I would be satisfied if IMG counterplay with self-destruct means was accepted and not just entirely averted with instant-action sleep teleports behind you gas attack. That thing doesn't work as fast as you would like to think. Aland is not a small room, it's relatively huge station.
Are IMG now going to wake up in front of obese Bretonian lord who telepathically impales Mollies on a crumpet?
(03-23-2019, 05:21 PM)Omicron Wrote: I would be satisfied if IMG counterplay with self-destruct means was accepted and not just entirely averted with instant-action sleep teleports behind you gas attack. That thing doesn't work as fast as you would like to think. Aland is not a small room, it's relatively huge station.
Are IMG now going to wake up in front of obese Bretonian lord who telepathically impales Mollies on a crumpet?
Reading the infocard, I was very unimpressed. IMG outlined a full self destruct plan, which is then bypassed by Marines breaching the control room and spreading sleeping gas through the sprinkler system...before the control room started the sequences...?
The entire infocard doesn't make sense with IMG's preparations to me.
Natsumi Hideyoshi (The Order) | Alexis Hunter (Liberty Navy) |
(03-23-2019, 04:57 PM)Madvillain Wrote: Having the storyline being decided by ingame battles is a terrible idea.
There's plenty of factions that should have a gigantic skilled playerpool but have nothing, and there's factions that are dominating disco while inrp they are tiny.
Then there's also the issue of huge skill gaps in PvP, that would cause a tiny minority of the playerbase to get way too much power (as they always seem to team up together already).
I see a big part of the "problem" being discussed lies with the community.
When a NPC faction loses something, don't consider it a personal defeat but a table setting because that's what it is.
And yes, if you ever been a gamemaster in a tabletop RP game you'd understand that having everyone on a winning streak all of the time is -not- good for your game.
Players will object when you take something from them, they always will. But at the same time, and I know this sounds messed up and difficult to swallow:
players don't always know what is good for them.
No, its the other way around. If everyone joined RHA tomorrow they should at least be able to justify keeping all their bases, if not going on an offensive in some way, right? If they have a large base of players, they should be able to get a lot more done than a base with 3-4, even if it were a house. That house having a low player base can be rectified in other ways.
What that means is that things are also being done badly on the other end as well. If the factions that are supposed to be the biggest don't have the biggest interest or population, that is a separate problem to solve. In Gallia's case, its not that it needed something to entice more interest, it was 2 things, 1 was that the majority didn't like Gallia, and the other was that since they were being made to win, no one had to join them to help them advance.
The imbalance wouldn't have happened if people knew they had to be on the side they supported in winning, and actually fly to support it. (which means that they should have LOST LONG AGO, and we'd be on to other things)
Back in the day, factions were like teams. You were careful, a fleet faction knew it was pvp heavy, so they tried keeping up skills, etc. So yeah in Liberty, if the LN is shrinking, you're bound to see the Rogues more assertive.
Sadly, that is freedom. If a bunch of players with skill get together to back a side, if they can bring the gameplay to the table, then that should be the bottom line. Maybe we shouldn't be going after shipyards if we can't actually capture it? Some people want what makes sense imagination wize (which is for D&D, not a video game), but then what point is pvp at all then? I really don't understand whats so hard to get about it. If you make it known that the objective is open to win on either side, players then divide up and go to work for their goal. If they knew there was a point, they'd go out of their way to make an indie for a battle event and not just let it pass.
Everyone acts like ' oh its not a big deal' but that really depends on why you play here and what you do it for. The free open ended aspect of the server is what drew me here, and I have believed a lot of players came for that. As time goes on, as more is dicated, the principle ruins the whole point of being here.
As far as I'm concerned, capturing any station should require a commensurate in game event, and being able to do that should come after you've well shown you have the actions in place. You're telling me that if the devs decided to take an important station from YOUR FACTION and not give you any pvp opportunity to defend it, and that having a core 4/5 base next to it with 7 wp's didn't mean squat, you'd be happy. There seems less and less reason to stay when it seems like all the actual things you do in the actual game environment is only a quaint thing we do between pre-planned changes.
Why are people so afraid to push the devs for a BATTLE SYSTEM, so if you do have more or better players, it shows, as it should. Balance is not the point in warfare, or every game. Imbalance is sometimes the point. If you want to win, work to get things in your favor. That used to mean, having good players on your side. Ironically, Bretonian side had the ships, had spies on the job, was working out diplomacy etc. But since this is how it goes, it doesn't really seem there is any point to trying.
(03-23-2019, 05:39 PM)JonasHudson Wrote: Why are people so afraid to push the devs for a BATTLE SYSTEM, so if you do have more or better players, it shows, as it should.
Look man your proposal doesn't solve the problem that's discussed and in addition creates even more. You're wrong, it's not the faction with more and/or better players who should win. Those are ooRP numbers. Making them the only factors when it comes to determining a win or lose in a roleplay environment causes a lot of trouble.
I fully understand the players who want to take part in the story development, but I also understand the developers who tell the story, because once a storyline is written, it is often hard to squeeze in story development done by the players. The devs lack an immediate platform for communication with the players and the players lack understanding for the fact that not everything they imagine is compatible with the planned storyline.
So are we going to get that podcast/twitch thing? Or scratch that and better yet, a yellow statement or promise that affirms things as they are need to change, followed by actions and solutions thereafter that show it.
Will there also be an admittance of how the Omega things were handled was wrong?
The worst possible thing that could be done is rug sweeping. With the coup, we were told that like of thing was coming to a stop.
(03-26-2019, 10:02 AM)Lythrilux Wrote: So are we going to get that podcast/twitch thing?
Yeah, it's happening, Lyth. Just give them a bit of time. There's also already systems being worked on to increase faction agency and possession over their own story-lines to prevent repeats of recent controversies. Don't want to say anything more until the staff speak on the subject.
THE SYNDIC LEAGUES
(A co-operative of Rheinland's Shipping Unions, retired from a life of piracy.)
(03-26-2019, 10:02 AM)Lythrilux Wrote: So are we going to get that podcast/twitch thing?
Yeah, it's happening, Lyth. Just give them a bit of time. There's also already systems being worked on to increase faction agency and possession over their own story-lines to prevent repeats of recent controversies. Don't want to say anything more until the staff speak on the subject.
That's good and all but it's had zero visibility to the community at large, and sounds like the exact same thing you were telling me in this thread before the 'Aland patch' dropped. I don't think the community will be convinced if information is coming from a proxy, it's not very transparent.
Also I'm not confident a twitch/podcast is the way forward.
I would rather see developers answer legit concerns on forums so it has lasting and more public statement. I understand how hard for them is to take into account parts of player made roleplay and then get flack for not taking it all into account. Like, people, either you adapt to what is happening or we go back to ages when nothing was taken into account.
Lyth, get back in Core lead and stop being useless to me
Ahauheauhuea
On a more serious note, Devs are aware of the issues and working to improve communication w leaders about changes and story devevolpment.
And as Snak said, it been far worst in the past, im not really willing exchange what we have for what ppl had years ago, when absolutelly no input from factions mattered. (im sure hell frozen with me agreeing w Snak)
I posted this in the regional story Discord (the one which we use to communicate with OFLs on the regular) last night, but it doesn't lose any relevance here.
Quote:9:57 PM] Durandal: Dumping an announcement here to say that I'm very aware that communication with the story team has been spotty and that not everyone is doing their best job of documenting planned changes right now. I largely fault myself for this for having stepped back from this chat. If people could @mention Durandal in any of the regional chats here for things which have been neglected, etc, I would greatly appreciate it.
In addition, we are working on a Roleplay Canonization Request system. "Player driven" is a buzzword being thrown around a lot lately, and while we do wish for players to have an impact upon the storyline, a trend which started with Teerin, no hard and fast rules were ever set about what that level of impact actually is, or what the best way to achieve it is. We cannot simply canonize roleplay which has been done without regard for planned story elements, meaning when someone writes or does a thing, presents it to us, and says "put it in the game", we look like dickheads for saying no. We aren't trying to be dismissive or ignorant, but to make this work we need to have a proper infrastructure in place for documenting and integrating your own narratives into ours.
Sometimes we will not be able to, but many times we will. I also want to point out that anything you submit is and always was subject to change. Just because you say your faction is going to do a certain thing, that doesn't mean it's always going to happen, or happen in the way you intend. This can be for gameplay reasons (such as the Ageira gate site in Honshu), for narrative reasons, (such as the IMG not being allowed to self destruct Aland), et cetera. It does not mean we are being willfully ignorant or inconsiderate of your wants and needs.
[10:00 PM] Durandal: It takes a lot of effort to keep track of all the changes that happen here, and manpower has always been at a premium. Despite this, it isn't always as simple as hiring more people and throwing them at an issue. Please make an effort to be patient with us, and communicate in a civil manner with us. We do reserve the right, as the development team, to change things, and the story is never going to be 100% player driven. But if you make an effort to work with us and we all make an effort to communicate with each other like adults, then WE will be able to better assist you in having a more profound impact upon Discovery's various plotlines, or canonizing your own.
Another topic I wish to raise is Gallia. The war must end, and will end, with a decisive victor (I swear to god that doesn't mean Bretonia wins). To get to that point, unraveling ten years of ancient history our predecessors have left for us with absurd concepts such as Gallia not having ZoI outside the Taus for the entirety of 4.85, or Teerin's starvation doctrine, certain things must be rushed and forced, perhaps moreso to an extent than we would like at times. I think there is an opportunity for a much more dynamic roleplay environment and for us to better consider player input upon the conclusion of the war. I acknowledge that things are bad right now, and I expect them to get worse before all is said and done. But I still need to urge everyone to try to be their best selves, and allow cooler heads to prevail. There is a light at the end of the tunnel here.
[10:03 PM] Durandal: Once again, regarding the concept of a more player driven story, I implore you all to turn your attention towards the Sigmas. I made a post the other night in which I explained that the war between Kusari and Rheinland was open ended, and that we had actually been hoping to see a greater level of player impact there. As I mentioned previously, developments around Bretonia and Gallia are probably going to feel pretty artificial until things are resolved. If you want to really try your hand at changing things, the Sigmas, Kusari, and to a lesser extent the Omicrons and Rheinland, are the place to be.
[10:07 PM] Durandal: I suppose that's pretty much all I have to say right now. There's more, but I don't want to drag this out or seem like I'm beating a dead horse. All I can really do is call for solidarity, and leave a bit of a reminder. We're all supposed to be in this together, as characters in a game world. Discovery was never meant to be chess, and it isn't about one upping each other. It's about existing in that universe and playing things out. Instead of reacting with outrage to a change and asking "why?", or refuting it, perhaps come at it from the perspective of a character, and you'll find yourselves in a less hateful and more intriguing world. Let's be our best selves, think before we speak, and let cooler heads prevail. That goes for all of us here, gold or any other color under the Sirian rainbow.
Regarding the twitch/podcast thing. I jumped the gun about that because it needs to be done, and in doing so I didn't consult any other developers first meaning it isn't going to happen immediately/not everyone was on the same page. I'd like to get at least three of the dept heads sat down together on voice to address the issues we're facing right now, but you may have to settle for just me and @Unseelie. I think it's likely to happen sometime next weekend.