Junker Congress

[worldstrider]

Ah, Tink? Mind scrolling up a few posts and addressing my tag comment? I think it got lost in the discussion about other Junkers.

I have a tag in the middle of my characters name but it makes sense for everyone but me to change it. ('cause I'm sooo special) I'll alter that.

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[chovynz]

Naming: either: .:j:.full_name or Forename.:j:.Surname

I agree with Thex. I prefer the first one. Or even Name .:j:. to help the alphabetical. As long as they all do
the same whether it be .:j:. Hyung Soong, or Hyung Soong .:j:. doesnt really bother me.
I think Hyung .:j:. Soong just looks weird.

//Profile
//Prior to the role play by the Congress, Junker group identity and cooperation was almost non-existent. Many Junker characters were simply power traders to finance clans and independents other characters. Junkers did not face much hostility at that time because they did not do much. Smuggling was the only dangerous activity for a Junker and it was usually simply the venue that provided an excuse for bigger, more powerfully armed players (bounty hunters, police, navy) to pvp them with extreme prejudice when they were caught. This did not facilitate broad or deep role play and as a result, Junkers were two-dimensional, cartoonish characters. This was so much the common perception of them that if anyone varied from the "scrap hauling smuggler in a substandard ship" model, they were routinely criticized or vilified for their role play (myself and "David Grau" as examples). When I began, you did see Junkers on but it was rare to do more than say "Hi" as you passed one another. There was simply nothing to do together. My goal, in my original (and this) presentation was/is to change that without "taking over all Junkers" or restricting other's freedoms.

This could do with highlighting or bolding, as many people seem to miss the point of the .:J:.
Maybe adding in thus: "...to bring suggested depth and character to the Junker roleplay, and to give an example to other Junker as to how they could play with they want to..."

Junkers are simply a great faction to play and we want to see more role play for all playing them. What we do with the Junker Congress is voluntary and designed to not compel any Junker players to have to change their role play of any of their past, present or future Junker characters. They can ignore us if they want to. I have no intention of creating the Junker faction -- just a Junker faction. Previously I had wiped my Junker characters, dropped the proposal, changed my forum name and was playing a Hogosha just to stay out of the public eye. It was then I noticed new players coming on with a .:j:. tag before their name and stating in-game, "I work for Tinkerbell". These were people I hadn't met and didn't know. Other players retained the tag and continued to refer to the Congress as if it actually existed. So that's what drew me back to this -- a lot of Junker players liked the idea. I routinely get asked, "Aren't you the leader of the Junkers?" and I get fielded every questions about Junkers by new players. That's why this proposal is here again and hopefully better than before. We have stuff to do and, pleasantly, Junker interest by other players is now increased.

Again, more highlighting is probably a good thing as people aren't understanding the role of .:j:.

//Objectives
We plan to segment events and activities so members can concentrate on the areas and play they like. A big part of our activity will be "faction missions". Role play missions designed by faction leaders to get members "out in their characters" and discovering what Junkers and the Junker Congress do. We had done a few of these before with Xeno players and they were well received. They also help get people into the spirit of things.

Some Examples

Rescue missions into hostile territory. As in, "Find the lost Junker in the Xeno Guard system." "Move X number of goods in convoy through Kusari." "Bring back so many Hogosha pilots." Some will have prizes and cash payouts -- others will earn faction "rank points" for command and privileges. We'll try to make most activities voluntary so players who can't be on for a particular event don't feel they have missed their only chance. These will be things everyone can do. In the past we had just begun to do these with the Xenos and they were very well received.

Establish Junker Congress "jobs". Some we currently have in play: Slaving, Salvaging, Pirating, Bountying, Escorting, Spying, Exploring, Purchasing, Patrolling and Training. We will have players helping others with reputations or navigational mapping as well as starting trade routes and learning player diplomacy. We will develop rewards for good play and "karma" for bad play. We have three "secret" role plays at the moment for higher ranking members and members can earn the right to participate in them. We would also like to see Junkers working specific areas around Junker bases and let them be the chief role play developers there -- rather than having a "head" that just tells everyone what to do. The Base Adjudicators (read "governors") will fill a large part of this role.

The other areas we will work on will be identifying needs for diplomacy and action and working with other factions to fulfill them and getting individual members to create some of their own role play within the Congress and the server as well as get into the "Congress" role play.

Sounds good and will help to activate other peoples imagination with their Junker roleplay.

//Faction Rules
Role Play
- In Character chat must be used publicly at ALL times.
- Our Characters are assumed to be known to one other and to have come from a Junker lineage and family. Each must provide a brief bio describing their personal origin and goals for posting on the .:j:. website.
- the chain of command must be respected within the faction and on the server.
- Ships above bomber size must have role play with a member of the appropriate faction who is not a member of the Junker Congress to obtain it. Any "house specific" ship not sold on a Junker base must be negotiated in the same way.
- Hardware (Ships, Guns, Etc.) must match. No Outcast guns on a Corsair ship. No mixed weaponry from opposing factions.
- Regardless of the ID mounted (Junker, Mercenary, Pirate or Smuggler) a player's reputation must be in line with that of a Junker. Characters may be hostile to any faction they wish for role play reasons but may not be friendly to a faction normally hostile to Junkers.
- Unique personal role play of a .:j:. character using non-standard devices or methods must be approved by .:j:. faction leaders.
- Faction diplomacy and agreements undertaken by characters must be pre-approved by .:j:. leadership.

Just to clarify, these rules are only for the .:j:. tagged people correct? Are you putting these rules on all junkers? The reason I ask this, was stated by yourself. People perceive this as "THE junker faction" even though you have had no intention of doing that. It's an unfortunate side-effect of putting a faction proposal into place where there is no official faction as yet, and and such you still have a big job ahead of you. I suspect you will get many more referrals and such on how to be a Junker, than you first intended. There was a vacuum and you stepped into it so you attract the first attention there.

Anyway..."- Our Characters are assumed to be known to one other and to have come from a Junker lineage and family. Each must provide a brief bio describing their personal origin and goals for posting on the .:j:. website." I have a RP problem with that statement straight away. My Junker came from Manhattan. He didnt beforehand come from any Junker lineage (that he knows of) and through his own actions gained a place on Rochester and worked up from there. Apparently, I'm a well known Junker, even if a young one. Your statement means that Outsiders (like me) can't become part of the Congress, as I have no prior history with any Junkers. They are the group Hyung hooked up with, and identify the most with.

Political affiliations

Hostile
Wild
Xenos
Nomads
Hogosha
Farmers Alliance

Add Phantoms?
Would RM be considered hostile? I dont see many RM taking bribes from Junkers.

Unfriendly
Bounty Hunters
House Corporations
House Military and Police

Might be worth mentioning that Bounty Hunters are not KoS, nor should .:j:. be KoS to them either. Public relations might be in order in that respect.

Neutral
Pirate ID
Trader ID
Smuggler ID
Mercenary ID
Independent Miner's Guild

Clever, putting that in there. That covers all the houses except those specifically mentioned above.

Friendly
ALG
GMG
Zoners
Corsairs
Outcasts
Blood Dragons
Golden Chrysanthemums
Other non-Kusari Unlawfuls

Looks good. Why are we friendly to the Corsairs AND Outcasts? It seems to me they should be in the neutral, unless theres some forum RP that I've missed?

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Seek fun and you shall find it. Seek stuff to Q_Q about and you'll find that, too. I choose to have fun.

[chovynz]

Allied
Harvesters (limited--see faq)
Zone of Influence

How much does .:j:. support them and what does allied mean to .:j:. characters? "Allied" usually means if a ship is attacking a Harvester, then the allies of the Harvestors also attack the attacker. How does this jeopardize (or not) the neutral standing that Junkers strive to maintain with as many parties as possible?

Transports
The list is open. Junker Congress characters can purchase and operate freighters within any area with the exception of Kusari unless obtained through approved faction role play with applicable groups.

You mean 'transports'?

Disallowed ships would be the Royal/Luxury Liner (without approved role play with applicable factions such as the slaver Servus Lictor's floating elite slave trade "palace"), The Container Transport (Kusari sold), Samura Transport (Kusari sold), Bumblebee (Kusari sold), Drone (Kusari sold), Kusari Cruise Liner (Kusari sold)

All of these are disallowed because they are Kusari ships?

The other ship parts look fine that I can see.

Note: Rank determines a members ship use and rank is awarded by faction leadership. There will be no self promotion and consequently no self-determination of member ship class use. Accepting membership means accepting this and all other restrictions of the Junker Congress.

Just to clarify, Who are the leadership of .:j:.? Is it a number of people or you only? The .:j:. follow ranks? That sounds a little weird for Junkers even though I understand the thinking and necessity behind it. Those people usually have shown they deserve those posts but it still sounds weird to me. Probably because I operate at a simplistic ground level Junker rather that one involved in politics and leadership of things.

//Important Links
- Junker Congress Official Site
- Discovery Server Rules

Yes? um...links? hehe

...In return, Harvesters receive basing rights and guarantees of non-Hostility by Congress members. Speaker Tinkerbell has the distinction of "knowing" the first Harvester and having dialogued with it since its arrival in Liberty. As a result, a level of "logical" trust has developed between Harvesters and the Congress. So long as that logic and predictability holds, the arrangement remains mutually beneficial. This is little different than the relationship maintained by Junkers with the Outcasts and Corsairs. Essentially, "Do what thou wilt and cause no harm" to Junkers.

What if the Harvesters attack us? Where do we take that? OR indy Junkers attack Harvesters?

Something that also occurred to me, How do we deal with internal squabbles? Do we have a private forum where things can be nutted out, or do we put those discussions on the disco forums so everyone can see the development of the .:j:. MkII roleplay? The thing is, most Junkers I know are independents at heart (including me), and many have the attitudes of those hebrews that were fighting ... "who put you in charge over us?" Not always but it's there in the background, and most of us are or have strong personalities.

Something to consider, I think it is very difficult to separate "Junker" actions from .:j:. People look at this as "THE" junker faction and treat all junkers based on .:j:. roleplay and all .:j:. based on indepenedent Junkers - because we are one big 'family'. I think this might be a difficult issue to sort out because we ARE one big family and the actions of a few reflect on the majority and visa-versa. For the Junkers - it really doesnt matter if they are part of the "player" faction, or if they are independent Junkers, we are all Junkers.

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Seek fun and you shall find it. Seek stuff to Q_Q about and you'll find that, too. I choose to have fun.

[worldstrider]

I'll not quote everything above but answering some of these questions...

1)
Yes...of course we are at odds with the Phantoms--that's a given as only admins can fix their rep but I'll add them to the list to be precise.

2)
I did make a decision to disallow all Kusari built ships (without approved role play with a player faction in some rare cases). Sounds like in the update we aren't going to be able to dock on Kusari for the most part and we might as well assume they embargo the ships too. There are alternatives to all of them and no need to even slightly stretch to have them.

3)
As far as I am concerned, private matters are handled by pm until we are official. I'll have a faction website up for us soon but the forum is the last thing I'll have on it. Busy at home too. People who go complaining about faction matters in a public forum simply won't be in the faction. If that's where they end up, they are in the wrong place to start with.

4)
I did intend to have the very ground level leadership mapped out as to how it works and I'll a this to the faction as soon as I can. It is a "privately held" faction at present meaning I call the shots though Oniros is co-founder and has an equal voice. He's french so I pretty much do the writing and presentation.

The structure is amended above.

5)
NO--we are not "the" Junker faction for the whole game. There is no way for me to make that clearer. It's said and emphasized over and over.

6)
The terms of our alliance (limited) with the Harvesters is stated clearly in the faq. I have added a header and clarifying language to the part that pertains. (See "Harvesters" and "A.I." in the faq)

7)
As to the Junker background. I will consider a "case by case exception" but most true "Junkers" didn't bribe their way in or do a few quick missions and get fully "trusted". We will respond in the same manner.

8)
The Junker Congress does not make rules that binds non-Junkers with the one exception being, "No combat within 2k of any Junker base". We will uphold that with any and all parties. Aggressors in these cases will be repelled--Junker or not.

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[worldstrider]

I had a couple of people ask me about do they have to write a short bio? Here's an example of what I mean:

"We grew up in a Junker family on Rochester and as teens our dad took us on cardamine smuggling trips. When we grew up, we continued the family business." The End.

It doesn't have to be complicated--I just don't want someone who gets mad or jealous to stomp out, take a clan treasure ship and say, "Haha you fooools! I'm really a Xeno!! I lied so i could steal your stuff! I was never a Junker!"

(Translation: We do thorough background checks--tell us what we would find.)

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[Culebra]

And to think I sold my Pirate Cruiser. Ah well. Anyway it is good to see this is back.

[RParade]

How much does .:j:. support them and what does allied mean to .:j:. characters? "Allied" usually means if a ship is attacking a Harvester, then the allies of the Harvestors also attack the attacker. How does this jeopardize (or not) the neutral standing that Junkers strive to maintain with as many parties as possible?

.. Speaking from personal in-game experience only, .:j:. "supports" the Harvesters in subtle, discreet ways. For example, one of our members commonly surrenders Xeno prisoners to the Harvesters and in exchange their appreciation is gained. In the past, there have been numerous times where Harvesters have stood up and defended .:j:. (and independent Junkers alike) in much the same way that they defend the Corsairs. However, this isn't a mutual relationship, as the Junkers do not aid the Harvesters in their battles.

If you ask any Harvester, they'll tell you directly that they defend all Junkers and all Corsairs. I imagine they defend Corsairs since the Corsairs supply them with ships n' such, but as for Junkers.. I'm not really sure why they're so eager to help us out all the time, I guess it could be because we share similiar interests in that both factions are scavengers of sorts.

Just to clarify, these rules are only for the .:j:. tagged people correct? Are you putting these rules on all junkers? The reason I ask this, was stated by yourself. People perceive this as "THE junker faction" even though you have had no intention of doing that.

.. I'm not sure how many times Tink will have to say it before it's understood, but.. .:j:. isn't attempting to be "the" official Junker faction. The rules above are only meant to be respected by members of the Junker Congress, other Junkers are free to do as they please. If people percieve .:j:. as being "the" official Junker faction, that's fine, but I'm sure they'll never have to worry about this faction trying to enforce rules on them or anything like that. I'm not the leader or the faction creator, but I'm doubting Tink will be interested in doing that.

Personally I tend to percieve the Junker Congress as being a party of determined individuals with similiar interests, comparable to something like the Nazi party you saw in Germany prior to World War 2. Pre-WW2, the Nazi party was just a gathering of influential individuals looking to sway the government(s) in their favour - usually in the hopes of maximizing personal profit and political control throughout the country. Obviously Junker motivations are very different, but the basic concept is very similiar. Much like any "mob", some members are political figures, others might just be avid supporters, and others could be fanatical enforcers. In short, I think Tinkerbell's goal with .:j:. is to create a faction with alot of variety in that you'll ideally be able to take any sort of route you want with your Junker character. Everything else is trivial at this point, the faction itself is still in a state of infancy in my opinion and things are subject to change depending upon RP and where Tink wants to go with it.

Also, Why is the IMG GB on your list? I am not sure if IMG and Junkers work together.

.. That may be partially my fault. There's two characters in .:j:. who're flying IMG Gunboats, one of which is the sistership to another. The main reason I chose this ship is because it's about the only capital class ship that a Junker could have access too in RP and also be able to fly it in House systems/lawful zones. As Junkers, we could likely have access to other ships like the Corsair or Rogue GB's, but neither of those ships are going to be tolerated in a place like Liberty or Rheinland. Regardless, to me it makes sense enough to work and I've yet to recieve any complaints about it from anyone in-game. The IMG is a profiteering corporation, it seems more-than-reasonable that they'd be willing to sell a few of their ships for Freelance/Mercenary usage.

[Taffic]

There's two characters in .:j:. who're flying IMG Gunboats, one of which is the sistership to another. The main reason I chose this ship is because it's about the only capital class ship that a Junker could have access too in RP and also be able to fly it in House systems/lawful zones. As Junkers, we could likely have access to other ships like the Corsair or Rogue GB's, but neither of those ships are going to be tolerated in a place like Liberty or Rheinland. Regardless, to me it makes sense enough to work and I've yet to recieve any complaints about it from anyone in-game. The IMG is a profiteering corporation, it seems more-than-reasonable that they'd be willing to sell a few of their ships for Freelance/Mercenary usage.

I'd originally disliked the IMG GB argument, but your reasoning is sound & now its the pirate GBs that seem a less obvious choice. :unsure:

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[worldstrider]

Well said Rparade. You are pretty much spot on.

At present, the IMG gunboat is the only "neutral' ship we can field. If Corsair weapons are 'outlawed" in Liberty, imagine the response to a Corsair gunboat.

Within the confines of Puerto Rico and "off the radar' we can fly all the gunboats listed

For now though, stations such as Yanagi and Bornholm with hostile capship incursions will have an occasional need for a gunboat presence. They are also useful for enforcing the "2k no fight zone".

A gunboat parked atop a base saying, "Please don't carry the fight here" can be persuasive and if absolutely necessary, and adjudicator can park a cruiser on top.

The new Junker ships will give us freedom to field more capable ships while stilll being fully Junker.

Nice new banner Taff.

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[Rudo]

.. Speaking from personal in-game experience only, .:j:. "supports" the Harvesters in subtle, discreet ways. For example, one of our members commonly surrenders Xeno prisoners to the Harvesters and in exchange their appreciation is gained. In the past, there have been numerous times where Harvesters have stood up and defended .:j:. (and independent Junkers alike) in much the same way that they defend the Corsairs. However, this isn't a mutual relationship, as the Junkers do not aid the Harvesters in their battles.

There is an actual RP reason behind this that I'll get into in a future story. When I have free time, and feel like writing instead of playing, I guess.

If you ask any Harvester, they'll tell you directly that they defend all Junkers and all Corsairs. I imagine they defend Corsairs since the Corsairs supply them with ships n' such, but as for Junkers.. I'm not really sure why they're so eager to help us out all the time, I guess it could be because we share similiar interests in that both factions are scavengers of sorts.

It's heavily because we've allowed the Harvesters access to our bases for resupply and repairs, and get symbiotic benefits out of the exchange -- which include protection when threatened. The deal was struck before my time, you'll have to ask some of the old hands about it.

I think it was Tink that said it was either work with them or work against them, and it's more the Junker way to see where we could profit from the relationship. When faced with hungry and wounded lion, it's better to feed and comfort it than try and fight it off.

.. I'm not sure how many times Tink will have to say it before it's understood, but.. .:j:. isn't attempting to be "the" official Junker faction. The rules above are only meant to be respected by members of the Junker Congress, other Junkers are free to do as they please. If people percieve .:j:. as being "the" official Junker faction, that's fine, but I'm sure they'll never have to worry about this faction trying to enforce rules on them or anything like that. I'm not the leader or the faction creator, but I'm doubting Tink will be interested in doing that.

Before I was .:j:., I'd frequently refer to Tink and other congress members as 'boss' in my dealings. It was more a courtesy than an actual deference of rank. Other Junkers I've dealt with since getting the tag myself usually give the same courtesy, but I've had to instruct a few in that we are in fact not the core faction.

Personally I tend to percieve the Junker Congress as being a party of determined individuals with similiar interests, comparable to something like the Nazi party you saw in Germany prior to World War 2. Some members are political figures, others might just be avid supporters, and others could be fanatical enforcers. In short, I think Tinkerbell's goal with .:j:. is to create a faction with alot of variety in that you'll ideally be able to take any sort of route you want with your Junker character. Everything else is trivial at this point, the faction itself is still in a state of infancy in my opinion and things are subject to change depending upon RP and where Tink wants to go with it.

It's been said before, just find a niche that the Junkers may need, flesh it out and fill it. Just make sure of three things:

1) There's something in it for you
2) It benefits the Junkers
3) It causes interaction with other players. This could either be positive or negative, but not hostile.

.. That may be partially my fault. There's two characters in .:j:. who're flying IMG Gunboats, one of which is the sistership to another. The main reason I chose this ship is because it's about the only capital class ship that a Junker could have access too in RP and also be able to fly it in House systems/lawful zones. As Junkers, we could likely have access to other ships like the Corsair or Rogue GB's, but neither of those ships are going to be tolerated in a place like Liberty or Rheinland. Regardless, to me it makes sense enough to work and I've yet to recieve any complaints about it from anyone in-game. The IMG is a profiteering corporation, it seems more-than-reasonable that they'd be willing to sell a few of their ships for Freelance/Mercenary usage.

I'll take the blame for this one, as I started it for the reasons RParade just laid out better than I could. On the surface it seems rather odd for a non-combative faction such as the Junkers to field warships, but when you've got rogue Bounty Hunters on Yanagi, and Mon'Star and Phantoms popping up on our cargo routes, and Xeno Elite Blitzkrieg Wings raiding Rochester and Beaumont and hitting our convoys with impunity, and independent smugglers actually bypassing our stations to run from their sources directly to our markets... you see, Junkers need to put their foot down. Fielding a couple hard-hitting deterrent ships is the best way.

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