Let's talk Gaians

[Friday]

Gaians can be considered to be irrational because they value unique non-human species over human life.

Philosophically, a Gaian can argue that humans are not about to go extinct - so killing a few to preserve species that are threatened by human activities is justifiable. So a Gaian can care deeply about humanity as a species - but not care in the slightest about 'breaking a few eggs' to do it.

With regards to 'barren lifeless rocks'. Even if there are only micro-organisms present on the planet - it has the potential to evolve into something unique and precious.

More than this, terraforming (to a Gaian) is basically wiping out all possibility of new or existing species developing. This to them would be like paving concrete over the Amazon rainforest - natives and all.

aye, if they are not-poor than it even makes less sense. Why would a rich bretonian want to be recruited by
a terrorist organization who operates as allies of poor&starving pirates such as corsairs.
i just cant bring myself to imagine an organization filled with paradox attributes, everything seems to contradict itself.

Here is an interesting question for you...

Were the 9/11 Bombers poor?

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[Primus Avatar]

Were the 9/11 Bombers poor?

poor fools if you ask me. But i don't consider Gaians being religious types.

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wassup

[bluntpencil2001]

poor fools if you ask me. But i don't consider Gaians being religious types.

They were rich. You don't get many poor people that are capable of flying jets, as a rule.

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[Primus Avatar]

They were rich.

That was actually very obvious :lol:

No, i mean: I consider religious terrorists to be "fools" and i added the "poor" to express how sorry i feel
for their mentality.

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wassup

[bluntpencil2001]

That was actually very obvious :lol:

No, i mean: I consider religious terrorists to be "fools" and i added the "poor" to express how sorry i feel
for their mentality.

My bad. Regardless, protecting potential evolution, millions of years from now, and allowing potential famine in exchange... well... that doesn't strike me as rational. It's only natural for humans to try expand and secure food sources.

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[Drake]

With regards to 'barren lifeless rocks'. Even if there are only micro-organisms present on the planet - it has the potential to evolve into something unique and precious.

Most barren lifeless rocks lack micro-organisms, which is kinda the point. If a planet had life, in any form, then I might be able to understand it (though it still smacks of religion to me), but the Gaians are opposed to all terraforming, if I understand them correctly.

[blubba]

Maybe this has something more akin to to what the modern interpretation of what Gaia is?
Maybe it suggests that all planets are their own living organism, or the potential to be so from within.
Possibly something akin to a religon almost rather than pure science, despite it being clearly based in science.

As for these people being poor, I am not sure that is applicable with 'intellectuals'. The two are not mutually exclusive.
For example, there have been many wealthy political communist supporters in history. Most stayed that way. It doesn't always follow that they must 'share the wealth' despite their political objectives.
War can be hideously expensive afterall.

The Gaians possibly see Planetform as the 'head' of a huge monster. They realize they need all the help they can get. Why not get it from the Bretonians enemies?
Be that Kusari or Corsair. These Gaians may have some wealth, but can their individual wealth match that of Bretonia?
A huge house which is currently able to fight a war on three fronts and hold off a civil war?
No, I think not.
They probably use nuclear mines as well. If it stops or even slows the flow and expansion of an ever hungry (not just food) human population, they probably see it as a small price to pay.

Theres a lot of 'maybes' and 'possiblies' in there. I don't have many answers sadly. Just more questions.

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[Eppy]

The problem with the strictly canonical view here is that the Gaians are therefore basically a HUGE cult-something the size of which is highly improbable. I mean, admittedly, realism is not this game's strong suit, but I think that the Gaian RP should be extended to more diverse end, which, yes, include the hippie and the scientist as well as the terrorist cult, and even extend into Green Front activity. It's just not fun RPing a purity-obsessed terrorist as much as it is a concerned citizen.

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Quick comment - we thought that Panzer was the Leader, Swift. -Agmen

Which Dreadnought was that?

One of your nine.

[bluntpencil2001]

The problem with the strictly canonical view here is that the Gaians are therefore basically a HUGE cult-something the size of which is highly improbable. I mean, admittedly, realism is not this game's strong suit, but I think that the Gaian RP should be extended to more diverse end, which, yes, include the hippie and the scientist as well as the terrorist cult, and even extend into Green Front activity. It's just not fun RPing a purity-obsessed terrorist as much as it is a concerned citizen.

Certainly... Gaians targetting poachers on Gaia would be very different to those in Tau 31 bombing Planetform.

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[Zelot]

My bad. Regardless, protecting potential evolution, millions of years from now, and allowing potential famine in exchange... well... that doesn't strike me as rational. It's only natural for humans to try expand and secure food sources.

Sometimes we get locked into our own heads, not able to see things from more than one perspective. Just saying the Gaians are irrational is only a way to stop ourselves from stepping into someone else's shoes. There is a rationality to the Gaians, you just have to look at things from a different angle. You are saying that food has a particular value. Which in the end it does, but it is hard to compare that value with some intangible like the environment. In the same way, the Gaians feel that changing a planets natural eco-system, whether it be barren or Gaia, is wrong. That belief cannot really be quantified, and thus a value cannot be assigned to it. So how do we compare the value of an intangible with the value of a tangible? You dont, it doesnt work. Now I know, you say that more food is better and there is no negative consequences to it, but that is to suggest that planets that are hospitable to human life are somehow move valuable than those that are not. That is looking at it from a human centric view point. The idea that things that dont help humans have no value is just plain silly once you remove our superiority complex from the thought. The Gaians believe that all planets, in their current form are valuable, that all life in it's current form are valuable, and that altering that is taking something intangible out of the world, which cannot be replaced. Gaians just chose their values differently than you do, they are by no means irrational.

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