Corsair - Zoner

[Jihadjoe]

It'd be excellent for the zoners and junkers in particular if they were able to set diplomacy on a station-by-station basis. Denying the OC docking rights in theta, while leaving them able to dock on FP6 and FP10, etc.

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[Vladimir]

[51st] - There is no good reason for MND ships to raid Gamma. The end.

But the sirius-wide zois are always good idea:cool:Time for sairs to raid IDF :cool:

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[Tatsuya]

I should climb down from my respective high horse and realise that I'm making myself look extremely stupid.

I have an honest question.

When you make that post from time to time. Do you suffer from memory leakage?

[Jeremy Hunter]

This is incredibly funny. Really it is. Nothing quite changes. Maybe the names of the involved people change, and the motivation for picking one side over the other also changes. Maybe some of the involved people are much the same people as last time, just with a different agenda this time artound, which may or may not have something to do with spiting Zelot.

Who freakin' knows.

Truth is all the sides of this little dispute are petty and pathetic. Both sideshave got into this strange male-apendage waving competition, to determine who is the more manly, while also crying about the other side like a bunch of little girls.
Zoners - You're refusing to acknowlege something that's actually a problem. Go make a Corsair and have fun chasing every last guy who attacks Crete to whichever of the nearest freeports they feel like. I mean, Gamma really is completely surrounded by open-use bases. More so than anywhere else in sirius. It's a bit frustrating. I wonder how you'd feel if Corfu was turned into a hunter base, FP9 an OC base, and FP5 a hessian base. I bet the zoners would be crying then, but honestly that's the way it often feels for the Corsairs.

Furthermore, you've allowed yourselves to get stirred up into militant action by a group of people who's agenda is basically making a mess for Zelot. It's personal. Nice huh? Infact this specific group of people just loves the drama. the more the better. If people are crying, they're drinking the sweet tear-nectar. Many of these people were flying for the corsair side of the conflict in it's previous incarnation. The reason for the side-switch is just an arbitrary case of who they favour in OORP terms this time around.
Corsairs - You're incredibly stupid. You're trying to strong-arm a solution to a problem that can't ever be solved. Why can't it be solved? Because doing it would screw the Zoners. The mod puts them in a totally untenable position. They can't FR5 any and all outcasts/hunters/hessians who stage from FP9/5/Corfu, because the paperwork would be obscene and you can't catch them all. The Zoners can't go full hostile to those groups to prevent them docking either, because that would cause problems in places which have nothing to do with the corsairs. For example, FP2, FP10, FP6... The list goes on. YOU CANNOT ASK THEM TO GO HOSTILE TO THE PEOPLE WHO ATTACK YOU, BECAUSE IT IS IMPOSSIBLE.

I sympathise with your position, I really do, Liberty's full of 'neutral' stations as well, and it's mindbendingly annoying to just chase every last pirate you find to Rochester, Beaumont, FP2, etc. However, telling the junkers to go hostile to the OC would completely screw their roleplay.
Hessians - Bunch of opportunist, poop-stirring, annoyances. You can see the storm coming a mile off, sure. but hey, causing trouble for other players is cool right? Right? yeah. lets raid every day! god I love that attitude.

OC - The only group who's indies can match the stupidity of Corsair indies.

GMG - Just because you finally have something to do, doesn't mean you should be joint raiding gamma with the Outcasts.

[51st] - There is no good reason for MND ships to raid Gamma. The end.
None of you are taking a position which is sane. Every involved group is being mindblowingly stupid. I laugh at all of you. Frankly, yeah, I'm gonna fly in this pathetic war. A war which was spawned by dong-waving, made worse by personal issues. But the only reason I'm gonna fly is because I like shooting stuff. I'll fly for whichever side needs the numbers at the time.

The only thing I'm gonna say is that all the people in leadership positions in this, climb down from their respective high horses and realise that they're making themselves look extremely stupid.

Edit: Fran told me to list his Mando as an annoyance. So, Fran's merc is an annoyance. Happy now Fran?

I agree completely with Joe.

This is why the SCRA| only docks on freeports when we have to log off immediately for RL problems. We base from, surprisingly, Omega 52.

:sleep:such a strange concept, using our own bases.

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May you ever walk in the Light, Shizune.

[Dusty Lens]

Zoners - You're refusing to acknowlege something that's actually a problem. Go make a Corsair and have fun chasing every last guy who attacks Crete to whichever of the nearest freeports they feel like. I mean, Gamma really is completely surrounded by open-use bases. More so than anywhere else in sirius. It's a bit frustrating. I wonder how you'd feel if Corfu was turned into a hunter base, FP9 an OC base, and FP5 a hessian base. I bet the zoners would be crying then, but honestly that's the way it often feels for the Corsairs.

Have you ever read the bulk of the demands which have oft and often levied at the Zoners as their pathway to peace? They're uniformly preposterous and sit on a backdrop of continued attacks against their persons regardless of actions taken.

The difference between a Hessian launching from Freeport 5, which is something of a myth propagated by insistence, and a Hessian launching from Omega 11 is barely a few minutes of travel time. The Zoners are viewed as soft targets of opportunity, marked by the division and generally breathtakingly poor decisions wrought by their higher echelons and a flotilla of opportunistic indies or random forum voices.

The Zoners have been getting pirated by people using their bases since day one.

Furthermore, you've allowed yourselves to get stirred up into militant action by a group of people who's agenda is basically making a mess for Zelot. It's personal. Nice huh? Infact this specific group of people just loves the drama. the more the better. If people are crying, they're drinking the sweet tear-nectar. Many of these people were flying for the corsair side of the conflict in it's previous incarnation. The reason for the side-switch is just an arbitrary case of who they favour in OORP terms this time around.

Totally inaccurate. The TBH and Corsairs in general initiated the bad times. The Zoners responded in kind with guns. That was seen as something as a surprise and resulted in a lot of intense Q_Q. The entire reason for this thread beginning was a sort of shocked question concerning if Zoners shouldn't all be sanctioned for defending themselves.

The persons you mention jumped on the bandwagon well after it was sent rolling down hill.

The Zoners were supposed to be a soft target that could be harassed as a frustration release measure. If they banned everyone from every freeport, again, the Reavers, RR, Hessians, GMG, Outcasts, BHG and what have you would see little more than a 3-4 minute increase in the amount of time it took to reach Gamma. World changing to be sure.

But, to get to the meat of it. My annoyance with your post Joe is that it does suffer from memory leakage. From issuing KOS orders which result in mass LN/Goldwing gankages to telling the Junkers to put themselves in difficult situations because of base abuse to gank flights with the ROS. God the flipping ROS. Let alone the HF and any other litany of sorrows wrought on fights or groups that didn't need the unnecessary pressure to have a good time.

Maybe I've just been around for too long and I remember too many transgressions followed by long soulful posts condemning those same actions. Maybe I feel that the PM I sent to Bluespawn in response to the same feeling like there's a lot of personal hatred going on around here strikes more closely to the heart of the matter.

There's a crucial distinction between hatred of a group, or person and the hatred of a image which I feel is important to elaborate on as it pertains not only to the scenario we're seeing unfold right now but also to the Omicroners/Zoners at large before and the Junkers before that and other groups and other groups and other groups before that.

Whining.

The Corsairs are whining. A lot. Their whines are totally unjustified. Their whines are tiresome. You can easily and quickly acquire a litany of sorrows that fly directly in the faces of an equally robust cornicopia of chest beating and actions which evoked the current situation they face.

The Corsairs current, extremely pathetic I might add, Q_Q storm and agendas being worked on the forum have earned them the ire of the floating forum population. The group of homeless players who don't follow any particular allegiance such as myself and those persons who have rather intimately tied themselves to a certain player clique.

Nothing draws ire, contempt and broad based laughter in this forum like the perception of being a bunch of sobbing Q_Qing gits. Nothing draws admiration like going "Well, this sucks. But we're going to deal."

If you lose with that attitude you've lost little. When you win with that attitude you win a lot.

When you forumlancer, sanctionlancer and Q_Qlancer you're lost everything and people will delight in trumping you. Especially if it means that something better might come along to replace you. Because you're not fun, not fun in a way that doesn't enforce the idea that they don't want to play with you, but not fun in a way that suggests the best course of action is to beat the lame out of you.

-Dusty

But what I do know is that a long grocery list of how stupid everyone is doesn't resolve anything and, frankly, calls into question the ability to see a quality remedy to internal division issued by the admin team.

Grrr.

[Linkus]

It'd be excellent for the zoners and junkers in particular if they were able to set diplomacy on a station-by-station basis. Denying the OC docking rights in theta, while leaving them able to dock on FP6 and FP10, etc.

This would probably solve things y'know.
All it would take is for the NPC factions to be split up.

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Facilitating the rise of robotics since 0 A.D.

[Vladimir]

The difference between a Hessian launching from Freeport 5, which is something of a myth propagated by insistence, and a Hessian launching from Omega 11 is barely a few minutes of travel time.

Funny thing is - i honestly don't remember launching from o41. Except when i log a ship and realize that it died while landing on fp5 to refill - without any sairs around of course - last, which usually means i need to go o11 first to load novas and only THEN go gamma, which is even worse. But ye, hurr durr fr5 RHA-RF or else we kill you, signed, angry sairs.

And since when raiding gamma is something special and aimed at causing troubles? Joe, you're just mad. Sure i wouldn't mind fp5 being turned into hessian base, but high horse my arse and nothing at all would change.

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[Rodnas]

Dusty, the thing is people REALLY stopped coming to gamma right between the time window were the freeports were blocked and FP9 is occupied by everybody and their momma. People ARE that lazy that 2-3 mins more travel time keeps tehm from going to Gamma.

The others who still came were infact the less lulzy factions/groups which were never a problem....

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Read about: The Benitez Familia and Trueno Benitez

---Not available for any disco stuff these days(and for an extended period of time to come, too ---

[Dane Summers]

GMG - Just because you finally have something to do, doesn't mean you should be joint raiding gamma with the Outcasts.

To my knowledge, GMG Official has not gotten involved in any way.

Their too busy making money, and chasing out pirates and OC's from the sigmas.

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[Lucky Luke]

Hessians - Bunch of opportunist, poop-stirring, annoyances. You can see the storm coming a mile off, sure. but hey, causing trouble for other players is cool right? Right? yeah. lets raid every day! god I love that attitude.

OC - The only group who's indies can match the stupidity of Corsair indies.

[51st] - There is no good reason for MND ships to raid Gamma. The end.

Bunch of opportunist, poop-stirring, annoyances. --- I guess that fits well on a lot of us who play on this server. Wheter it is in-game or in forums. There are more ways of making the smelly stuff splash all around you. We've seen this kind of raiding in different groups over the years. Both Official factions and Un-official. In the end, it all comes down to the fact that most of us here like to pew.

The only group who's indies can match the stupidity of Corsair indies. --- Yeah, coz we never see any LN-indies do things like that. :blink:Or sairs... or Order... or... the list goes on. I see things every day that make me laugh/cry. But I often try to have a chat with these guys, and explain things. And I know that many experienced players in Alpha and Gamma do this too. Big KUDOS to all of you! You know who you are. The rest of us also have a responsibility to help out. I know that the official factions have a lot on their table, but the least one could ask from officials, is that they interact with the indies. I have NEVER been approached by a member of an official faction, who's encouraged me to join. NEVER! And I've played a lot. If these indies can be absorbed into the community, I think we'd see less of this. I mean... How are the gonna know, if no one tells them? Read the server rules you say. OK! Hand on heart. How long had each one of you play here before you actually looked there? I know it took a while for me.

There is no good reason for MND ships to raid Gamma. The end. --- I don't agree. The RP of 51st is that we take the war to our enemy. I can't say for certain if Corsairs and Rheinland are at actual war, but the fact remains that Sairs come to Rheinland for pirating. Sometimes also with Caps. Our mission is to keep enemys of Rheinland occupied on their own turf. That way bringing relief to Rheinland. So, I do think we have good reason to raid Gamma. Why don't we raid the Hessians then, you ask? Because that's an internal affair best handled by the RM. The Hessians serve our purpose as enemies to the Corsairs. And if 51st are to stay the hell away from Gamma, maybe we could enjoy not seeing LNS-ships in Frankfurt.

I'm not trying to make the situation worse here in any way. On the contrary. If I can help, then I will. But I really think that a good cleaning in front of our own doors is required before we go ahead and throw mud at each other. Things will only improve if we actually do something about them.

/Luke