The Gunboat, in logical concepts, is the smallest and most agile ships of the capital class of vessels. Their purpose was a merger of a fighter and a cruiser, made to hunt down enemy bombers, as well as other small warships. This, in essence, makes them hated by both snubs, as it is larger and more powerful than them, and by the other capital vessels, as they can hit harder then a snubcraft while being agile enough to dodge their weapons from afar.
However, this conversation is going to revolve around the fact that, as a Gunboat pilot, you have to make a choice at being able to take down enemy snubcraft easier, an effective capital harasser, or a balance of both. Should you go down the path of being able to take down strikecraft(as that is what a gunboat was made to do), people will constantly scorn your choice of loadout of Solaris cannons, should you employ the fightercraft-killer gunboat to its role. Should you go down the path of cap harassment, you will get verbally attacked about severely damaging other capital vessels with those powerful Cerberus cannons and razors. Should you go down the middle road, you will be disavantaged in both snub warfare and cap warfare.
My question is why are gunboats hated for being deployed effectively? They are made to kill fightercraft and cruisers, yet somehow they are hated upon should they be armed to handle one group better than the other. If there is so much complaint about these variations of loadout, why do we keep them? Why not make the Gunboat ineffective at its job, in order to make everyone else happy? The same would go for other capital vessels. Why keep the snub-killer guns and cap-killer mortars if people are going to dislike the deployment of these weapons?
To me, it's quite annoying when there's a wave of bombers on the way to assist in a cap fight and we get taken out by solaris gunboats protecting the caps before even reaching the target,
BUT BUT BUT BUT...
It's a battle tactic. Wanna get rid of solaris gunboats? Log a cerberus gunboat. Wanna get rid of Cerberus gunboats? Log a bomber. Battle tactics.
Just as they can be tactically used against fighters, things can be tactically used against them.
I have no clue of how to fly capitals (and thus gunboats) in general, so my opinion doesn't matter much.
I personally find Gunboats the most overpowered ship class in the game. The problem is that the ship is too competent one way or another. Gunboat missiles track so insanely that there's a 90% chance it'll hit REGARDLESS of how you're maneuvering in a fighter if you don't have countermeasures. The guns (while cerbs can be argued) are all stupidly effective against snubcraft and a competent gunboat pilot will easily be able to survive against 3-4 fighters (even if there's a bomber or two in the midst) for a very long while.
It's meant to be an anti-snub class, but it's pretty much impossible to kill in both snubs and capitals. The gunboats are just too small and agile for capitals to hit, and they're too tanky for fighters to do anything without mass numbers. Cruisers maaay have a chance of catching up somehow, but the gunboat is faster (iirc) and will just gain distance and pummel it easily as the cruiser misses everything. I've seen a gunboat solo a dread, as the dread was absolutely powerless and wasn't able to hit the gunboat no matter what he measures he took.
It's a hard counter with no hard counters, besides having another gunboat kill the first one.
Look, Inferno, that's mostly salt from people that hate capwhores. It doesn't matter what loadout your gunboat has, be it Solaris, basic, or be it Razor or missiles. People will always come with "Did you really need to throw in a gunboat in a snubfight?" They blame you for coming with something that they can't outmatch that easily, and then they come with a bunch of snubs, team up against you and the fight has ended. Isn't that basically how it should be? If one weaker ship doesn't suffice, take a whole bunch of them and throw them against the big one.
Or they didn't manage to get the numbers, lose or retreat, call you a lolwut and open up the next-best feedback thread. ;3
(10-27-2016, 03:58 PM)Ramke Wrote: I have no clue of how to fly capitals (and thus gunboats) in general, so my opinion doesn't matter much.
I personally find Gunboats the most overpowered ship class in the game. The problem is that the ship is too competent one way or another. Gunboat missiles track so insanely that there's a 90% chance it'll hit REGARDLESS of how you're maneuvering in a fighter if you don't have countermeasures. The guns (while cerbs can be argued) are all stupidly effective against snubcraft and a competent gunboat pilot will easily be able to survive against 3-4 fighters (even if there's a bomber or two in the midst) for a very long while.
It's meant to be an anti-snub class, but it's pretty much impossible to kill in both snubs and capitals. The gunboats are just too small and agile for capitals to hit, and they're too tanky for fighters to do anything without mass numbers. Cruisers maaay have a chance of catching up somehow, but the gunboat is faster (iirc) and will just gain distance and pummel it easily as the cruiser misses everything. I've seen a gunboat solo a dread, as the dread was absolutely powerless and wasn't able to hit the gunboat no matter what he measures he took.
It's a hard counter with no hard counters, besides having another gunboat kill the first one.
We frequently pop Gunboats in VHFs. In fact, we will usually down more gunboats in fighters than other VHFs. In kill ratio it's Transports>Gunboats>VHFs.
One well flown fighter can be a problem for three fighters. Even a well piloted gunboat isn't going to be too much of a problem for three smart fighters.
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(10-27-2016, 04:11 PM)The Unioners Wrote: We frequently pop Gunboats in VHFs. In fact, we will usually down more gunboats in fighters than other VHFs. In kill ratio it's Transports>Gunboats>VHFs.
One well flown fighter can be a problem for three fighters. Even a well piloted gunboat isn't going to be too much of a problem for three smart fighters.
I'm talking about the skill ceiling of the ship class, not the average people. A large majority of gunboats struggle to turret steer (giving up shooting half the time) or don't do it at all and just end up running or flying straight and shooting in turret view. Those opponents are easy and don't pose a threat to most groups of people.
Have you seen Wesker or Jayce flying into a group fight? It turns the tide of battle regardless of what kind of tactics and skill levels the other side has. That's what I'm talking about, and I figure that's why people end up hating gunboats for. It's just INCREDIBLY hard to kill them, and they're a constant nuisance with instant damage to unaware snubs. God forbid they use missiles in those group fights, too.
Some of this could be alleviated, imho, if the difference in size, scale, speed and power was much broader between ship classes in Discovery. However, due to the aiming mechanic, apart from restricting gun turn rate drastically to compensate, it is hard to buff caps without nerfing smaller things in the process and introducing instakill scenarios.
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I don't think they're hated for being utilized effectively. People only complain about their use, when GB tips the "balance" of a (snub) group fight, when numbers are even. Plus they're not as OP as they used to be, back when they had those GB Cerbs at 1000m/s (?), they could completely shut down any fight.
Also this:
(10-27-2016, 04:11 PM)The Unioners Wrote: One well flown fighter can be a problem for three fighters. Even a well piloted gunboat isn't going to be too much of a problem for three smart fighters.
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