Silvan sat and listened to all that was being said and several times thought to speak, but Things seemed to be taking positive results from the other, presumably more experienced, Zoner representatives discussions so Silvan kept his quiet. Maybe his input as the Rep of the nine will be needed soon, until that time or a time he disagreed with something that was said, he would remain silent.
So Silvan contented himself with grabbing an apple from the food table
' Wrote:"Si senor, lets move on, I am sure there will be more than enough time to go back over any details before everyone signs this."
"Lovely. I see that this is your current proposition:
Quote:3. The Napo cloud is to be considered as Corsair sovereign territory, and Corsair laws are to be recognized throughout Theta ' except on the Port and the surrounding 5K of space. The Empire reserves the right to enforce Corsair Laws within the 5K of space only with regard to the apprehension of recognized Corsair enemies endeavoring to avoid Corsair justice.
"Corsair Enemies" being defined as all those shown as "enemy" on the info card (Outcasts, Hessians, GMG, Blood Dragons, GC, Mollies).
Since the good neighbour policy prohibits any staging, there will be no need for Corsairs to chase anyone into what you propose is sovereign territory. Or at least, that is how I see it? Since people may not retreat to our station after conducting an operation, as I understand it, or we will endeavour to revoke their docking permissions, so I see this as un-needed.
Either way, in the interests of us keeping trade somewhat more open, and people feeling secure enough to trade originally with Freeport 9, so that we may then trade with others, I think putting the entire system under Corsair control would be detrimental to both our economies in this sense.
I propose that the Napo cloud be considered solely Corsair sovereign territory, and that you be allowed to maintain an un-dockable defensive structure. Like weapons platforms or a stationary capital ship defense or something like that. I am unsure of your defensive procedures.
I also propose that Freeport 9 and 5k surrounding it, Corfu Station and 5k surrounding it, and Omicron 74 be recognised as solely Zoner sovereign space.
For all other space in Omicron Theta, I propose an agreement that it is uncontested territory, neutral, and essentially lawless space.
In effect, I wish to change it to the following wording:
Quote:2)
a) The Corsair Empire shall recognize Omicron 74 and everything contained within, Freeport 9 and 5k of space surrounding it, and Corfu Base and 5k of space surrounding it, to be the sovereign territory of the Zoners, with their laws applying within.
b) The Omicroners, Freeport 9 and Corfu station shall recognize the Napo Cloud, Omicron Gamma and Omicron 91 as the sovereign territory of the Corsair Empire, with their laws applying within.
c) All other territory within Omicron Theta, shall be considered uncontested, and for all purposes neutral territory, and be considered essentially lawless.
3) The Corsair Empire is permitted to maintain, at the expense of the Empire itself, weapons platforms and defensive undockable structures in the Napo cloud, for the purpose of protecting the Omicron Gamma jump-hole.
Now, the question is, is this agreeable to, by the Corsairs? For I feel, it is the only thing we should have any disagreements on, in the contract?" Coen sighed. He needed some water.
"Excuse me for a moment Elders, I am going to grab some water." Coen stood up and went to the refreshment table for some water. His throat was parched from all the talk.
"While recognition of O-74 as well as 5k around Corfu and Freeport 9 is no issue at all, there are some other things in there that are unacceptable to the Corsair nation.
First lets look at this.."
Sephardi highlighted a section of the proposal on the screen.
Quote:c) All other territory within Omicron Theta, shall be considered uncontested, and for all purposes neutral territory, and be considered essentially lawless.
A lawless system adjacent to the Corsair homeworld is unacceptable to the Elders, call it what you wish, in terms of whose terriroty it is, but the Corsairs will not have contraband run through the area, and hostile forces massing.
The second issue is that of your comments here, if I read them back incorrectly, please feel free to speak up.
Quote:Since the good neighbour policy prohibits any staging, there will be no need for Corsairs to chase anyone into what you propose is sovereign territory. Or at least, that is how I see it? Since people may not retreat to our station after conducting an operation, as I understand it, or we will endeavour to revoke their docking permissions, so I see this as un-needed.
The Corsair empire must insist on reserving the right to chase criminals who have attacked our people into the No Fire Zone. To often have our enemies sought refuge on Port 9 after attacks. Even with the "Good Neighbor Policy" Zoners will not be patrolling all the time, and we will not allow those who have fled after attacks to use Port 9 as sanctuary, no fire zone or not.
As such I would propose this wording."
Quote:2)
a) The Corsair Empire shall recognize Omicron 74 and everything contained within, Freeport 9 and 5k of space surrounding it, and Corfu Base and 5k of space surrounding it, to be the sovereign territory of the Zoners, with their laws applying within. This does not exclude other recognized Zoner territories.
b) The Omicroners, Freeport 9 and Corfu station shall recognize the Napo Cloud, Omicron Gamma and Omicron 91 as the sovereign territory of the Corsair Empire, with their laws applying within. This does not exclude other recognized Corsair territories.
c) All other territory within Omicron Theta, shall be considered uncontested, and for all purposes neutral territory, the Corsair Empire reserves the right to enforce contraband laws, as well as act in military defense of Corsair borders in this area.
d) The Corsair Empire reserves the right to chase fleeing military targets into the No Fire Zones around Port 9 and Corfu. This action will be avoided, but can be authorized the ranking Corsair on the scene.
3) The Corsair Empire is permitted to maintain, at the expense of the Empire itself, weapons platforms and defensive undockable structures in the Napo cloud, for the purpose of protecting the Omicron Gamma jump-hole.
After giving proper time for reading, the old man looked up, "That is what would be acceptable to the Elders."
' Wrote:"While recognition of O-74 as well as 5k around Corfu and Freeport 9 is no issue at all, there are some other things in there that are unacceptable to the Corsair nation.
First lets look at this.."
Sephardi highlighted a section of the proposal on the screen.
A lawless system adjacent to the Corsair homeworld is unacceptable to the Elders, call it what you wish, in terms of whose terriroty it is, but the Corsairs will not have contraband run through the area, and hostile forces massing.
The second issue is that of your comments here, if I read them back incorrectly, please feel free to speak up.
The Corsair empire must insist on reserving the right to chase criminals who have attacked our people into the No Fire Zone. To often have our enemies sought refuge on Port 9 after attacks. Even with the "Good Neighbor Policy" Zoners will not be patrolling all the time, and we will not allow those who have fled after attacks to use Port 9 as sanctuary, no fire zone or not.
As such I would propose this wording."
After giving proper time for reading, the old man looked up, "That is what would be acceptable to the Elders."
Coen returned to the table. His thirst was quenched. He was glad Silvan had put in the refreshments table. It allowed one to get quick food and drink, as well as stretch their legs. He squinted his eyes and opened them wide again, and then he looked at the counter-proposal by Elder Sephardi, and began to read, making notes in his head.
"Hmm. So I see.
The inviolability of our Freeport space has been paramount in our history for a long while. Offering one faction the chance to chase criminals back into it defeats our rather neutral stance. I fear giving into you, in this instance, would leave us open to making concessions to other factions. More and more, until this Freeport is run by everyone else except us.
I am more than willing to offer a one week turnaround at maximum, at minimum 24 hours or even less if contact can be established, of the processing of any person or persons hostile to the Corsair Empire docking on Freeport 9, after conducting hostile operations into Corsair-controlled space. That is, to revoke docking rights within the shortest amount of time possible, in the timeframe above.
Regardless of the fact that the Freeport can take damage if a Corsair chases a criminal into the sovereign space of the Zoners, there is one other thing that disturbs me with your proposal.
A Corsair opening fire on someone he considers hostile, within our sovereign space, without that person conducting hostile operations against the Corsairs first. There would be no such thing as evidence, and the faction that the Corsair's hostile belongs to, would make a fuss with us. Our relationships would suffer from friction, and potentially deteriorate. This would ruin our neutral stance. And that would have further consequences.
As for your lawless space denial, I may be able to make something which we can both agree on with that.
The following is my re-drafted counter-proposal, please give it some thought." Sebastien sighed as he put up a new document on the screen for Elder Sephardi's perusal. Talking was tiring. He knew it was his job to negotiate peace though. So, he did so, as best he could.
Quote:2)
a) The Corsair Empire shall recognize Omicron 74 and everything contained within, Freeport 9 and 5k of space surrounding it, and Corfu Base and 5k of space surrounding it, to be the sovereign territory of the Zoners, with their laws applying within.
b) The Omicroners, Freeport 9 and Corfu station shall recognize the Napo Cloud, Omicron Gamma and Omicron 91, as the sovereign territory of the Corsair Empire, with their laws applying within.
c) All other territory within Omicron Theta, shall be considered uncontested, and for all purposes neutral territory, and a set of mutual laws co-written by the Council of Corsair Elders and The Omicroners shall be written, to be valid for this territory. Until these laws are written, temporary rulings shall be made.
These are:
i)The Corsair Empire is permitted to act in military defense of Corsair borders in this neutral space.
The writing of new laws immediately dissolves these temporary rulings, and both parties will endeavour to write laws which are clearer and inclusive within a period of two months. Any confliction of Zoner and Corsair interests in this space, dissolved the temporary ruling, and will force the Omicroners, Zoners of Freeport 9 and Corfu Station, and the Council of Elders, to make laws for the territory within 72 hours of the conflict of interest.
3) The Corsair Empire is permitted to maintain, at the expense of the Empire itself, weapons platforms and defensive undockable structures in the Napo cloud, for the purpose of protecting the Omicron Gamma jump-hole.
"By the way, The "Good Neighbour" policy, will be written into the final draft, and I will endeavour to get an amended copy of it to you as soon as possible. Basically though, as I said, it means no staging from our bases, no docking after a hostile operation's conclusion and violators will be warned first, then refused docking rights at all. Our escalation of punishment scale is yet to be decided on, but it will be another thing I am hoping to negotiate with the Council of Elders." Coen finished his spiel on this part of the contract.
He knew once they agreed on this, the rest of the meeting should have no major hiccups, and he was more than willing to take the Corsair lead on violation punishment, enforcement tactics, transit rights and re-opening Freeport 9 to Corsair trade.
Espi looked at the screen with a blank stare. I understand it's in your nature to use at least 1337 words per sentence, but ... This is longer than our original proposal and I'm only looking at one point of six. You boys read too much. He laughed slightly while skimming the screen again...
Uncontested space? Rules written at a later time? Why are we here now? THIS is the reason why the three of us are sitting here at this very moment. To discuss these things. Maybe you spend your time watching plants in the biodomes grow, and can waste time with these chit-chats, I don't know. But I have three-dozen of men waiting to be coordinated back in the Omegas. How would you ... expect these rules to look like? Free-for-all? No thank you. I'd rather not have 4 carriers parked in the so called uncontested space, launching attack wings towards our home. You don't want it? Fine ... We would make use of the area.
And I have an additional question. What exactly don't you like on our original proposal? We could move on from there.
' Wrote:Espi looked at the screen with a blank stare. I understand it's in your nature to use at least 1337 words per sentence, but ... This is longer than our original proposal and I'm only looking at one point of six. You boys read too much. He laughed slightly while skimming the screen again...
Uncontested space? Rules written at a later time? Why are we here now? THIS is the reason why the three of us are sitting here at this very moment. To discuss these things. Maybe you spend your time watching plants in the biodomes grow, and can waste time with these chit-chats, I don't know. But I have three-dozen of men waiting to be coordinated back in the Omegas. How would you ... expect these rules to look like? Free-for-all? No thank you. I'd rather not have 4 carriers parked in the so called uncontested space, launching attack wings towards our home. You don't want it? Fine ... We would make use of the area.
And I have an additional question. What exactly don't you like on our original proposal? We could move on from there.
Coen sipped from his cold water as he listened to Elder Espi speak. The man in front of him seemed impatient. Fidgeting. As if he did not really want to be here. Coen did not blame him. Freeport 9 was not a quality station before it was attacked, and after it was attacked the word quality would not touch it with a ten foot pole. The Elder seemed to want unqualified acceptance. Coen nodded, sipped and worked on answering his questioning words.
"Elder Espi, it is longer than your original proposal, as firstly, I seek to bring clarity to our contract. Clarity is good, as it allows both parties to better follow the contract, so that we may have an everlasting peace, and not be in the same rut in another decade from now. I want this to endure, not fall apart. Secondly, this is a negotiation, so I think changing bits here and there and compromising for mutual benefit is bound to happen.
My apologies, I thought the temporary ruling suited you? It allows you to enforce your law right now, so that one carrier, let alone four cannot do anything against you. I figure making more complex laws will take more time, so the temporary ruling shall stand until we both meet again, or our fates collide in such a way we need to meet and work out more complex laws. If however, the Elders want to work out those laws now, I am more than willing to do so.
We do not want the territory per se, but we do not want it to come under Corsair sovereign space, as it will endanger trading with our Freeport, and impact both our factions, I feel for the worse, economically. People will be afraid to travel through Corsair space to trade with us, that is. I see this meeting as one endeavouring towards peace and mutual benefit. Mutual benefit is when we get supplies, and we can pass those supplies on to you. Or that is how I see it economically at least.
It has nothing to do with like or dislike, as I said. This is a negotiation, and things are expected to change. That, and as I said, clarity is good.
I hope I answered your queries, Elder Espi." Coen rubbed his temple. The negotiations were tiring, and the other Zoner negotiators who were constantly providing him feedback also seemed tired. It had been a tiring day. One filled with much thought and anxiety.
Miguel knew this would be the hard part. The Zoners would not be interested in any violation of their no fire zone, but that was the situation, the Elders had been through enough of enemy ships attacking Gamma and being fought off only to have the offender dock on Port 9 to avoid Corsair justice.
"Senor, unfortunately, the issue of pursuit into the No Fire Zone is one that is non-negotiable. I am sorry to say, the Corsair empire cannot wait a week to meet out justice to those who attack our homes. Senor, this is a part of the former status quo that the empire feels it is impossible to return to. You ask us to wait for the Zoners to deal with the problem, but that is dealing with attacks against us after the fact, and asking us to defer punishment of those who would kill our kin, letting them go, with the only effect being that maybe they are not allowed to dock on your Port 9 next time they head into Gamma to murder Corsair people. For obvious reasons that is an unacceptable situation for the Empire, and one that led us to where we are today. I urge you to take into account the Empires need to defend it's borders, as well as stop those who would attack our people from making good on their escape just to plan another attack on us, I urge you not to hold so strongly to your ideals of the No Fire Zone that you undermine the success of these talks."
' Wrote:Miguel knew this would be the hard part. The Zoners would not be interested in any violation of their no fire zone, but that was the situation, the Elders had been through enough of enemy ships attacking Gamma and being fought off only to have the offender dock on Port 9 to avoid Corsair justice.
"Senor, unfortunately, the issue of pursuit into the No Fire Zone is one that is non-negotiable. I am sorry to say, the Corsair empire cannot wait a week to meet out justice to those who attack our homes. Senor, this is a part of the former status quo that the empire feels it is impossible to return to. You ask us to wait for the Zoners to deal with the problem, but that is dealing with attacks against us after the fact, and asking us to defer punishment of those who would kill our kin, letting them go, with the only effect being that maybe they are not allowed to dock on your Port 9 next time they head into Gamma to murder Corsair people. For obvious reasons that is an unacceptable situation for the Empire, and one that led us to where we are today. I urge you to take into account the Empires need to defend it's borders, as well as stop those who would attack our people from making good on their escape just to plan another attack on us, I urge you not to hold so strongly to your ideals of the No Fire Zone that you undermine the success of these talks."
Coen knew the Corsairs had enough of violations, but his hands were tied. He knew it would be the deadlocking point. He had seen it from the start. Corsairs wanted to hunt down people. He was told he had to protect his stations and keep the economy flowing. None of which would happen should the Corsairs get unqualified interdiction rights in the NFZ.
"Elder Sephardi, per further council with those I represent, I am willing to negotiate the time down from one week to 48 hours, or perhaps even 24 hours. Of course, I need to find out whether that will appease you more than anything else, before I try to do so.
Furthermore, we are willing to allow Corsairs to shoot within the NFZ provided that the Corsairs provide evidence for every engagement within the NFZ, so we may use this evidence to indemnify ourselves from another faction's wrath and consequences, that the Corsair be actively pursuing a target into the NFZ first and shooting a hostile within the NFZ for the reason that they are hostile is not permissible. There has to be an active hostile action, within four hours of the hostile's appearance.
To be frank, we are not asking you not to deal with the problem. We are asking you not to interfere in our territory, not to accidentally fire at our station, not to disrupt our economic infrastructure. We are even promising not to have a person return to our territory at all, if they have used Zoner facilities to actively attack Omicron Gamma. I think we are trying hard to make this work.
Now, I am sure the Corsair Empire, after we disallow capital ship mooring and implement our good neighbour policy even further, which will cull down a significant majority of hostiles to the Empire, will be more than able to deal with the remaining stragglers passing through the nets.
In other words, I submit this amended proposition for you to read through." Coen sighed. He could not bend much.
Quote:2)
a) The Corsair Empire shall recognize Omicron 74 and everything contained within, Freeport 9 and 5k of space surrounding it, and Corfu Base and 5k of space surrounding it, as the sovereign territory of the Zoners, with their laws applying within.
b) The Omicroners, Freeport 9 and Corfu station shall recognize the Napo Cloud, Omicron Gamma and Omicron 91, as the sovereign territory of the Corsair Empire, with their laws applying within.
c) All other territory within Omicron Theta, shall be considered uncontested, and for all purposes neutral territory, and a set of mutual laws co-written by the Council of Corsair Elders and The Omicroners shall be written, to be valid for this territory. Until these laws are written, temporary rulings shall be made.
These are:
i)The Corsair Empire is permitted to act in military defense of Corsair borders in this neutral space with no penality.
ii) The Zoners are allowed to protect supply shipments coming to Freeport 9, with no penalty.
The writing of new laws immediately dissolves these temporary rulings, and both parties will endeavour to write laws which are clearer and inclusive within a period of two months. Any confliction of Zoner and Corsair interests in this space, dissolves the temporary ruling, and will force the Omicroners, Zoners of Freeport 9 and Corfu Station, and the Council of Elders, to make laws for the territory within 72 hours of the
conflict of interest.
d) Corsairs will be permitted to open fire within the Zoner's sovereign space in Omicron Theta when all conditions are met:
i) The Corsairs in question capture and be able to provide guncam evidence for every engagement within the sovereign territory of the Zoners in Omicron Theta. If they cannot provide evidence for a specific engagement, their rights to pursue a hostile and engage them in Zoner sovereign space in Omicron Theta shall be revoked with no penalty to the Zoners.
ii) That the Corsair be actively pursuing a target into the NFZ which committed an active hostile action within four hours of the hostile's appearance within Zoner sovereign territory.
iii) Shooting a hostile within the Zoner's sovereign territory for the reason that they are hostile is not permissible. There has to be an active hostile action, within four hours of the hostile's appearance within Zoner sovereign territory.
e) Corsairs are not allowed to enter Omicron 74. They are disallowed from following any hostile person or persons into Omicron 74. They are disallowed from opening fire in Omicron 74.
3) The Corsair Empire is permitted to maintain, at the expense of the Empire itself, weapons platforms and defensive undockable structures in the Napo cloud, for the purpose of protecting the Omicron Gamma jump-hole.
The new contract was wordier, but Coen knew it had to be. He took another large sip from his glass and waited.
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