Reading this thread seriously gave me an eye tic due to the massive spam of preconceived ideas of certain individuals who hide behind the RP lore. Truly each post became more absurd than the previous and naturally when no one can come to an agreement they simply blame a person of being bias, yes of course, what other way to settle a problem but to accuse someone total of neglect towards the world around him.
Despite constantly drifting far from the original topic, this thread's purpose it to point out how far from all other very heavy fighters, who're supposed to play the ''tank'' role, is a particular case standing out from the group in almost every aspect. Agility, armor, number of weapons and power plant (Thank God, the size is acceptable).
As for now, quotes won't be used in order to avoid friction between opinions. So I'll simply sum up the impressions made so far whether this fighter is balanced or not.
1.The Order is meant to have the superior technological advantage in comparison to the rest of Sirius since they need everything to counter the dreaded Nomads and BHG.
I couldn't agree more, since I've personally fought Voidrunners who have no issues in keeping the favorable odds on their side just by doing circles and constantly raping the ''nomad torpedo'' key. A light fighter which is the only one that can survive a direct razor or nuke, granted you're lucky enough to land hits in the first place. However, as already stated, this is the only piece of ''hardware'' the nomads have at their disposal which has the capacity to stand on its own and, for those who aren't already aware, the nasty turbo squid got nerfed. As in, it no longer turns faster than the liberator, which is no small deal at all.
Yes, it is still a pain in the *** to actually kill it, but I can't blame them for creating such a ship when every time they visit a system, Mr. X arrives and writes '' Nomads near (add whatever place you want)'' and a whole damn sea of love pours with the sole purpose to enjoy the perfectly normal gank. (Sadly, there's no cure for idiocy)
Bounty Hunters are next on the Order's favorite list. Surprisingly enough, the Manta VHF received a boost to its agility. Now I do say ''surprisingly'' because a large part of the community is under the impression Mantas were killing machines back in 4.85. Unless that definition stands for having a huge profile, less armor and slower turning speed than a Guardian then I can only feel sorry for those individuals who put their trust in the almighty buckshots while charging ahead and strafing. Yeah, that barely manages to cut in against people who use the similar strategy. So in short, in 4.85 Manta was nowhere near the Nephthys.
With the recent buff however it finally became a force to be reckoned with, and doesn't have to suffer under the deliberate handicap regarding its other aspects. Hell, some people dare to call it the new Wraith version for all BHG. (in terms of speed, whereas the profile, battery and armor still remain behind the Guardian) Indeed, I'll compare it with Guardian since that ship is believed to be the borderline between average and terrible.
Seems like the Order really do face mighty opponents and the statement '' we need Nephthys to counter them all '' is well justified.
Unless'¦ they're just the special ones in Disco who're only affected by this balancing term. Let's see if the same applies for other factions shall we?
First of all, the Unioners and their Arbeiter. (Crossbreed between an Eagle and a Wraith)
Now I'm no tech expert but when you mix two crafts which are legendary for their agility, normally you'd expect something'¦ similar in terms of speed?
Here're the wonderful results, Arbeiter is not only way slower than both Eagle and Wraith, but also has a bigger profile than the Guardian, less nanobots and oh maybe one bonus which would be the 200 extra armor over the Guardian's. Not to mention their blaster cannons who'd make everyone cry with their stunning dps 2k and slow projectile speed.
Now these folks have this to counter umm the Wraith ^^. A ship which stands for the anti-everything duty. I truly sympathize to the Unioners with their challenging task to counter a Wraith in a ship which is already worse than the Guardian (Thank God for the new Vengeance cannons which somewhat even the odds). Naturally the Unioners have been deliberately called a ''Sabre whore faction'' using codename guns and flashpoints against Wraiths.
Yes, it is completely unacceptable when people have a chance to fight back. But as it stands, the Unioners have no right in receiving adequate tech against the impossible PvP demands. That won't concern the Order now would it? After all they are special.
The same could be said about the Templar facing a Chimaera. I recall a discussion inclining people to believe the Kusari tech is ridiculously overpowered in comparison to bretonian. Yeah'¦ having a slightly faster ship with less armor, less regens and by far slower weapons is considered overpowered by some standards. Kusari lawful players also encounter the Blood Dragon Katana, but in that particular case the odds are fairly balanced since the Katana sacrifices tenacity for a slightly better speed advantage.
To be honest, facing daito Katanas and Splitter Templars is a terrifying thought in a Chimaera. (At least the new sunfrenzy offers you a chance to bite back)
As for the nomads, well to be honest they have the tendency of traveling all over Sirius and not just sticking in the Omicrons to play cat and mouse with Order ships. Does a Titan getting butthurt by voidrunners seem balanced to you? Not as fair as it is to the rest of Sirius, but do you hear them hiding behind the explanation ''We fight nomads, must have ultimate tech''? RP lore says the Order are unique, however that causes serious issues when it comes to PvP. I daresay their uniqueness borders with arrogance compared to everyone else.
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2.Buffing certain ships makes others utterly redundant.
True and true, and instead of pointing out libertonian, bretonian, kusarian, rheinish or any other tech by choice, why don't you take a good long look at your Nephthys which fills the Bastet's role perfectly and even better than expected.
Bastet has 6 slots for tenth class weapons. Let's mount six Excaliburs: This sums up to 8340 damage per shot.
Now do the same with the Nephthys. Four Excaliburs and three Magmahammers: 5560 + 3000= 8560 per shot.
Oh well, math says the tank delivers a heavier punch than the ship which is precisely made for shotgun strikes. Also the turning speed barely makes a difference to compensate the lack of armor and battery on the Bastet's side.
3.A better pilot killed you in an Avenger, Neo. Quit whining about it.
Since it'd be arrogant to call myself a good pilot, much less better than Connor, I'll explain in detail what happened in that duel. Yeah, I was behind the Avenger controls.
At first I thought that the normal semi-slides should be sufficient to keep up to another fighter of the same heavy category. Little did I know'¦
The agility advantage was nothing compared to the obscene amount of damage he delivered in exactly a second'¦ a second and a half, tops. That alone cost me about 20%-30% of my armor if we ignore the fact that his three tizonas ate my full shield in one second. Luckily for me, desperation nukes are still a viable option given that cruise disruptors epically fail at tracking targets. Chances are you'll just nail yourself by trying to counter them with one disruptor. That was my only chance in clawing to victory since he outclassed me in every fighter aspect. He finally ran into one nuke out of the other fifty I used and that sealed the deal, shooting him down after that was a matter of mindbending patience.
One nuke, turned the tide, but what would've happened if we were to use regens? I throw away all my nukes for the cost of a single hit and he'd have 60-65 regens left out of 78. Honestly, before smack talking someone make sure you can fill their shoes, because judging by most of the responses here, very few have tried another ''tank'' VHF against the Nephthys.
4.Buffing the LN ships would result in the hostile orientated factions demanding the same for their tech.
I sincerely hope that, the person who suggested to additionally buff the Werewolf, is being sarcastic. They may have a point though, after all, Werewolves are still getting shot down which is completely unacceptable, add a GB shield to solve that issue since the freighter class 6 shield or the 140 regens aren't enough.
But hey, it's not that Liberty faces opponents with tech astronomically ahead of its own.
Merely'¦Werewolf, Bayonet, Wraith, Nephthys (Don't you just love battleship Atum in Alaska.)
Bottom line: I refrain from saying whether buffing Liberty tech is good or not, it may seem fair in the eyes of some people, whereas others will find it insulting.
Still this thread is solely about the Nephthys and so far I'm not convinced neither the nomad or BHG problem is good enough anymore. All factions have issues against the opposing side, but very few have the right to call themselves ''technologically superior'' based on their origin. Every RP story is plausible, it can be supported by both preposterous and solid arguments, but don't dare involve the precious lore of yours to justify the utterly imbalanced PvP system. This goes for every faction: Human, Synthetic or Alien.
No one is obliged to suffer flying a worse ship just because they're good and should stay in par with those who lack the time, means or are just lazy to hone their own skills.
Having the best VHF in the game which fares in agility nearly as good as the Guardian, but beats every other fighter in terms of tenacity and brute strength is ridiculous, don't you think?
Now for my own opinion: Either nerf the Nephthys so it'll be similar to Templer, Avenger or Titan (mainly for the agility, armor seems to much as well). Or buff the rest of the tank very heavy fighters so they won't look like harmless toys compared to the Nephthys. Nobody likes having their main dish removed from the table, but for once think what's it like on the other side and whether the person next to you is enjoying their gaming experience. Because I sincerely doubt anyone would under such circumstances.
