While it was an excessive use of force it was still warranted, the SCRA absolutely despise the Outcasts for their Cardamine Drugs and blatant disregard for Human Life. It's only natural they would attack them viciously, and if you were a Lawful SCRA detests all lawfuls due to them representing the corruption of the Houses themselves and enforcing the will of those in power which hurts the common man or woman.
So while there was an un-required amount of force involved it still made RP sense as well as practical sense to remove the threat to the Workers of Sirius.
' Wrote:While it was an excessive use of force it was still warranted, the SCRA absolutely despise the Outcasts for their Cardamine Drugs and blatant disregard for Human Life. It's only natural they would attack them viciously, and if you were a Lawful SCRA detests all lawfuls due to them representing the corruption of the Houses themselves and enforcing the will of those in power which hurts the common man or woman.
So while there was an un-required amount of force involved it still made RP sense as well as practical sense to remove the threat to the Workers of Sirius.
I saw this and felt I needed to comment. Again, I wasn't present at the situation, so, ignore this if you feel like it.
The thing is, if I were to allow that kind of RP to justify engagements, then I'd be saying that it's perfectly fine to gank the living hell out of anyone who is at the very bottom of my diplomacy chart. So, for instance 12 KNF might jump on a single BAF, 4 BAF battleships might jump on one KNF, etc....
People used to use that kind of argument to justify ganks. But, I feel that as the server has matured, our views and understanding of how players tick have matured as well. As a result, I feel that RP is no longer valid for justifying a gank like this, especially the one that disrupts ongoing RP or PvP.
As a result, I'm not saying do not attack the Outcasts viciously, I'm saying, don't do it in a way that compromises the amount of fun another player has. If you find a lone Outcast with your SCRA comrade, stop the OC, prevent him from leaving, and let your buddy do the work while you watch. Attacking viciously =/= unfair gank.
It's not fun, and you wouldn't like it to happen to you either, as proved by earlier events in this feedback thread.
Quote:[7:42:05 PM][6:51:36 PM] Igor (Smokey): btw terry
[6:51:48 PM] Terrance Cooper: Ye?
[6:52:00 PM] Igor (Smokey): nothin
[6:52:03 PM] Igor (Smokey): just sayin btw
[6:52:05 PM] Terrance Cooper: <_<
Quote:Johnny_Haas: you shot anti criuse speed rockets!!!
Johnny_Haas: but why????
Johnny_Haas: ??
Johnny_Haas: why you shoot criuse speed rockets?
As I'm reading the feedback, the gank was a recurrent problem in the past few months. We need to drop this attitude.
No matter how good our RP is if we act lame during a fight. I want the SCRA to be a role model for other faction, not only in the term of RP but also in PvP.
' Wrote:As I'm reading the feedback, the gank was a recurrent problem in the past few months. We need to drop this attitude.
No matter how good our RP is if we act lame during a fight. I want the SCRA to be a role model for other faction, not only in the term of RP but also in PvP.
Unfortunately I'd like something to add, and I'm not glad about it.
The situation (Edinburgh):
Nihil.Baxter: Hey guys
Tom.Baxter: Hullo
Ted.Baxter: Hey there
Nihil.Baxter: what the..
SCRA|Aloysius.Rhade: Howdy Sunshine.
Tom.Baxter: hey, what do they want?
Nihil.Baxter: what's going on here?
SCRA|Aloysius.Rhade: Just want to find out what you... fine folks are up to.
Nihil.Baxter: we don't have cash
Tom.Baxter: we need cash in fact
SCRA|Aloysius.Rhade: Do you now?
Ted.Baxter: Ye, cuz we want to be rich
Tom.Baxter: there's gold from rich and filthy people in Dublin we've heard
SCRA|Robert,Thacker: Get a job.
SCRA|Aloysius.Rhade: Ah, so you're pirates?
Nihil.Baxter: The gaian over there wasnt very helpful
Tom.Baxter: No jobs at FP2 since the war between Liberty and Rheinland
Nihil.Baxter: We're toursits
Tom.Baxter: kind of
Ted.Baxter: Ye, mining is not an option anymore there
Ted.Baxter: And Ma is sad
Nihil.Baxter: It's all the houses fault
Tom.Baxter: Ma actually doesn't care, but it's because she's sad
Ted.Baxter: A lot of hungry children
SCRA|Aloysius.Rhade: Ok, so, what are you?
Ted.Baxter: Tourists
SCRA|Aloysius.Rhade: Zoners, Pirates, Terrorists, Smelly Tourists?
Nihil.Baxter: right now?
SCRA|Oliver.Zablosky: You talk a lot eh
Nihil.Baxter: some guys who **** their pants
Tom.Baxter: 10 brothers, and all of them oppressed by militaries, rich and filthy Zonies and others
SCRA|MIL-Jovanovic: *yawns*
Ted.Baxter: Ye
Tom.Baxter: Nih, didn't I tell you that this place is mad?
SCRA|Aloysius.Rhade: *He Yawns* Well, your IFF Reads Zoners.
Nihil.Baxter: you did, and you're right
SCRA|Aloysius.Rhade: Frankly, I could care less about your life story.
Tom.Baxter: It's true, we're from FP2
SCRA|Aloysius.Rhade: Oh. Good.
SCRA|Aloysius.Rhade: We hate Zoners.
Nihil.Baxter: You asked, didnt you?
Tom.Baxter: we hate them too, but you don't listen to life stories
Nihil.Baxter: heh, who doesnt hate zoners?
SCRA|Aloysius.Rhade: And yet you use their IFF?
Nihil.Baxter: and their women too
SCRA|Aloysius.Rhade: *He Yawns* I've heard enough, I think.
Tom.Baxter: the ships we've sto.... bought on FP2 were made this way
SCRA|Aloysius.Rhade: Gentlemen, you have your orders. Burn them.
Nihil.Baxter: rhade
SCRA|MIL-Jovanovic: Copy that comrade, going in hot
SCRA|Oliver.Zablosky: Ahh, good...
Nihil.Baxter: oh no!
Ted.Baxter: Tell ma i love her
SCRA|Aloysius.Rhade: Beautiful.
SCRA|Oliver.Zablosky: only thing you made clear is that you force people to pay you their earnings
SCRA|Oliver.Zablosky: You see we don't like that kind
Well, this looks like a standard enounter, doesn't it? Some short questions to find out whether potential targets can be attacked, or not.
Concering the roleplay: The SCRA hates Zoners. Nothing new, and it's refreshing to see it not happen on some generic chars. The question is, why would it not hate pirates? So if it doesn't hate pirates, why were the present SCRA sure they would deal with the kind of Zoners they usually hate. I daresay there aren't many Zoner IFFed pirates, but if the SCRA is hating Zoners and pirates, why bother with a conversation then - a kind of pseudo-alibi for the lolgank?
The revealing parts:
SCRA|Oliver.Zablosky: You talk a lot eh
SCRA|MIL-Jovanovic: *yawns*
SCRA|Aloysius.Rhade: Frankly, I could care less about your life story.
In addition the usual swarming around targets has started before two sentences were spoken, actually the proof the outcome of this encounter was already clear, despite the fact that you haven't ever ecnountered Zoners who are hating Zoners (or those Zoners who are prominent in Sirius).
If you do not like interaction - in a positive case the Baxters might finally learn what the SCRA is, but even more important, the SCRA might learn some things about the unformed, poor, and unverprivileged side of the Zoners, not flying around in fancy Juggies or polished Whales - why do you believe you would be playing roles? Is your understanding of roleplay exhausted beyond the colors of your reputation sheets?
Also, six SCRA VHFs against three Rocs is great sports, "Gentlemen". Not getting two of them even greater. I'd have preferred to see you proceed to Tau-23 where you've found your new grankgrounds, instead of disturbing and destroying roleplay we're launching only once every three months, and I'm talking here of roleplay, not the crap you've performed here. If you really want to improve anything start with interaction. There are pretty many Disco Servers around where you don't have to bother with letting your characters talk.
To sum it up:
- You're whining because you potentially could not dock in Baffin anymore, since one of your players hasn't taken into account that Zoners might deny docking rights to a shared faction vessel causing trouble at FP9
- The said player tries some nice RP by visiting 74 and USING interaction, just to ask me a few minutes later if we can forget the RP scene, in a way that it never happened.
- Then I had to see your definition of standard roleplay tonight
And now please tell me, why the hell should you be proud of your roleplay?
Quote:Well, this looks like a standard enounter, doesn't it? Some short questions to find out whether potential targets can be attacked, or not.
Ignoring the sarcastic tone, that's not the case. We do not ask people questions with the sole purpose of finding out if we can kill them. Sometimes we do, it's called being suspicious. In your case we had all the reasons to be suspicious. Potential pirate and a Zoner-affiliated pilot.
Quote:Concering the roleplay: The SCRA hates Zoners. Nothing new, and it's refreshing to see it not happen on some generic chars. The question is, why would it not hate pirates? So if it doesn't hate pirates, why were the present SCRA sure they would deal with the kind of Zoners they usually hate. I daresay there aren't many Zoner IFFed pirates, but if the SCRA is hating Zoners and pirates, why bother with a conversation then - a kind of pseudo-alibi for the lolgank?
The SCRA dislikes Pirates heavily, but we can't assume you are pirates just because you carry Pirate ID. That's called metagaming. We have to actually see you commit an act of piracy to be labelled as pirates. But, we are certain that you are Zoners due to your IFF, and that is all we need to know that you are connected to them one way or another. We have clear orders, shoot all Zoners who are not marked with specific tags in their names. You can figure out for yourself who those tags are.
Quote:In addition the usual swarming around targets has started before two sentences were spoken, actually the proof the outcome of this encounter was already clear, despite the fact that you haven't ever ecnountered Zoners who are hating Zoners (or those Zoners who are prominent in Sirius).
It's good to trap a target before he has even opened his mouth. Just to ensure you can't run should the encounter prove to be hostile.
Quote:If you do not like interaction - in a positive case the Baxters might finally learn what the SCRA is, but even more important, the SCRA might learn some things about the unformed, poor, and unverprivileged side of the Zoners, not flying around in fancy Juggies or polished Whales - why do you believe you would be playing roles? Is your understanding of roleplay exhausted beyond the colors of your reputation sheets?
You assume things, how do you know if we do not like interaction? Why else would we even approach you? It's simple really. You are connected to the Zoners via your IFF, which justifies our attack based on background history that has given us the permission to engage any and all Zoner-affiliates if they aren't marked with specific tags in their name.
Quote:Also, six SCRA VHFs against three Rocs is great sports, "Gentlemen". Not getting two of them even greater. I'd have preferred to see you proceed to Tau-23 where you've found your new grankgrounds, instead of disturbing and destroying roleplay we're launching only once every three months, and I'm talking here of roleplay, not the crap you've performed here. If you really want to improve anything start with interaction. There are pretty many Disco Servers around where you don't have to bother with letting your characters talk.
Here we go again with the: "If you don't provide a novel you are not Role-Playing" argument. Frankly won't even bother arguing that point. You can have your opinion if you want, I don't really care about it. Ganking is subjective, to us 6vs3 is not considered ganking. (For the record, we split into three wings, so at most, you each had two on your six)
Quote:To sum it up:
- You're whining because you potentially could not dock in Baffin anymore, since one of your players hasn't taken into account that Zoners might deny docking rights to a shared faction vessel causing trouble at FP9
- The said player tries some nice RP by visiting 74 and USING interaction, just to ask me a few minutes later if we can forget the RP scene, in a way that it never happened.
- Then I had to see your definition of standard roleplay tonight
Now you are bringing up Omicroners Role-Play into this? Oh what a surprise, here I thought it had only to do with your character called the Baxters. That might explain all the sarcastic comments I had to go through to reach this quote. Well let me remind you, just like the Corsairs hate, just like the Bretonian dislike you, just like the Outcasts dislike you, and just like we hate you. It's your actions which has given rise to certain consequences. There is nobody to blame here but the Omicroners. Your decisions. And this is what the result is.
And now if we are going to play the chat-log game. What a nice show of "Role-Play" you are expressing here:
[09.01.2011 22:56:15] Nihil.Baxter: *laughs hard*
[09.01.2011 22:56:40] Nihil.Baxter: you can't shoot down a zoner in a 3v1 *laughs*
[09.01.2011 22:56:54] Nihil.Baxter: You're pathetic trigger happy fools
[09.01.2011 22:57:24] Nihil.Baxter: *laughs* I won't forgot your fail either
[09.01.2011 22:58:05] Nihil.Baxter: " I r hate zoners" *laughs*
I see plenty of lame OOC references here, but that's fine, this is Role-Play and we are not of course Role-Playing because you got shot at.
Tony said things very well, but I'm going to add on to this point:
Quote:I'd have preferred to see you proceed to Tau-23 where you've found your new grankgrounds, instead of disturbing and destroying roleplay we're launching only once every three months, and I'm talking here of roleplay, not the crap you've performed here. If you really want to improve anything start with interaction.
You do not have the right to roleplay undisturbed by others, especially factions hostile to you. And quite frankly, you are not the judge of what is RP and isn't.
And:
Quote:There are pretty many Disco Servers around where you don't have to bother with letting your characters talk.
And there are servers where players can't harm other players. I suggest you find one of those if your response to being shot down ends up with what really amounts to be a "Q_Q you shot me" rant.
' Wrote:Tony said things very well, but I'm going to add on to this point:
You do not have the right to roleplay undisturbed by others, especially factions hostile to you. And quite frankly, you are not the judge of what is RP and isn't.
And:
And there are servers where players can't harm other players. I suggest you find one of those if your response to being shot down ends up with what really amounts to be a "Q_Q you shot me" rant.
Nah, not a rant. Whether you like it, or not, you haven't been playing roles. You were just out for PvP. And it fits to the quote by Lucas I've included.
You cannot know of course, but I actually enjoyed sitting in NY a longer whole ago reading the system broadcast of some SCRA. Was quite nice, and it was revolutionary propaganda. Then I thought 'Yeah, these guys like roleplay'.
Again, you are not in any position to judge what is RP and what is not, and what is playing a role, and what isn't. Why? Because you clearly don't understand the concept of playing a role.
If you are my enemy I have no reason to sit and chat with you, to trade life stories, insults, or my faction's history, goals or anything else. If you are my enemy, I am out to destroy you. That is my role as a military pilot. I'm not a scholar, historian, or talk show host while also being a military pilot.
Just because you enjoy listening to our propaganda broadcasts but don't enjoy being shot at by our guns, it doesn't invalidate any part of our RP as both are equal in our eyes.
So, do you have something else to say besides your whining?
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