depending on how 4.85 is i may make some of my chars factioners til lthen il ljust pass along idead to the fficial ones with my various indie es and work to get them passed (woreked with the ln capship restriction allbeit a bit extream:)(i know you made the cal lbut any ln who knows me knows id nagg them to crap about restricting them
' Wrote:And what you are missing is that the Order infocard lists liberty as HOSTILE. So what was happening was you were trying to tell other order players that they were not allowed to follow what their infocard says. That is trying to enforce non-cannon rp. Thats why you are wrong.
Excuse me, but please point out to me where exactly in the Order ID info that says indy capwhores can send their unsupported(OORP much) Osirises into New York, or hide in Alaska, spamming crap on the system channel?
Liberty might be HOSTILE to the Order but that doesn't mean Liberty should have to put up with the things I mentioned above.
' Wrote:Elvin, the problem here is that you are misrepresenting what happened with the BS and the THC. Liberty is an enemy of the Order, BS was trying to stop THC from treating them as such. You are in KNF, how would you feel if someone from outside came in and said your not allowed to treat the Blood Dragons or the GC as hostile? That is not ok, and that is what this is about.
That can't really happen, as I am one of the faction representatives in this case. Altough, If Lotek comes and says " From now on, noone will attack Dragons " I will respect it. After all, it would mean there may be peace comming between Kusari and Dragons. ( Well, that's a nice dream)
And I know that the BS was actually killed for attacking Liberty, more or less, not for being Oorp whore next to Manhattan. But I still agree with that step... In fact I agree with the "order" to not enter Liberty as well, it is RP wise, contradicts with ID partialy, but Nomad war is long gone, and Order forces are not called terrorists, nor they want to.
I buy things I don't want to make an impression on people I don't like.
Errr. What? Outcast ceasefire against the IMG? That would be NON-CANON RP. So no you can't.
And if someone was docking a capital vessel on Buffalo to buy the ships that are sold their, when they undocked they wouldn't be in a capital vessel, so there'd be no muss and certainly no fuss. Buffalo only sells the Dagger, the Bloodhound and the Barghest. So my policy doesn't restrict purchasing of equipment and it doesn't enforce non-canon RP. No gunboat patrols emanate from Buffalo, so by both the criteria I state, that rule is enforceable. The only time I cannot enforce that policy (And do not enforce that policy) is if the vessel in question is buying equipment from the base. And if that's the reason they give me it's dandy.
And if the Outcast shooting the "Smuggler" just said to any factionized Outcast, RoS, SoB and 101st alike. "He was carrying artifacts" You'll likely believe him, but that is giving said vessel your blessing. What you do not condemn, you condone. If you chose not to believe him and gave valid RP reasons for not believing him, then you ARE within your rights to shoot the crap out of him. End of.
Saint Del is considered a holy healer of diseases of children, but also as a protector of cattle.
' Wrote:Excuse me, but please point out to me where exactly in the Order ID info that says indy capwhores can send their unsupported(OORP much) Osirises into New York, or hide in Alaska, spamming crap on the system channel?
Liberty might be HOSTILE to the Order but that doesn't mean Liberty should have to put up with the things I mentioned above.
And could you stop being so rude, please?
I am sorry, I forgot that at some point it became in vogue to have factions not fight their enemies. Lets list them, the Bretonians and the OC, and the Mollies, the Kusari and the Corsairs, the IMG and the Corsairs. Thats all well and good, but when a member of one of those NPC factions, starts blowing other members of the same npc faction to hell for not following, that is where we have crossed a line.
' Wrote:Excuse me, but please point out to me where exactly in the Order ID info that says indy capwhores can send their unsupported(OORP much) Osirises into New York, or hide in Alaska, spamming crap on the system channel?
Liberty might be HOSTILE to the Order but that doesn't mean Liberty should have to put up with the things I mentioned above.
All factions have to put up with things like that. And there's no rule or Admin statement saying unsupported battleships are ooRP (the original Osiris was unsupported at one point when rescuing Trent and Juni, I believe). Such an announcement would be the same as disallowing indie battleships, which Igiss is obviously not going to do. Anyway, that's been dealt with since then, with a rule keeping Order capships from coming through the Alaska gate. But before that, nothing that was done was technically ooRP, just annoying and poor form.
' Wrote:Indy fellow blows up someone for no good reason that he can prove, then you can declare him a pain in the ass and reduce him to his component atoms. One thing Official Factions DO have is a measure of weight behind their actions. An independent cannot set NPC faction policy if their is a faction there to set it already, neither can an unofficial faction. An unofficial LR faction cannot police my ban on capital vessels docking on Buffalo. My LR can.
So here you say Official factions can set NPC faction policy.. The very act of setting it would be to set one that is non-cannon RP, for if it were not, you wouldn't need to set it in the first place..
' Wrote:Errr. What? Outcast ceasefire against the IMG? That would be NON-CANON RP. So no you can't.
And here you say they can't.
' Wrote:And if the Outcast shooting the "Smuggler" just said to any factionized Outcast, RoS, SoB and 101st alike. "He was carrying artifacts" You'll likely believe him, but that is giving said vessel your blessing. What you do not condemn, you condone. If you chose not to believe him and gave valid RP reasons for not believing him, then you ARE within your rights to shoot the crap out of him. End of.
Let me repeat the bolded statement. And gave valid RP reasons for not believing him. Just like an independent would have to give, no? So even the faction cannot do it without giving RP reasons, just an an indie or unofficial faction.. An unnofficial faction could question that indie about blowing up the trader, same as the official one. You say that unnofficial faction member or indie must get the faction's consent.. So what if he didn't have it, I screenshotted the whole thing and sent in a report.. What rule am I supposed to quote?
Furthermore, do you really think he'd be sanctioned when I go and say; "This Outcast killed an Artifact smuggler without our permission, he needs a sanction." No, he wouldn't be sanctioned. The admins would take one look at Outcast killed an Artifact smuggler and be done with the report right there. All of the Kiretsu have killed or pirated diamond traders, artifact smugglers, etc. Did we ever ask or receive GC's permission? No. Its expected of us to pirate those people so we do it. We never needed permission, and I guarantee we never would have gotten sanctioned for killing a Diamond trader refusing to drop his cargo, because we didn't ask GC for permission first.
dab, i flamed you, you flamed me, i think we never agreed one with other, but this is first time that i must say:
I TOTALLY AGREE WITH YOU !
and zelot, i asked this on corsair chat, and i typed something similar in other thread...and i know that in the same chat someone other asked that too....
Anyone, faction or indie, is allowed to do anything their NPC faction and ID allows them to do, and other members of the same NPC faction, whether faction (unless it's a higher-up in the same faction) or indie, aren't allowed to try and stop them. If an indie Outcast blows up a trader for carrying artifacts, and for some reason the RoS liked that trader and didn't believe he was carrying artifacts, then they'd need proof that he was not carrying artifacts if they wanted to punish the indie Outcast without being sanctioned.
On the other hand, if that indie Outcast didn't want to get sanctioned himself, he'd better have taken screenshots of his own...