Things do indeed change, and that's a good thing. However, the only things which change officially are things that Igiss decides (though sometimes those changes are influenced by player faction relations). If player factions had full authority to change diplomacy and such things at their own whim, and enforce it over indies, then 1) The indies would never have any idea about what they can and cannot (or should and should not) do unless they spent the time to lurk the forums (which I enjoy, but some people revile); and 2) Igiss' long-range plans for Discovery (whatever they are) would likely be shot to hell. Certain things would likely happen which are an overall detriment to everyone, such as the BAF/Molly treaty, and people would RP themselves into a figurative corner.
You know, it's not Rp, if it can't evolve. "Evolving" simply was, is and will be very important part of any and all RPs, no matter if it is Disco, D&D or whatever else, in game or on desk. If you say "Behave according to ID, you have no right to do diplomatics, unless they are very minor, no right to change anything, so just shut up and obey the ID " ... Well, you have just raped RP and killed it afterwards, congratulations.
Or even better... only some selected official factions are allowed to change things... and enforce laws, make diplomatics. Oh my. Poor RP and its friend Fair-Game are turning in grave.
I buy things I don't want to make an impression on people I don't like.
We all know that opinions are like a rectum. We all have one, so I'm gonna take a dump on this one too. I apologize for the graphic start.
Drake has summed up nicely what is the difference between un-official and official. A chance to enforce the RP rules they make.
Any un-official faction can do pretty much all that an official can. BUT the difference for me and it seems that Von agrees me on this is, that official faction can have a much more positive effect on the surroundings.
Any un-official faction that has the tenacity in hanging in there and setting the example and molding the surroundings to their image can do that. But official factions get there faster.
Also official factions are (or at least are supposed to be) a known quantity. In everyday encounters in the server if I see an official faction tagged guy I pretty much can know what to expect. Whenever I see a bunch of [XYZ] tagged guys I almost certainly know that they are a bunch of friends of unknown quality and have to work hard earn my respect. Whereas if they were in official factions they would have a good head start in it.
Being official makes things easier in the server. That's about it. To me to be an official faction has only perks. So what if I can't enforce someone not to fly a Hessian Cruiser. I can suggest him not to do it, but that's about it. It does not tarnish my name in any way. If someone complains about the Hessian cap spam in Berlin, all I need to say is "sorry pal. We've been trying to talk to that guy, but he's not listening. It's out of our hands. We try to keep things fair, but you know how it is sometimes..." And then call the RM and/or BHG to get that Cruiser because he's obviously a renegade captain:D
The "problem" of oorp indies and un-official groups is only a problem if you pick it up into your lap. Or associate yourself with their actions.
If there are only few disruptive players you can always use the shunning and never render aid to those players.
The thing is that I can (and I'm positive that most here can too) make a difference between actions of an individual (or a tagged group) from the say actions of the 101st. The un-official group flying exclusive OC dessies do not tarnish the rest of the OCs. In fact if you let the things go by their own course the server will take care of them sooner or later. Don't you worry about them. You might hear alot of grief about them and people complaining them but you can totally wash your hands of them. In fact having an official tag protects you from the association with them.
Official faction have earned respect over the times. And with respect your changes to affect the surroundings increase greatly. And if you skillfully use that leverage with people you encounter in the game you do not have that many problems me thinks. And that is the main difference to me between official and un-official factions.
' Wrote:You know, it's not Rp, if it can't evolve. "Evolving" simply was, is and will be very important part of any and all RPs, no matter if it is Disco, D&D or whatever else, in game or on desk. If you say "Behave according to ID, you have no right to do diplomatics, unless they are very minor, no right to change anything, so just shut up and obey the ID " ... Well, you have just raped RP and killed it afterwards, congratulations.
Or even better... only some selected official factions are allowed to change things... and enforce laws, make diplomatics. Oh my. Poor RP and its friend Fair-Game are turning in grave.
Roleplaying isn't necissarily about diplomacy. It's about playing the role of your character. You can pretty much do what ever the hell you like with your character in-rp. Even if the diplomacy's were set in stone and never going to change, ever, that would not stop you from roleplaying your character. It would simply stop you from changing the factions diplomacys, which by the way is not roleplaying your character, but trying to dictate others from roleplaying the character from the way they want to play. Your character fills a role, not everyone elses.
Offical factions to me are about one thing;
Order.
Like going to work, like watching TV, like watching sport, it's all designed to keep the order. Humans by nature are chaotic without order. Like Hoodlum said all those pages ago, this server would turn into a chaotic mess without order.
Besides, you all complain that offical factions don't get to change everything. A while ago, Bounty Hunters ran rampant with in NY with their capital ships blowing everything red to dust. Now, Bounty Hunters will only be allowed cap ships in the border/edgeworlds.
Then there was the LNS doing basicly the same thing. Now, we have the capital ship registration that keeps them in check.
We have(had?) the Outcast' New York directive that stops OC cap ships from attacking targets in NY with in 15ks of Manhatten
The RM restrict sale of their capital vessels and do not allow BH caps from operating in Rhienland.
Most recently, we had the Bs| trying to stop indie Osiris' from capspamming NY.
Well... Order capital ships are now no longer allowed in NY unless a pre-arranged event has been organised.
Now tell me that is not 'evolution'.
You may not get to change things over night, but things will change. This thread, too, will likely cause change. Because no one has brought up this issue before, how is one supposed to know there is a problem?
Ok guys heres my input. I'm not gonna rant on but pack it all into bitesize chunks so it's more likley to be read. A tactic i recommend to everyone.;)
The forum is part of our experience in the discovery RP 24/7 server weather we like it or not. It is basically a branch out into the game that we couldn't do ingame. And this branch is all of the first person down to earth things such as recruitment threads and factions status threads/recruitment posters and faction records/archives. Without this we would be hopeless in organising and upkeeping a faction, which can already be very difficult to do in the fist place.
With privelages come responsibilities, ergo, the faction guidlines. Some we agree with, some we don't. But we all have to obide by them if we want to reap the benifits of Igiss' bank account, ergo, use of the forums.
I've thought about it and boiled it down to 3 things.
Things an official faction can do that an unofficial faction cannot
1) Buy a home system (which means absolutely nothing now)
2) Have a recruitment thread/faction status post
3) Get slapped by the admins for not playing a game enough
Cut the dramaticism please. Although I am always more in favor of player factions because of richness and all that, you're making this trivial.
Factions do not have that much power and so what. If it were up to me, they would. But it's not up to me, and the decisions of Igiss count most, as well as decisions of admins(although the mod creator has priority).
And I really do feel the "betterness" of being in an official faction.
Offer new arguments if you will, but let us not boil down the same arguments over and over again.
EDIT: Note: General remark about the last couple o' pages.
<span style="font-familyalatino Linotype">
<span style="color:#000000">All morons hate it when you call them a moron.
' Wrote:I've thought about it and boiled it down to 3 things.
Things an official faction can do that an unofficial faction cannot
1) Buy a home system (which means absolutely nothing now)
2) Have a recruitment thread/faction status post
3) Get slapped by the admins for not playing a game enough
Saddly you have truth there. Very simple said, but it is how it is.
But you, maybe, shouldn't revive this thread, it make people dislike each other.
I buy things I don't want to make an impression on people I don't like.
Yes, home systems are obviously pointless now, since the owners can't hide their faction's capships in it and dole them out at their own whim. That is obviously the only reason to have a home system, to hide the capships from dangerous indies.
My recent experiences in building up an unofficial faction have taught me that, official factions have done their hard work in gaining that official title.
Its been frustrating.
I have new members who travel places where they have not established any good role-play reasons for visiting.
I have Rheinlander military destroying our ships, even though we keep their Trade Lanes and Jump Gates operatingkeeping the flow of commerce to their House.
New members who become trigger happy in their new ships, and start firing before engaging some role play with criminals.
And my speaking to three or four members in different systems asking me questions at one time could make a player never come back to Freelancer.
So if any Ageira members are making mistakes, please show patience
And again, any group who are now official and in good standing, I salute you! It could not have been easy.