a good thing either... good luck enforcing the "no smuggling of trader IDs" in a non ridiculous way. Say someone with trader ID happens to have 1 unit of cardamine onboard, does that qualify as smuggling? If it does, and someone gets sanctioned for it then it's a completely retarded rule, kinda like the one that "Halt" is not a demand.

[Sassafras]

I love my smuggler ID. The unlawfuls leave me alone and in fact we become fast friends after I give them a few hits of Cardi to make their day more pleasant.

Also, the smuggler ID is great for RP purposes. Nothing more exciting then being chased and swearing at each other across multiple systems by the LPI, LN, or RM especially when you're a known scoundrel.

And my smuggler ship is routinely destroyed by said lawful factions on a regular basis. Trading is as much fun as watching paint dry, and so smuggling gets my vote every time.

Sass

[BaconSoda]

Trevelyan, I think you know my opinion on this, but for those who don't, here it is:

I think the main reasons that people don't use the Faction Trader IDs are:

A. Political Ramifications - People don't want to have to RP responsibility. If a Hessian catches a Trader, it's 2 million, but if a Hessian catches Daumann or Kruger, then it's a lot more than a random trader. Same thing with the enemies of certain pirate factions, like Unioners-Republican, LWB-Synth Foods, Blood Dragons-Samura, etc.

Now, on a different matter, there are also shippers like Gateway and Kishiro who deal with political RP. Gateway has to deal with being the underdog of Bretonia, with no enemies, but also less allies. In this way, they only have limited RP potential with pirates, but a much larger RP with police.

People don't want to be responsible for things like this. They don't want to roleplay a political quagmire. It's not fun sometimes....

B. Not so much profit. - Umm, what? No, this is a myth. I know from Gateway that almost every faction has lucrative trade routes. Some more than others, but they're there. The only exception to this might be Samura, who is, well, basically not very well off....

C. Research - No one wants to do research about their faction. Who actually wants to find out about what their faction does before playing it? Oh, wait, I thought this was an RP server....

Well, that's why I think people don't use them. How do I think the split should be? 75% Faction - 25% Indie, like Zelot said, but we can't force anyone to do these things. We can't force people to roleplay their traders like they roleplay their military characters, but we can't do anything about that. I know you roleplay your individual trader, Trevelyan, and I know that I roleplay my independent Smuggler, but I we also roleplay our faction trader characters, and that is something I would like to see more people do, especially since there is so much they could do...

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[8:32:45 PM] Dusty Lens: Oh no, let me get that. Hello? Oh it's my grandma. She says to be roleplay.
[12:49:19 AM] Elgatodiablo: You know its nice that you have all that proof and all, Bacon... but I just don't believe you.