' Wrote:Spire here isn't talking about removing all indies. What he is aiming for is to stop the incessant lolwuttery of certain indies. His example stated is an indie claiming he is not part of a particular faction and is a full independent despite having said faction's ID and IFF, all for the sake of pirating without a nerf.
We shouldn't remove indies, we should just have a tighter hold on them. At least implement a faction right that allows the sanctioning of indies within an NPC faction. I would prefer that FR5s can be applied to indies within the same faction. This way, any person who goes around shooting his own men can be branded a "traitor" and be FR5d, thus preventing overall lolwuttery.
My god is someone actually reading what I'm saying and not reading 'into- what I'm saying?
To be fair, lolwutery can be just someone's attempt to have fun to hell with rules and everyone else. It's adorable for about five seconds then needs to end.
' Wrote:People not acting according to their ID are breaking the rules. Bastille is full of people who did that.
For someone to be FR5ed you need to write a report just as well as to get someone sanctioned who broke server rules.
I don't really see the difference there.
I don't like having to hold the fire button down at the same time I'm holding the Print Scrn button down. I'm not a sanctionlancer who enjoys taking the time to file a report every time when all it takes is for that player to change his ID or join the faction and play like that faction. It's an endless game of cat and mouse. That starts, not with me just being apathetic and accepting it all, but that player being responsible. I know its a partial solution Zeb, but there's got to be an easier way.
One example of too many. The BHC battlecruiser that launched from FP1 to attack hessians and pirates. Shouldn't have been there. I could file a sanction report. Didn't. Next option, open a Roleplay channel, to the Bounty Hunter Core. Can't. That ship isn't officially theirs, it's an Independent. Next. Need to contact that player and tell him to GTFO. Will he? Hope so. End result. He pretends he cant understand english and loses his guns and ships, most likely switches to another character and wash rinse repeat. Nothing is learned and we're told to just accept him until he enters into another pvp where he's not suppose to be. He doesn't attempt to change and he just drolls on. This is what people want me to accept?
' Wrote:[font=Comic Sans Ms]I have had an independent lane hacker for a year and a half. She has her own story, adds to the environment, hasn't made life hell for anyone, and has no intention of ever joining the official hacker faction (Or can, given that she'd have to give up everything to join them)
Why are you telling me I have to either join up or leave? What have I done to offend the official faction? They've never complained about me, so why are you?
I'm really thinking about this because its close in many ways to the role play I'm doing in Rheinland. One main exception, I'm taking the nerf.
You said: and has no intention of ever joining the official hacker faction (Or can, given that she'd have to give up everything to join them
You've just made a clear and apparent statement that you have no ties to the Hackers but get all the benefits of a Hacker and suffer no penalties from your choices. Not fair.
I'm making a clear and apparent statement that I'm independent of Rheinalnd. You still have the Lane Hacker ID I'm betting. Other than that I know nothing about your Role play. The second I see you I'm thinking 'Hacker', not an independent. If you are a hacker at heart but will not follow the ID of a hacker, time to get a different ID.
' Wrote:Interesting set of ... well, to be perfectly honest, whining.
When you think that it's you against the entire forum, perhaps you ought to look at what you're saying and see if either you're not getting your point across clearly to support your argument, or perhaps you're actually wrong in your thinking.
Whining: Complain in a feeble or petulant way.
No I don't think I am Ag. I think I'm bringing a valid point to the table and perhaps you believe that by attacking me and not the argument as so many have done, it will cut me to the heart and I will be undone.
Not happening.
To get such a strong narrow answers to by question, yea I really started feeling this was the Alamo at first. And no, I'm pretty correct in my thinking.
Quote:First off, look at what official factions are. That is explained in the last sentence of FR1.
Now, what authority does a faction have? That's in FR2.
Thus, in the BAF example mentioned previously, if the BAF 1ic or 2ic was around, they could tell the indies not to engage to overbalance a combat.
However - canon RP also has the BAF hostile to the Mollies and the Corsairs both. So the official faction ships cannot order the BAF indies to assist the Mollies against the Corsairs if the indies don't want to do so.
By the same token, FR2 still requires that official factions allow indies to participate.
As far as an official faction being able to FR5 someone with their own ID ... the BHG|Core did that. Twice - and not just to one single ship, but to an entire group. Actually being able to do that is still listed in one of the examples, even.
You have to have darned good in-game and in-forum RP to do so, along with supporting screenshots. It's not something that can be done on a whim.
Anyway, your basic premise is incorrect.
With the exception of a couple of special factions - K|Hara, for example - the official faction does not 'own' the equipment. That's why and where you're in error. If they have an ID, they're just as much a part of the faction as you are - whether they're in the LN, the BAF, the BHG, or any other ID in the game. Your official faction may be the keeper of the lore as a representative of the faction ID - but you're not the entirity of the whole faction. Again, look back at FR2.
I understand everything you are saying. But, your statement reminds me of this fact based argument where everything is true right up to the conclusion which has nothing to do with my point. As a result, I can only presume you read -into- what I said and not -what- I said.
My point as nothing to do with how people think or how the strings must be pulled, but rather an adherence to their ID and the penalties and or benefits from that choice
Independents can pvp all they want. They can carry Faction/freelancer/pirate/circus IDs all they want. They merely need to act like an independent, a Pirate, a faction or a clown, take the nerf with a different ID and accept the pitfalls and benefits of the choice. Dear god, that's all I'm saying.
Remember, -Independents-. Not established -factions- that go mad with -faction- tech we can all easily point out and say' look at them' and the hammer of Admin righteousness is sent against them.
I'm talking about -Independent- players who act -independently-, with the -faction- technology, with the -faction- Ships, with the -faction- equipment, with the -faction- ID to avoid the Nerf and have no ties to the -FACTION-.
Sometimes, when all you want is to gain your freedom, you must be willing to risk it all.
![[Image: azyu0u4.png]](http://i.imgur.com/azyu0u4.png)