Passing trough my usual trade route (Okinawa - Liberty) made me see some things that puzzle me.
People tend to trade with freelancer / mercenary / bounty hunter / Independent trader ID
Now let's see what does this indie trader actually benefit from:
* He belongs nowhere, aka he's not in faction.
* He doesn't have to give a portion of his money to his corporation (either via donations or some weekly cut)
* He doesn't have to answer to anyone regarding his roleplay. (total freedom!)
* He's free to make contacts based on his own experience
* He's free to dock on most bases and make runs that are profitable
What's he losing? What doesn't he get?
* He can't trade in convoys
- Basically he can, he just needs to find same trader doing same route
* He can't enjoy some protection
- He can certainly hire mercenaries and finance them on his own. Escorts aren't pricy
Anything else you can think of?
Well here's what I see them benefiting from, that they shouldn't benefit from.
* They can dock anywhere.
* They can purchase every commodity
* Basically no matter where they trade, they are neutral to people. Neutral isn't hostile necessarily
Now, I'm not prone to placing this situation in the real world, but someone will surely mention freelancer contractors or, people with their own trucks / hauling vehicles and how they're trading things around.
Well, let me tell you something from start, you can't simply go somewhere and take the things, ship them off elsewhere and expect people to buy them from there. You have to sign a contract with the exporters in question. Why? Well, here's the simplest answer.
Indy trader (A) decides to buy 16 tons of cement and decides to haul it off to construction site (QS)
He didn't sign anything and he's off towards the (QS).
(QS) on other hand has no clue that (A) is coming and orders 16 tons of cement from the exporter (E).
Why would he accept (A) now when he ordered (E's) cargo, that's guaranteed and quality approved.
It seems Ageira is the only company for now (kudos!) that has decided to make people purchase the contract to ship their parts. That's the way things should go.
If you want to enjoy the benefits of being neutral to everyone, you shouldn't enjoy the benefits corporate trader has. - That would be, like previous example said, Ageira ID ships enjoying the benefit of shipping gate / lane parts around.
Having an corporate ID makes you a bigger target. Ageira to hackers, Kishiro to xenos, Kruger to hessians etc. It increases Roleplay, it gives it's drawbacks and advantages. You still remain faction-less and you don't enjoy full benefits.
Sure, why would one do this? Well, they wouldn't ofcourse, that'ld be really dumb to do. On one side you have full benefits, on other hand they're crippling things hard.
But when things go up and more companies follow Ageira (GMG? Synth foods?) and start selling licenses and hiring mercenaries to enforce it and make sure that those without license are forced to drop cargo, trade should become more realistic and less of a chore.
The Freelancer or Independet Trader is a role on can take, just as (almost) any other, no reason to change it.
These players are limited to smaller ships and sacrifice some oportunities, but gain freedoms and some other possibilities, so there is no problem, not every one has to play the way you do. Or the way you want him to...
I see where your coming from Ivan. I mean, say FL was real life. If you were a station dealer, would you rather buy goods from a ragtag trader thats probably just been on some Junker base doing a shady deal OR a Universal shipping captain in a nice suit with an official name tag that says Hello, my name is: :).
Some would say that FL is not real life. I would say that we should try and make it as realistic as possible. Soo..a ship restriction on Freelancer/Merc IDs for trading for like say, no ships over 3300 cargo or something would do the trick? Because, think about it. Youre average Freelancer doesn't go around with 100's of millions in his pocket.
One problem though. People will start to spam Junkers.
Well, I'm just wondering do people thing it's fair to actually prohibit the independents to purchase some commodities?
Do you think it's fair what Quorg is doing with Ageira and prohibiting people to buy gate / lane parts?
I think he is. And I'm sure there was no complaints yet, but when he starts enforcing it and people's FL or Independent trader ID ships start to explode people will go on massive rage.
I dont think that rage is appropriate.
The bounty is there for more than few weeks now, some compaines have paid for licenses, some got it for free since Lore allows them, but lore doesn't allow Freelancer traders anything.
I'm just wondering if corporations start to take more care for themselves, what will indies do?
' Wrote:Well here's what I see them benefiting from, that they shouldn't benefit from.
* They can dock anywhere.
* They can purchase every commodity
* Basically no matter where they trade, they are neutral to people. Neutral isn't hostile necessarily
Why they shouldn't benefit from these?
They already have strict limitations how large transports they can use.
Corporation and independent trade is a lot different.
Just because you sign contracts doesn't mean independent traders should.
It's their own choice if they want to enforce their roleplay by doing so.
This is a roleplay server where people can choose what to be, what to do and how to do it.
This thread seems more like a bitching thread to me rather than a serious suggestion.
The only thing these changes would do is to benefit you and your corporation.
' Wrote:Some would say that FL is not real life. I would say that we should try and make it as realistic as possible.
This is a game for gods sake. If you want realism go out.
Freelancer can't be made realistic no matter what we would do.
' Wrote:Soo..a ship restriction on Freelancer/Merc IDs for trading for like say, no ships over 3300 cargo or something would do the trick?
actually i'm not bitching I'm asking people for opinion iKone.
people will always be free to trade in whatever they want and however they want. Same as you can trade artifacts around liberty but they're illegal.
Benefiting me and myself only isn't the goal here. Goal is more to benefit the entire community. If you think that it's fair to run goods from Okinawa to Doublin and bring gold back, and then get upset when someone shoots you, or mollys pirate you as neutral, or someone spots you, spots the NPCs not shooting you and reports you, then I say you had it coming.
Edit: Its a game where you interact with something thats pretty realistic. Other players.
' Wrote:It seems Ageira is the only company for now (kudos!) that has decided to make people purchase the contract to ship their parts. That's the way things should go.
If you want to enjoy the benefits of being neutral to everyone, you shouldn't enjoy the benefits corporate trader has. - That would be, like previous example said, Ageira ID ships enjoying the benefit of shipping gate / lane parts around.
Bitching.
As I told, everyone here can do things how ever they seem fit.
Every player faction, every independent player.
There should not be someone to tell them how things should be done.
It's your decision that you sign contracts before you ship anything.
You are clearly annoyed because no other corporation doesn't do it and they ship stuff freely,
when you sit at your bases and wait for the contracts to be signed.
You want other corporations to do it, too, to make it fair for you and your corporation.
Please, if it's that annoying to sign contracts and enhance your roleplay, then why did you do it in the first place?
Nobody told you to do so. Nobody expects you to do so.
Of course it enhances the roleplay, but if you don't like it at all by yourself, you shouldn't do it.
Well, fair enough. With that answer you do agree with me, and i respect your opinion. I'm not here to force everyone, I'm here to develop my roleplay and play with people that agree with me.
At this moment, I'm giving all my freelancer time towards improving corporations and making them more desirable to play with.
I did that because i think corporation can mold a new player into something better, unlike an independent trader that takes care of himself only.
Just with this, corporations are better for discovery society. But yeah, we already agreed that corporations are free to post bounties on all non contracted ships, because its a game and we can do whatever we want.
Personally, I feel that a Freelance Trader makes no sense.
You don't get to ship massive containers of goods from South Africa to the UK without special clearances, taxes, licenses etc.
Smaller things you can get away with, but not huge amounts!
I reckon every 3500 + Transport should come with a tag and license...
You can still be an independent shipping for Republican or Synth foods.
It's just my opinion, I have nothing to gain or lose by this happening or not, it just enhances overall role play imo.
i have far more Indie characters than faction characters but I seriously try to put those Indies in as logical an RP light as possible.
My understanding of powertrading is simply turning your back on role play and gunning for the credits... If Rp becomes inconvenient in the light of amassing wealth, we have a serious problem!
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Interesting post, Ivan. I don't know if it's a case where the indy trader should have it harder or say, the corporations or even suppliers of certain items, many of which are distinct to those corporations or groups, should MAKE it harder for them.
In some ways, the rules have. For anyone that is NOT Ageira, trade lane parts is contraband. If an indy trader is caught with them.....well, you know. This is just one such example of corporate specific goods.
Then there are certain commodities produced specifically by certain groups. I think those commodities should be at full control of those groups as to who can and who can't trade them. For example, Zoners and iridium or even the IMG and berrylium. If the afore mentioned indy doesn't have permission to transport them, same thing as above.
As it is, some houses already require licensing, licensing which is often granted more favorably to an established trade group or corporation.
Ivan, I don't know if this strengthens your point or not but I hope it helps.