Hey y'all. So before you read on, get that this isn't really a serious problem.
So I've been thinking. And thinking. And I've come to the conclusion that the fact that just about every (take note that I said "just about", not all) official faction has their own line of ships. Not just fighters, but some (not all, notice that I said some) have Battleships, Gunboats, and Destroyers. Take the Rouges, for example. Their info card states that they are a "Motley assortment of criminals" (courtesy of the wiki). How can a motley assortment of criminals have the technology, the resources, and the money to make destroyers, gunboats, and the like? Yes, they had snubs in vanilla but think about it. Do the Crips (or any other gang) make their own weapons? Cars? Think about the logic.
Think of cars as a fighter. Everyone has one. Yeah, maybe the Rogues make heir own cars. But for destroyers, that doesn't work. That's like the Crips or any street gang making their own line of tanks. Then take the Lane Hackers. Now I can understand them having the technology being ex-Ageira technology employees, and their smart and most likely have the money. But piracy money from heists won't cover the cost for a fleet of destroyers. Who is funding them? It just doesn't add up. I'm not referring to Corsairs and Outcasts, who have house systems. They can have battleships and the like. But what separates them from the petty criminals (i.e Rogues, Gaians, Mollys, GC, Hessians, etc.) And yes, Hessians may be revolutionary but are still "composed of both idealists and simple pirates..." (courtesy of the wiki). Simple pirates don't have Battleships.
Now, if your answer to the top part is, "Well, we need to balance it so the criminals don't get wiped out". Criminals aren't supposed to have military grade weaponry. Gangs don't have army grade weapons and tech. Yes, you can steal them, but Liberty doesn't make Scyllas. So they cant steal them. They make their own lines of ships. Criminals are supposed to be doing guerrilla warfare against their respective houses. Now certain quasi-military groups like the Blood Dragons (used to be part of Kusari until the whole shogun revolution thingie crap, which was before vanilla), the Lane Hackers, the Corsairs, the Outcasts; it makes sense to give them military grade weaponry for obvious reasons. They are either smart and or are houses and have the resources and the time, and money, etc.
But let's move on to another part of this. Lawful factions. Like the IMG. Why the hell do they have capital ships? No, just no. Don't even start with me on the Zoners. They're supposed to be like the Swiss. Neutral in all wars, no military action. But for some reason they have battleships and/or carriers.
I guess this is all just a pet peeve of mine. But here's another thing.
Why are there so many dang planets and or moons? We're talking about Gallia here, by the way. Why? Their are 7 planets/moons in Languedoc, 7 in Dauphine, 10 in Burgundy, 8 in Lorraine, 15 (I may have missed some) in Ile de France! 15 celestial bodies?! Does that make sense? All within very close proximity to each other. It scientifically doesn't make sense because the gravity would combine all eight planets together unless each one is VERY small, and very far apart. And, if they all have the same orbit, they'd crash into each other.
I know what I'm saying is ridiculous, but I'm just wondering why. I know that having big ships makes it fun to play other factions, and encourages playing, but still. And having more planets makes it pretty cool looking and interesting. It's just the logic of it. Now I know you'll say "Well FL doesn't even make sense at all, it's not logical". Because you are right. There are no moving bases and planets based on orbits. But the principle still stands. Roberts tried his best for 2003. Now I know you can't make orbits and that jazz, due to the way the game works, but at least have less planets and bodies. Just less planets, and not every criminal faction having destroyers. But, alas, at the end of the day, it doesn't really matter. I'm most likely just nuts and this is all just a pet peeve that nobody else noticed. Or did anyone else notice?
(12-22-2016, 07:34 AM)ASimpleMan Wrote: But let's move on to another part of this. Lawful factions. Like the IMG. Why the hell do they have capital ships? No, just no. Don't even start with me on the Zoners. They're supposed to be like the Swiss. Neutral in all wars, no military action. But for some reason they have battleships and/or carriers.
Thank you.
(12-22-2016, 07:34 AM)ASimpleMan Wrote: Why are there so many dang planets and or moons? We're talking about Gallia here, by the way. Why? Their are 7 planets/moons in Languedoc, 7 in Dauphine, 10 in Burgundy, 8 in Lorraine, 15 (I may have missed some) in Ile de France! 15 celestial bodies?! Does that make sense?
How many do we have in our solar system? What's the exact count of planets, dwarf planets and moons? 1 star, 8 planets, dwarf planets, like Pluto and Ceres, our moon, Phobos, Deimos, the four major moons of Jupiter, Pluto's moon... It's not really unrealistic. Your next point is valid however.
(12-22-2016, 07:34 AM)ASimpleMan Wrote: All within very close proximity to each other. It scientifically doesn't make sense because the gravity would combine all eight planets together unless each one is VERY small, and very far apart. And, if they all have the same orbit, they'd crash into each other.
Engine limitations allow us to represent solar bodies to this extent only. Sizes and distances will never be realistic. At this point it all boils down to your imagination.
The Rogues got Destroyers due to their close ties with the Mollys, who have the access to the resources to manufacture much larger ships, while the Rogues have the idea on what they'll be up against.
The IMG have a gunboat for security and a Battlecruiser that is designed specifically for extreme deep space exploration and frontier travel, well beyond the borders.
Zoners have a mobile freeport which shouldn't have Battleship guns, and a Carrier that shouldn't exist. The Q-Ship is for all intent and purposes just a reinforced and well armed transport re-imagined for security of stations and long distance convoys through Outcast or Corsair space, who are known to pirate/kill people who trespass in their territory unannounced and uninvited.
Gallia was made to look pretty and be interesting. It only succeeds at one of those. You can guess which one by looking at how active it is.
The scylla wasn't actually designed by the rogues nor mollies either- "the best minds available were recruited at gunpoint and put to work with utmost secrecy to craft a capital class vessel capable of defending critical infrastructure against the heaviest of hostile incursions". From then, they mostly just have to gather the resources and put it together, as well as maintain, repair and crew the vessels.
I do agree that the planets/moons are fairly unrealistic, especially in terms of scale- but hey its a game so you gotta go for what works and is fun, over what is more realiistic i guess
But seriously, let's not try and find logic behind a game. It begins with the weird sizes of all the objects (Station interior bigger than exterior, planets being tiny compared to real life, Battleships being really small (compare the window textures) to compared with fighters) and continues with player behavior, battleships rebuild after two hours, which is even with Nanobot-technology a bit weird, and people being able to prevent mighty battleship engines and cloaks with firing a single, unspecific Cruise Disruptor, not even allowing Battleships to do something against troll-snubs.
Seriously, don't put too much thought into the realism behind it. It's just a game and once you try to want to make it more realistic, which will never happen, not with this old game, it's just wasted time. Things are set. Enjoy them as they are.
Freelancer is a game. Games are supposed to be fun. You don't add something because it is realistic. You add it because it's fun, and then you venture into the deepest corners of your imagination to explain why it is realistic. This mostly applies for pirates having caps. Since the Vanilla Houses used to have, like, 10 battleships each, and pirates none, now that the pirates do have a couple, we can say that the Houses have 20 or 30 or 50 or 150 each. Or 500, in case of certain Houses. That way the comparable strength is balanced.
Concerning planets, it's an engine limitation, as Thyr has already clarified. And everything will be located on the plain for as long as we don't have a three-dimensional map.
Well I did say "Roberts tried his best for 2003. Now I know you can't make orbits and that jazz, due to the way the game works." The way the game works means the engine. But yeah I thought I'd just point this out and get it off my chest. It wasn't a really serious post or problem.
(12-22-2016, 07:34 AM)ASimpleMan Wrote: Hey y'all. So before you read on, get that this isn't really a serious problem.
So I've been thinking. And thinking. And I've come to the conclusion that the fact that just about every (take note that I said "just about", not all) official faction has their own line of ships. Not just fighters, but some (not all, notice that I said some) have Battleships, Gunboats, and Destroyers. Take the Rouges, for example. Their info card states that they are a "Motley assortment of criminals" (courtesy of the wiki). How can a motley assortment of criminals have the technology, the resources, and the money to make destroyers, gunboats, and the like? Yes, they had snubs in vanilla but think about it. Do the Crips (or any other gang) make their own weapons? Cars? Think about the logic.
I get what you're saying but, comparing the Rogues to the Crips is a bit of a hyperbole. The Rogues run an interstellar crime empire for chrissakes, racking up profits comparable to any of the house corporations. I think they can afford to build and maintain a few capital vessels.
IMO you need to put into different perspective. IRL we live on planet and we have private military organizations with more firepower than some nations, terrorist groups with tanks and armed vehicles. FL is set in a far future, aprox. 2000 years from now, with interstellar nations, planet-cities, billions and billions of people. A "Motley assortment of criminals" in this scale can mean more people than any nation have now. The infocards in vanilla were meant to be a guideline for player imagination. Of course some were poorly written, like the Manhattan one, stating that the planet have 20 million inhabitants, but still. when you put the universe of Freelancer into proper perspective it makes some sense.