Thank you Zelot i was about to search for that link...
Thank you people for your thoughts but ye' they still should be treated as OORP items imho, the IFF should be showing to the other player who you might be...but yeah like the Cannon's post says, if you have a Pirate ID for example then act like one...
' Wrote:Could you please add one more line to every starting ID info line?
"IDs are non-Roleplay items and therefore doesn't exist in Roleplay"
Example: I'm actually getting sick of the: "U PIRAT, ME NAVY" , Freelancer IFFd Pirate IDd me: "No, officer i think you've mistaken" , Him: "Engagbung"
They do not exist ingame, but they DO define what the other player knows of you. For instance, the "Pirate ID" signifies you as a known outlaw to lawkeepers, who thus have a reason to engage you at will. The roleplay however should be "Enemy vessel, you've been reported in numerous counts of piracy, and destroying you will be a service to my House." instead of "U gots pirat ID, you red, I pew! Engagun!"
Result is the same though. No frelling hiding behind the Freelancer IFF. Shooting up a trader, and with the scrap of it still floating around, and your SNAC still charging, going "No, Navy, I ain't a pirate. You got the wrong man."
Burden of proof in this case ain't with the navy as far as I'm concerned.
Wide awake in a world that sleeps, enduring thoughts, enduring scenes. The knowledge of what is yet to come.
From a time when all seems lost, from a dead man to a world, without restraint, unafraid and free.
Mostly retired Discovery member. May still visit from time to time.
I can't speak for others, but in the case of Liberty, we started basing on IDs instead of IFFs because people would always go "I've not done anything officer, honest!" and ten minutes later found to be shooting at a transport. Because we can't form a comprehensive player-maintained database of criminals that's easy and fast to use, nor do we have the capability to detain suspects until we've done a check, we've gone for the simple route that prevents people from abusing the capability of the previous system.
Just like with the issue about mercenaries and people who got shot by them yesterday hiring them to do some work tomorrow, it's an issue that only came up because players acted in a specific way. As you can imagine, it gets very tiresome to hear the same excuse over and over again, so it was decided that the system would change to get rid of certain kinds of interactions in favour of some others. Given that in this case, the end result was almost always one side shooting each other anyway, we just cut out the middle bit and got to the point.
I can tell you, the usage of pirate IDs for the purpose of dodging the law went through the floor after that law was written. This was the intended result, and as far as we saw, there were no unintended consequences. You might argue that this policy reduced the frequency of roleplay interactions, but each interaction was a carbon copy of the next, resulting in needless repetition and stupidity.
' Wrote:So in other words, you have a criminal history even before you do anything illegal.
I, um.
I'm not the only one that has trouble with that, am I?
Nobody would have a problem with it, if everybody roleplayed their character from birth to death, through various stages of education, employment, soul searching, heartbreak, stress and injury. So, have you done this?
People just magic characters out of the air, starting at a certain point. There's nothing wrong with this, but the decision to do it, and the decision to get a pirate ID, or go on the path of a mage rather than a rogue, is entirely yours. It carries with it benefits and drawbacks, rules.
Perhaps you should pre-order Skyrim? I have!
Edit: This system carries with it a particular problem for those who have special IDs, such as the terrorist ID or the special operative ID. But the amount of people with these special, and poorly defined IDs is low, and the drawbacks occupy a much smaller scale.
Honestly, shades of grey do make this game, and others, more interesting. But, the more shades of grey you have, the more each gets exploited or abused as it were. This isn't actually a bad thing as those words would have you believe, but it should be expected that others whom it impacts on most will do what they can to mitigate the consequences of such greyness.
So basically...you want to be able to pirate people without having to face the consequences of getting attacked by lawfuls.
Yeah, that's not how that works. That's why there's rephacks on the Pirate ID. If all of the NPC lawfuls are attacking you and know to attack you, why shouldn't the player lawfuls?
IMHO, IDs shouldn't define people. Really. People should have the benefit of the doubt unless you can see something obvious, like thier ship, or their tech, or their cargo.
Besides, if they mess up (and you have evidence of such), just alt tab, add them to a dossier, and boom. Now they're a known criminal.
Disco doesn't have that many players. Everyone just has alts. So it shouldn't be too hard to maintain.
[Hopefully I'll be able to acquire a signature to put here soon...]
We've tried. It's not that the amount of effort needed is high, but the amount of effort needed is constant. You can see how this would be a problem when trying to balance your life with your game, as sometimes life takes over. The backlog amasses itself very quickly if left alone for even several days and the problem is compounded by a large amount of throwaway characters being made simply to shoot things, the rename function and the aforementioned problem about of a lack of a means to detain characters while you search for their name on a list.
In fact, a member of the [LN] recently made an interactive webpage for reporting people who break the law, and stupidly I didn't bookmark it. It's a great creation but until the law gets the space equivalent of handcuffs, I can't see it being more than limited in use.
And the other paperwork tasks that a large faction has to deal with aren't even mentioned at this point. The communication thread might not throw up too many tasks, but they still require a consensus among leaders, which is hard to come by when one lives in Australia and the other in the UK. There's also the politics that you need to consider, and the thinking required to judge to what degree you can threaten, coerce, convince, bribe or beg for something that is in the interest of your faction.
The reality is that we are woefully undermanned due to the demands on our time by other commitments. It's not great, but it's true. Fixing the problem is hard too, as a larger team means more effort is needed to keep it organised. In addition, each member of the team has to have skills, time and commitment neccessary to do their bit of the work, and these need to be changed regularly to keep people interested in what they do.
' Wrote:We've tried. It's not that the amount of effort needed is high, but the amount of effort needed is constant. You can see how this would be a problem when trying to balance your life with your game, as sometimes life takes over. The backlog amasses itself very quickly if left alone for even several days and the problem is compounded by a large amount of throwaway characters being made simply to shoot things, the rename function and the aforementioned problem about of a lack of a means to detain characters while you search for their name on a list.
In fact, a member of the [LN] recently made an interactive webpage for reporting people who break the law, and stupidly I didn't bookmark it. It's a great creation but until the law gets the space equivalent of handcuffs, I can't see it being more than limited in use.
And the other paperwork tasks that a large faction has to deal with aren't even mentioned at this point. The communication thread might not throw up too many tasks, but they still require a consensus among leaders, which is hard to come by when one lives in Australia and the other in the UK. There's also the politics that you need to consider, and the thinking required to judge to what degree you can threaten, coerce, convince, bribe or beg for something that is in the interest of your faction.
The reality is that we are woefully undermanned due to the demands on our time by other commitments. It's not great, but it's true. Fixing the problem is hard too, as a larger team means more effort is needed to keep it organised. In addition, each member of the team has to have skills, time and commitment neccessary to do their bit of the work, and these need to be changed regularly to keep people interested in what they do.
I'm not exactly sure what you're getting at. As I've stated before, the number of people you even have to deal with is low, at best. I run into maybe 2 people per system on average, 8 if it's a popular one. It would not take much effort at all to compile a list. It really isn't all that hard. In fact you could just make a spreadsheet. Besides, more often than not, the alt-a-holics kill off their alts and you don't see them for months on end, or they vanish altogether.
Speaking of that, I think the sheer amount of alts is what's killing Disco. If everyone had one char, and stuck to it, the server would be populated with memorable players, people who've put a lot of effort into defining themselves, and all this confusion nonsense wouldn't even be a problem.
[Hopefully I'll be able to acquire a signature to put here soon...]
' Wrote:I'm not exactly sure what you're getting at. As I've stated before, the number of people you even have to deal with is low, at best. I run into maybe 2 people per system on average, 8 if it's a popular one. It would not take much effort at all to compile a list. It really isn't all that hard. In fact you could just make a spreadsheet. Besides, more often than not, the alt-a-holics kill off their alts and you don't see them for months on end, or they vanish altogether.
Speaking of that, I think the sheer amount of alts is what's killing Disco. If everyone had one char, and stuck to it, the server would be populated with memorable players, people who've put a lot of effort into defining themselves, and all this confusion nonsense wouldn't even be a problem.
You could have main characters, but having just 1? No thanks.
3 years with 1 char is not something I'd do, there are many aspects in game that can't be covered by just 1 char.