And Tena, if Geb has BS size, BS shield, almost BS armor, i really fail to see the logic by witch it should have a thruster. So either it's thruster should be removed, or it's speed reduced to 115, so that it can still outrun the battleships, but allow GBs/cruisers/BCs to escape.
Quote:2. despite the geb having cruiser turrets, there are 20 of them.
18, not 20.
On the topic of the BHG bomber... yes, it is overpowered. We had four Fighters (two neph and two bastets) against two BHG bombers earlier today in delta, and it took us almost half an hour to kill both of them. Explain to me how any battleship would survive half an hour against two bombers focusing on it? Once more, fighters are an utter failure as escort craft.
Quote:GB < GB - Ye right, They're the same except that Order one does 800 and BHG one 750 hull damage.
Yet you have access to Zoner weaponry. Zoner GB turrets do more damage than Order ones do, 850 a shot.
Quote:And Tena, if Geb has BS size, BS shield, almost BS armor, i really fail to see the logic by witch it should have a thruster. So either it's thruster should be removed, or it's speed reduced to 115, so that it can still outrun the battleships, but allow GBs/cruisers/BCs to escape.
With no thruster, it doesnt matter how much armor or shielding it has, it will still get utterly raped. Look at how bad the battlecruisers without thrusters are, they're sitting targets, and even those are less than half as big as the Geb.
Now perhaps it needs to become a battleship instead of a battlecruiser as was suggested before, but that would entail a full conversion to heavier armor and battleship weaponry, which would be even worse for you guys in the end considering how many Gebs there are.
' Wrote:The Mako should be good to go once the hitbox is fixed. It and the Mako are pretty evenly matched, but are different enough to make a battle interesting. Both have their own strengths and weaknesses. And the Mako kills Gebs pretty quick - something the Bullhead fails at.
The Bullhead kills other cruisers/destroyers dead fairly consistently. However, I would look into giving more of the turrets a 360-firing arc. Right now only three of them can fire backwards. 5 or 6 might be a workable option. If that seems too much, then give it more hull. In any case, the Geb will still wipe the mat with a Bullhead, largely due to the Geb having a BS shield. How would the Geb fare without the BS shield? Don't really know, but maybe Tenacity could give us his thoughts on that. The Bullhead turns and strafes lazily, but it is a battlecruiser.
The Thresher is awesome - in the right situation. It kills gbs efficiently. It is very difficult to hit at a distance, due to its slender profile. And it has the added advantage of having terrific firing arcs on it's hardpoints - all of them fire at 360 degrees. It turns quick and tight. That said, it's power plant is on the wimpy end of the spectrum. Nor will the 8 turrets scare off too many other vessels of the same class. If you don't keep distance between yourself (in the BH dessie) and your target, you're slag before you can say "lolcaps ftw". Definitely a support role vessel. Doesn't really need fixing. I did once request that it be given "near Kusari destroyer" maneuverability stats, but that suggestion was decisively shot down.
Turrets:
BH Primary (BS): speed - 810 m/s, damage - 3800 pts, energy consumption - 10k
Order Primary (BS): speed - 800 m/s, damage - 4100 pts, energy consumption - 10.5k
BH Cruiser: speed - 1050 m/s, damage - 2300 pts, energy consumption - 8k
Order Cruiser: speed -1000 m/s, damage - 2500 pts, energy consumption -7.5k
Order BS turrets consume more energy than the BH counterpart, but unleashes 300 pts more damage. I suggest that the BH BS turret lose that 10 m/s speed advantage (which is trivial) and bring them up to 3950 pts. Energy consumption would be increased to 10.5k.
Cruiser turrets seem to be ok to me for the most part. Maybe the BH turret's damage output could be brought up to 2350 - if the 50 m/s speed advantage were removed.
every ship has its dis-advantage, let's face it, not every ship it's perfect, suck it up buddy.
for ex:
Osiris has small size, a little more armour than BHG BS, but it only has 12 turrets and only 10 can fire forward, BHG BS has 14 turrets, but with weaker armour, a slightly weaker gun.
(if you complain about Mako has a armour that's too weak, let's switch the armour stats and turret number of Osiris and Mako, i am going to so happy and alot of Mako captain is gonna whine)
Plz dont whine about the Geb, it has the suckest firing arc in the game (it's not just suck, it's suckke than suck), so it's fair to use a BS shield and heavy armour to compensate it's size, and firing arc
' Wrote:18, not 20.
On the topic of the BHG bomber... yes, it is overpowered. We had four Fighters (two neph and two bastets) against two BHG bombers earlier today in delta, and it took us almost half an hour to kill both of them. Explain to me how any battleship would survive half an hour against two bombers focusing on it? Once more, fighters are an utter failure as escort craft.
BHG bomber is not overpowered, it's perfectly balanced for a light bomber. It may be way too big from the side, but in return it has 1 additional class 9 gun slot.
' Wrote:Yet you have access to Zoner weaponry. Zoner GB turrets do more damage than Order ones do, 850 a shot.
With no thruster, it doesnt matter how much armor or shielding it has, it will still get utterly raped. Look at how bad the battlecruisers without thrusters are, they're sitting targets, and even those are less than half as big as the Geb.
Now perhaps it needs to become a battleship instead of a battlecruiser as was suggested before, but that would entail a full conversion to heavier armor and battleship weaponry, which would be even worse for you guys in the end considering how many Gebs there are.
Yes Tena, we have, but we'd prefer to use our own weaponry. Besides, Zoner GB turrets use ~22.5% more power then the Order GB ones, while BHG and Order both use the same.
About the BCs, this is not true. For example, the Lib BC doesn't have it, and it's uber if you know a good loadout for it and are skilled in it. However, if you fail on both of those conditions, you'll be raped by pretty much everything.
If you don't believe me, ask anyone who had the courage to attack, or was foolish enough not to run from LNS-Freedom, and see what happened to them. So far, it was only killed once, and it was by a OC GS, 4 Barghesters, 1 Falcata and 1 Sabre, but even with that only 1 Barghester and Falcata survived.
' Wrote:BHG bomber is not overpowered, it's perfectly balanced for a light bomber. It may be way too big from the side, but in return it has 1 additional class 9 gun slot.
Doesnt change the fact that there is still an issue with fighters being effective escorts for capships against bombers. I dont like to nerf anyone, but fighters are definitely calling for a buff right now, because if my fighter cannot kill your bomber before you can kill my team's capship, then I might as well not even participate in the battle.
Fighter = Fighter - Manta is indeed fast and agile, but it has weak powerplant and armor, and it's huge. not as huge as a nepth, especially the front profile of Manta
Bomber = Bomber - BHG bomber, again, might be fast and agile, but it's giant target unless it is flying directly at you under 0 degrees angle. What tena said
GS/GB < GB - Hathor will rape both Orca and BHG GS with ease. then explain how i use a Rogue GB kill a RM Cruiser in 4.82? aglity and size it's GB's life
Cruiser = Cruiser - True.
BC < BC - True.
BS < BS - True.
Faction Weapon
BHG-------Order
Fighter > Fighter - This is true, it's easier to hit with BHG weapons, but Mantas powerplant doesn't really allow their extensive usage. no need, as long as it's enough for jousting, otherwise no fighter powerplant is enough for constant fire for long period of time
Bomber = Bomber - True.
GB < GB - Ye right, They're the same except that Order one does 800 and BHG one 750 hull damage.
' Wrote:Doesnt change the fact that there is still an issue with fighters being effective escorts for capships against bombers. I dont like to nerf anyone, but fighters are definitely calling for a buff right now, because if my fighter cannot kill your bomber before you can kill my team's capship, then I might as well not even participate in the battle.
This is a 'cap' discussion thread. As far as i'm concerned, only REAL bombers in this mod are Fafnir and Barghest.
And again, skill is a major factor. 4 excelent RoS fighters will tear two bombers apart in under 5 minutes.
@X
Red marks:
1. From the side it's bigger then Nepth, but from front it is a bit smaller.
2. Tena was talking about fighter vs. bomber, so it has no relevance to this.
3. '4.82' - Do you even listen to yourself? Rogue GB could have killed a battleship in 4.82. I know it, i've done it.
4. Manta's strenght is to attack from behind/sides, it's not good at jousting because of it's size/armor.
It's my understanding from Jinx, that when I have tested the changed Mako hitbox, and is satsfied with the result, I sshould send it to him for testing on the dev server. When it has passed the devs testing, the Mako hitbox will be pushed out to clients thru the DSupdate functionality built into the Discovery Mod.
So hopefully sometime next week, it should be online, according to what I saw in the old threads as replies to my inquiries to timeline and procedure for a fix.
Cpt. Miller, of the BHG|Core vessel "Miller's Draft"
Out of bats, Out of bots, Out of torps - Down to harsh language...
' Wrote:This is a 'cap' discussion thread. As far as i'm concerned, only REAL bombers in this mod are Fafnir and Barghest.
And again, skill is a major factor. 4 excelent RoS fighters will tear two bombers apart in under 5 minutes.
@X
Red marks:
1. From the side it's bigger then Nepth, but from front it is a bit smaller.
2. Tena was talking about fighter vs. bomber, so it has no relevance to this.
3. '4.82' - Do you even listen to yourself? Rogue GB could have killed a battleship in 4.82. I know it, i've done it.
4. Manta's strenght is to attack from behind/sides, it's not good at jousting because of it's size/armor.
/Signed
But I still say change the bomber's weapons and their settings. Boosting the fighter's gunspeed will drastically change the fighter's fairing against EVERY class in the game.
' Wrote:This is a 'cap' discussion thread. As far as i'm concerned, only REAL bombers in this mod are Fafnir and Barghest.
And again, skill is a major factor. 4 excelent RoS fighters will tear two bombers apart in under 5 minutes.
@X
Red marks:
1. From the side it's bigger then Nepth, but from front it is a bit smaller.
2. Tena was talking about fighter vs. bomber, so it has no relevance to this.
3. '4.82' - Do you even listen to yourself? Rogue GB could have killed a battleship in 4.82. I know it, i've done it.
4. Manta's strenght is to attack from behind/sides, it's not good at jousting because of it's size/armor.
2. yes, it's relevent BHG bomber has huge advantage on against fighter, while Order fighter it's a rock
3. i am just proofing the point Aglity and size is almost everything for GB
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