Sorry, how is balancing the discovery and bringing more people to corporations, especially new people a bad thing?
In corporation they have structure and chance of actually not get banned after first month of play, when they engage someone without notification or something simmilar. they can learn the rp, they can learn how to behave, they can learn how to pirate in right way because they'll see the wrong ways and they can learn many more things.
opening the corporations brings people together and offers some better and major interaction. Sure, it benefits me in the process, but what's so unfair there? It benefits every other corporation member as well.
So far an independent trader offers what to the discovery other than his personal profit and being the target for most hardcore pirates that will decide to pirate him even tho he's neutral.
Corporations interact with each others, are more prone to hire mercenaries, and that actually means bringing more people into "a story" and by doing that offering a higher quality of roleplay.
Yes, things can be unfair and great at the same time. It's called challenge and I respond to it. Thats why I hope to attract more people to corporations, and thats why I cashed out most of my income i earned here to fund people who actually agree to take the risk. Some members already accepted that, like Roly, Alvin, Ziggeris and thats just the people agreed to create Kishiro with me. Others that join later will surely be there creating new things for Discovery while having fun.
Point of the internet game like this, where developers have gave up is to have it as an sandbox. See what you can, expand where you can and make sure it's a better place, more fun and more challenging. So far it's pretty challenging for me, since I seem to be tacking some issues others aren't.
If you disagree, make a threat about points you disagree with me, so I can point out where you're wrong, do not twist my words around because that doesn't work on me. Offer something constructive or offer an alternative that would work better than my suggestions.
"leave things alone" isn't a suggestion, because things can always be better.
@ ackarion: Your arguments are great, and you are right. Repeating some routes over and over tends to get boring, but have you ever done it in convoy? It tends to be much more fun. Yes, interaction with alot of nations certainly sounds like something an independent trader would do and could do, and more important - should do. So what is your point on corporations limiting some exclusive resources to their own members and members of other corps that they allowed to trade it?
basically making it a contraband for others, enforced by some entity.
It gives you a right to ship it ofcourse, but you just have an extra risk while doing it.
' Wrote:Sorry, how is balancing the discovery and bringing more people to corporations, especially new people a bad thing?
It isn't bad. Did I ever say it would be bad?
I just don't see anything in this that would balance anything.
This would just benefit you and your corporation, as I said.
Your suggestion has no real purpose, because it would only bring harm to others and benefit for corporate traders.
I am a corporate trader by myself, and I find it good enough.
There is nothing that would need to be balanced.
' Wrote:"leave things alone" isn't a suggestion, because things can always be better.
They can, but you should try to make things better for everyone, not just yourself.
' Wrote:Offer something constructive or offer an alternative that would work better than my suggestions.
If you wouldn't be so ignorant and would actually bother reading my bost,
you'd see what I am trying to point out in a constructive way.
I just hate how you try to change things for your own benefit.
You have this holier-than-thou attitude which annoys me greatly.
You want to take things from others and at the same time receive things for yourself.
I hate your kind of selfish people.
' Wrote:Sure, it benefits me in the process, but what's so unfair there? It benefits every other corporation member as well.
But it doesn't benefit independent traders.
They're already in bad enough position with the cargo limitations, which is enough.
In exchange of freedom, they cannot have large transports.
Fair? Yes. No change needed.
I haven't had time to read the entire thread....but let me give my two cents here.
This is Freelancer right?
Go anywhere, do anything, right? That's what it says on the box atleast. We have enough restrictions in place to encourage house shipping, but that does not mean we should really do away with the smaller working class kind of person in FL...meaning those independent traders.
They have their smaller ships. Now, sure you can argue that in real life we have shipping companies. We also have privately owned ferries and freighters.
Joining a corporation is fine, yeah. But you go into an entirely different RP compaired to an independent trader. Corp routes are very limited and not the most exciting....sure that the 'nerf zoners, buff corps' campaign have increased their profits, but really, you know that it's not the same.
Independent traders and Freelancers have an unmatched amount of Freedom when it comes to RP.
Its alright, the main reason I've posted it here is to see the opinion of the forum. Based on the opinion of the community things can be pushed forward, or stay the same (what's not the bad thing too).
@iKone. I think I pissed you off far before this topic and you're pushing it here now, hard. I wont call your arguments "bitchings" because I want to be nice. But lets be clear here. You "Hate"? You really "hate"?
Chill out and behave because hate has no place in civil discussion. I think I'll see what rest of community has to say, and then I'll try to make this game as much pleasurable as i can for my corporation and players that are in it.
And guess what, I won't care one bit about what you say, because you are letting your personal feelings about me interfere. I probably pirated you or something, who cares..
Point is, it was a topic of discussion, but you made it something else. I'll just play as I can within the rules that are in this server. You have fun as well and take care. Hope you'll take your advice about this being a game and not "hate" things around here.
And I might not be better than you, but I'm certainly more civil.
While I must say I agree that Independent traders are limited nicely, I must say that there is still a way to go towards limiting mercs and freelancers in their trading ability.
A freelancer who needs a large transport to trade with is by definition an Independent trader.
About corporations restricting certain goods I think this is a very acceptable move to make.
Most corporations have something that is their bread winner.
Kishiro has after all signed an agreement for exclusive rights to buy all of the GMGs H-Fuel so they can ship it to others as they see fit.
Now I know that it is normally seen as they are just transporting it for the GMG and I.C. has also got an agreement that they receive 5% of the H-Fuel from the Okinawa system but I am just stating how it is written in the game.
The tricky part about a monopoly is making sure you know who else can still ship your product according to game lore.
For instance with H-Fuel, since I.C. has 5% of the fuel mined from the Okinawa system then of course they may ship it from there.
Likewise Samura has their own mining operations going on and so may ship H-Fuel from Hokkaido.
I am sure that at least Rheinland has one corporation that also mines H-Fuel and although it would not make much profit for them, they can hardly be shot by mercanaries for carrying that product on their ship.
The other thing to think about is that as soon as you start selling lisences for your products you have to expect the corporation at the other end to follow suit to recoup their expenses.
' Wrote:Its alright, the main reason I've posted it here is to see the opinion of the forum. Based on the opinion of the community things can be pushed forward, or stay the same (what's not the bad thing too).
' Wrote:@iKone. I think I pissed you off far before this topic and you're pushing it here now, hard. I wont call your arguments "bitchings" because I want to be nice.
Only time you've annoyed me is this thread right now.
And no need to be nice to me, have I ever asked for it?
And calling my posts as bitching is far from offensive.
I have gone trough a lot worse, trust me.
' Wrote:But lets be clear here. You "Hate"? You really "hate"?
Selfish people, yes.
You do know what emotions are?
' Wrote:Chill out and behave because hate has no place in civil discussion.
I have behaved like this on forums all the time.
It is my personality. If I need to change my personality in order to be here, then I will leave.
I only respect people who deserve my respect - You don't.
' Wrote:I think I'll see what rest of community has to say, and then I'll try to make this game as much pleasurable as i can for my corporation and players that are in it.
Finally you admit what the purpose of this thread is - Personal benefit.
' Wrote:And guess what, I won't care one bit about what you say, because you are letting your personal feelings about me interfere.
If you wouldn't care, you wouldn't be replying to me.
' Wrote:I probably pirated you or something, who cares..
I haven't actually ever met you in-game, but I certainly am not looking forward to it.
Well, since it seems you know how to quote, and whine, you deserve an answer to this.
As for other thing, yes, I usually don't start thinking about some aspects until I find myself in that place. I guess that doesn't make me an admin material, but it sure makes me a good player since i at least think how to improve things in the game to benefit me and those like me.
So you can go ahead and leave this thread and open one where you tell entire world how you loathe me and how I'm an selfish prick, but if you have nothing else constructive to contribute here, please get out. I'm sure you'ld have few more people that would join you in that thread about how unfair I am.
' Wrote:Well, since it seems you know how to quote, and whine, you deserve an answer to this.
Whining can only be replied by more whining.
This is what the first post was.
' Wrote:As for other thing, yes, I usually don't start thinking about some aspects until I find myself in that place. I guess that doesn't make me an admin material, but it sure makes me a good player since i at least think how to improve things in the game to benefit me and those like me.
It's not hard to find things to improve in the game to benefit yourself.
Try find things to improve in the game to benefit everyone.
' Wrote:So you can go ahead and leave this thread and open one where you tell entire world how you loathe me and how I'm an selfish prick, but if you have nothing else constructive to contribute here, please get out. I'm sure you'ld have few more people that would join you in that thread about how unfair I am.
As I answered last time you said I haven't said nothing constructive in this thread,
please stop being so ignorant and please read my first posts.
guy that's bitchin Wrote:It's not hard to find things to improve in the game to benefit yourself.
Try find things to improve in the game to benefit everyone.
So let's see it here. Making corporate factions more appealing for the players makes players want to join them. Having more players and with existing corporate actions (like ageira deciding to monopolize their products) means more benefits to the corporations. More players also means more income to the corporation, meaning more money to buy ships and give them to the starting players that have the brain to read the rules and contribute but have no money to start with. They can find a corporation that will teach them how to roleplay and give them a push in their start of discovery fl.
By doing this, new player also contributes in meeting new players - his wingmates, or in this case his convoy mates. People talk while in convoys about many things, form friendships and form future interactions without bad feelings between each others, something that doesn't happen so often.
With all this, comes a new thing, actually involving other players in the game of the corporation. Mercenaries or people that corporation hires to do those illegal things corporations certainly do. Getting rid of competitions, controling that monopoly the corporation issued on their... boron..
This involves other corporations to roleplay with the same corp, forming the bigger convoys, attracting more pirates to the location, pirates that stumble upon a challenge. Few ships in convoy and an escort. Something a lone gunboat can't take alone. he's forced to join up with other indy pirates, bringing them together against a common plunder target, offering even more roleplay about the said situation.
That player from the start, finally grows up and manages to save some cash for his personal ship, that will probably be pirate or mercenary to experience the other side, he knows he can't make it alone, he'll find a corporation or form a corporation of pirates with friends he's met in his convoys, interacting with them.
OH MY GOD, I AM SO FRIKKIN SELFISH, HOW DARE I PROMOTE ROLEPLAY!
' Wrote:@ ackarion: Your arguments are great, and you are right. Repeating some routes over and over tends to get boring, but have you ever done it in convoy? It tends to be much more fun. Yes, interaction with alot of nations certainly sounds like something an independent trader would do and could do, and more important - should do. So what is your point on corporations limiting some exclusive resources to their own members and members of other corps that they allowed to trade it?
basically making it a contraband for others, enforced by some entity.
It gives you a right to ship it ofcourse, but you just have an extra risk while doing it.
If a point on a corporation exlusive item such as and example: Gatelane parts is to be viewed, ya sounds alright. But not all companies and corporations can do this. Universal and Bowex are shippers, this corp could not have a exclusive item. On the other hand Cryer is for pharmas and syth food and marij., Ageria and DSE are to Gatelane parts, and Planetform to Gaian wildlife, so on and so on. I could agree that limited corp would get an exlusive item, though I dont think all corps should, since some corps deal in shipping and not specifics. In addition, there is not enough commodities in game for corporations to get exclusive rights. So only a select few would be awarded these rights. Though these awarded rights should not be based of faction influence, but unbiased solely on the games development.
These could enhance the individual corporations identity, in turn it isolates the corporation on what it can ship now since other routes are now exclusive to other corporations as well. This may hurt the corporation as players may base their sole decision on what corporation has the best route and or rp on that value. So there is a double edged sword to this.
Enforcing these exclusive rights should be up to the corporation themselves and the house's police forces and no one else. Navy, Bounty Huners, Mercs, Freelancers, and Pirate could not care what a trader ships, in concern if they were allowed to carry or not of exclusive cargo. It would be up to the police to do scans and interdiction, Corporations to placed bounties on know offenders for BH and Mercs to get involved. Ther rest would have no standing interest on what was allowed to be carried.
As far as convoys go, I find them to be difficult in rp at times and is somewhat hard to manage as 5 different people rp in 6 different directions, *laughs* Sometimes its like watching a balloon pop. At times there is a bad apple in the bunch, or I could be the bad apple, who knows. Just I did a corporation for a while and I dumped it, just was not fun for me.
So really the point I want to get accross is, if changes are wanted to the Corporations, sounds fine and dandy, If putting exclusive items per corporate company sounds good. Maybe additional commodities need to be introduced to FL then, for those specific corps. Just be cautious on the ramifications that these benefits will do, positive and negative.
Edit: (Forgot to add this point) Changing the Indepentent Trader ID would not be beneficial to players and a positive option to influenc Corp rp, just work on the Corporation application to enhance it. This is Freelancer.