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[zeinstruktor]

Stop.
Bumping.
Old.
Threads.

[David Petraeus]

Counter-Measures arn't doing jack...

I've fought 3 Missile Happy Spammers in the past 3 Days and they totally ignore the CM's...

Not to mention that even though TCD's work against missile-spammers; You don't have nearly enough when people pack on 2-3 Missiles...

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If Pershings can be pro Marine, so can I.

[Ayem]

I had a mini-rant about gunboat missiles, this time I'll try to keep much calmer. Promise!

As a bomber with a para/cannonball (+2x CODE) missile loadout, I'd tend to agree with you. It is much easier to hold my own in a fight than it was in 4.84 when I was using a pure CODE set up. I wouldn't say that you can just spam the missiles though, cannonball in particular does require aiming. I think the Para explosion radius could be reduced a little though, unless it has to be that large due to shield/lag bugs.

I'm of the opinion that in a 1vs1 bomber against fighter battle, the fighter should technically win. While the current missile situation is nice and very fun, I would not hate a nerf of some description to either the bombers or the missiles themselves.

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[johnpeter]

Agreed, even my starflier, can beat a defender with all missiles... Though, I am have been a better pilot...

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Come on! Be free!

[Jinx]

missiles are weapons for defenders or pilots with nearby resupply bases ( in RP, it takes months to travel as far as we sometimes do in half an hour )

so the missile fighter has an advantage.. but ONLY - when the other pilot fights by their rules. - a missile fighter needs to joust... now as well as in 4.84. - missiles do not track good enough to be fired at the rear of another ship ( remember, if you switch your CMs on [ make them an active weapon ] - they fire a CM automaticly )

missiles - especially cannonballs and paralyzers can be countered by firing a CD at the enemy ship when it turns and gets ready to fire - a CD is faster than a missile and reaches its max speed faster - the missiles explode in their face... . which is fatal when its a paralyzer... cause now the missile fighter has no shields AND stands at a full length joust vs. a full gun fighter.

lastly - missiles only have 70 ammo - after that.... the ship is done. - while 70 ammo is good in a 1 vs. 1 ... it is not enough for a larger engagement. - even a 2 vs. 2 - missiles won t last through the whole fight... and the gun fighters will have an advantage.

missiles DO close the gap between ace pilots and novice pilots a little - and thats their point. - they are "intelligent" weapons .. that are meant to take a part of skill from the player.... their backdraw is their ammo need and their limited use.


if you re mad at missile fighters - you can as well get mad at full shield breaker fighters + sunslayer... or twin inferno VHF with 7 hullbreaker guns attacking much larger ships.

there simply ARE effective loadouts around - but they are only effective if you don t use measures against them. when you fight a missile fighter the very same way you fight a gunfighter - you cannot blame the equipment... you just have to think again.

in the end, you don t fight a gunboat the same way you fight a light fighter either. - a fighter with full guns is a totally different ship to fight than a fighter with only missiles - and requires a different tactic. - both ships have their strangth and their weaknesses.

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Shipdesigns made for DiscoveryGC

[tansytansey]

The problem I have when fighting missile users, particularly paralyser and sidewinder combo, Jinx, is that when they fire their missiles from a distance, if you counter with a CD the missiles have already traveled far enough not to effect them, unless you predict and fire a CD a moment before. Some missile users fight closer range with missiles and fire them right before a pass. This increases their chance of hitting and reduces the time you have to react by firing a CD.
And 70 TCDs never seems to be enough to counter 140 missiles... and you will never be able to stop 100% of the missiles from hitting you. It seems like we're getting punished too hard for making one simple mistake, particularly on a light fighter. Yeah, sidewinders love to eat those things too.

It also seems like this is turning into a place where if you don't mount missiles you're at a severe disadvantage. And for people like me, whos ping makes using missiles very difficult, that's not good. There doesn't seem to be a way around that... cause people will always use the stronger option... but I think missiles could use a bit more of a balance.
I'm pressed for time (gotta go to work) so I can't write as much as I wanted to...

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|Ashes and Draya's Epic Adventure|Ashes "Nighthawk" Yotaka|Nightfall|Eva Jones|
[5:50:49 PM] JakeSG (William Darkmoor) says: I like you, Ashes. You're more cynical than God.

[Derkylos]

At least missiles don't instagib vanilla VHFs any more...

I am an abysmal shot, the chances of me hitting something in a PvP situation are somewhere around the 1/100 mark. As such, I love missiles, because they do not require me to be able to aim.

However, they do require careful use. Against someone who is intent on flying headlong into you, a Paralyzer (or two, they seem to have been nerfed slightly in the damage department) followed by a Cannonball is pretty effective, but, if the same person is flying perpendicular to you, you will have a much harder time hitting them.

As for bombers...well, I think we should drop the class 10 gun slots, anyways, possibly replacing em with another torp slot, but, yeah, missiles on bombers overcome it's weakness against fighters, which seems wrong...

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[dead_shot]

If you are looking at it from the PvP aspect you're right. Missiles can be used by anybody and sometimes it's unjust to those who are good ''pew-pew'' pilots.

But if there is a battle going on and you're flying an brick of a bomber best you can do is mount all missiles and torpedoes you can.

It can give an outstanding strategic and tactic advantage, because those bombers can still defend themselves from the fighters and do serious damage to capital ships.

As for the dueling - conditions of a duel can be agreed upon between players and they should include no use of missiles.

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the path to hell is paved with good intentions!

[zeinstruktor]

It doesn't just give them an "outstanding strategic and tactic advantage"... It turns bombers into swiss-knives that can kill caps AND fighters, which goes against everything this new mod version is about. So then, tell me: what's the point in flying a fighter if a bomber can do the same job AND more?
I'm not talking about dueling... Just fights in general. While I don't want bombers to lose class 10 slots, simply make them gun-only.

Even though the infocard for the cannonball doesn't reflect any change in tracking, ask anybody about the difference in 4.84 cannonballs and 4.85 ones. They are simply much harder to dodge now, while doing more damage. I have no idea what it is, if someone could take a look at it that would be very much appreciated.

Even from behind, cannonballs still track well enough to score hits every once in a while.

[Guest]

I disagree about how 70 missiles are only good for 1v1 engagements

The furball at West Point with SOB the other day i jumped into with Guardian.059, 4 codes 1 Firestalker (Cant remember exactly the missile, but i think that was it). Got almost 3 kills before running out. And each time i was targetting someone who was attacking an ally of mine, so almost each shot was aimed at the side / rear, occasionally to the front of the ship.

The third kill i ran out before killing the guy, but a TCD nailed one of his mines when he had 50% hull and no shields.