Piracy

[kikatsu]

@sindroms

Obviously I am not referencing the LR, I have alot of respect for you guys
but I take it you have seen the pirates I am talking about?
You know...the kind with capital armored outcast gunships that utter maybe 3 words before shooting at a ship

I know you've encountered them

[Janus]

I've had mixed results with pirates, my most annoying one entirely my own fault, forgetting I had a unmounted Disco scanner on board ofr another character and flying blissfully through Cali thinking the pirates weren't going to pay me any notice. I don't begrudge the LR- that took it at all, serves me right.

That said, I've had or witnessed some very positive results with pirates. My son's been pirated twice, once for as much cargo as the pirate could carry, which was about a 1/4 of my son's cargo as I recall.

Another time, he manage to convince a pirate to swap, as his was more valuable than the pirates. As my son is only 13, I was rather impressed by his negotiation.

I personally have two active traders. On is entirely RP and until earlier today was in a Camara. He's been pirated twice that I remember. Once was right after I bought the Camara, I had no credits left after getting as much boron on as I could afford (about 3/4 full). Couldn't pay the junkers outside Pittsburgh and got destroyed. I was hauling oxygen after that.

I got caught again today by a pair of rogues in Cali, one with a rather interesting ship choice. The iniitial demand was 2mil for each pirate. 4mil from a Camara pilot seems a bit rich to me, but it didn't end there. One of the pirates decided he wanted a bar of gold instead, the other I negotiated down to 400k. .

Was I annoyed after the junkers blew me up? Yes, it was bad timing and I really don't expect to get pirated outside Pittsburgh. Was I annoyed about getting caught in Cali today? Not at all. I fly through Cali knowing the risks, that's my choice. There are lots of other routes I could take, but my RP for that character is a Libery trader and a lot of his routes go through Cali then spread out from there.

Thinking about it, there was a 3rd time in the middle somewhere, a simple, reasonable cash demand. I paid it and moved on.

On the flip side, I have a Behemoth up in Dresden that hasn't been stopped once. It's on a pure power trading route for the express purpose of financing a Hogosha "pirate" and a smuggler. And it's desperately dull. As soon as I've made the 100mil I need, it'll get junked. Some people can powertrade, I've watched my boy run the same route over and over for hours on end. Me, I like my trading to be more interesting. If it takes longer to make money, so what? Sometimes I find myself wishing for pirates just to break up the monotony.

[deluca]

Yes, all the intense pirating has forced to give up LAWFUL trading. (lawful routes are boring and tradelaney anyway)

On another note however, I was inspired to make a well equipped corsair pirate transport character and hold up traders passing through omega 3 and 7, taking most (if not all) of their cargo....

Now when i ran into a trader heres what happened 95% of the time:

Me: Drop me some o dat booty! (more or less)

Trader: How much? *nervousness and uncertainty*

Me: Lets say 2000

Trader: No way, how about i give you 500k instead

*Long battle including a lot of cruise disruptors fired and ending in a victory for myself, tractoring a small fraction of their cargo* (pirate transport rocks)

The point of this example is to say that pirating cargo almost NEVER works, since youre dealing with the same lolwutting traders who refuse to pay 2 million (which is about the value of the cargo) and try to think they can outrun a bomber or a gunboat. In fact, youre less likely to walk away with anything if you demand cargo because the trader gets scared and runs, or thinks he can outrun or destroy my pirate transport.

Of course, i praise the 1/20 times that someone actually gives up the cargo after a long RP discussion, but again, 1/20 times. In the amount of time it takes for 20 traders to pass me, the server probably crashes or i get chased off by a mercenarys/freelancers bomber.

So really, for pirating cargo to become popular and practical its going to take either ID changes, new rules, or maybe, just maybe, the general trader population will become introduced to FUN ROLEPLAY, which is the main focus of the server, not just making millions and millions of credits

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[Guest]

@sindroms

Obviously I am not referencing the LR, I have alot of respect for you guys
but I take it you have seen the pirates I am talking about?
You know...the kind with capital armored outcast gunships that utter maybe 3 words before shooting at a ship

I know you've encountered them

Yes and we have full right to blow them away with dual nova'd barghests. Which we do. Cleansing of Liberty has begun and it begins by showing Pirate roleplay through brute force and shotgun diplomacy education.

[worldstrider]

This is true, but the debate here is how to lessen the impact of piracy without impacting the RP on either side. Trust me, the summer months make discovery chock-full of unlawful liberty types who fly in numbers to win at any cost.

I understand the point. I think house navies and police should be ONE faction. But not "one player's" faction. Here's what I mean:

You have a legal codex in each house voted on by all house players (corps and the like even). It is the actual "law of the land". cops don't make arbitrary and subjective calls. They have rules of engagement, set fines and penalties--that are applied uniformly and do not vary from player to player. In return, they can load up on armor and caps and whatever. But they have assigned areas, protocols for leaving them to assist others, etc. House shippers get free escort in house systems from the police and Navy--others do not. Non-house or foreign shippers have to PAY to get escorted in (a commission for the cops). It would take some creative brainstorming but a "house" ought to feel like one--grand and powerful and proud. Player factions could be admin approved only even with suitable rewards for acceptance and ppenalties for abuse.

Houses have fragmented RP--that's why "lawful and orderly" appeal less. No one and everyone can be "admiral"--but its mostly player made up and means nothing in practical terms. Limit titles and ship types but grant them to players. You start out a private and get a free fighter. Do better get a free kitted out gunboat with rank. Then on up to admiral, battleship or whatever. Would take a lot of work but would make houses a lot more fun instead of the AOL chats they are now. Pirates become pirates 'cause they can go straight to the glory and action. Houses need to have their own unique action.

Just as you would have character play rules, you could have player rules. Get caught by a superiror oorp chatting, lose a rank--etc.

That's one way to address it--or begin to.

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[carlabrams]

I understand the point. I think house navies and police should be ONE faction. But not "one player's" faction. Here's what I mean:
<snipped to save space>
That's one way to address it--or begin to.

Nice post, Vlad, and I agree with it.

I was in Cali last week one night with my LPI ship, just patrolling the trade lane between Riverside and the Jump Gate because - that's where the pirates hang out. I don't know who specifically on the forums it was, but we had some great RP. It seemed that they were stunned that an LPI officer would actually do his job. That, and I wasn't interested in donuts, either. (Just to give them some grief.)

Of course, since LPI is a corporation, the minor detail that they didn't quite get my bribe request to leave them the heck alone was funny as hell from my perspective, too. It seemed like the pirates were the only ones in system that DIDN'T get what I was asking for - everyone else sure did. :P

And yes, they were LR tagged, too.

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Sentient Machine Alliance

[Hawkwings]

I have to protest against stupid cargo piracy. AKA "Drop all your cargo and let me shoot it." I encountered an indy Hessian in a bomber who told me to do this. I tried offering him money, giving him as much cargo as he could and giving him money, and then giving him a LOT of money (5 mil) but he was very obstinate and kept saying "drop cargo now".

I get the feeling that he was trying to RP, and there was certainly a lot of talking from my side, but he really didn't know what was going on, or how to properly RP pirating.

Anyways, pirating is not a good way to make money. I can make 15 mil in half an hour trading. Can any of you make 15 mil in half an hour pirating? During non-peak times?

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[Exsiled_one]

I can't say I like this post.
Not because its a well disguised rant, more because it puts the spotlight on a wrong person.
All those traders around getting taxed mostly deserve it.
As much as people rp their capships, people should roleplay their traders as well.

What pisses me off is when people say "you need to trade, make a zoner. " No! thats not the way to go. Make whatever you want to make and roleplay it, don't make a zoner because they're neutral to everyone. because they arent. Same with Junkers. You will get pirated, burned down and torched if you do not wish to cooperate.

And I can bet you that those pirates that you see, that gang up on the lvl 50 trader in 3 gunboats are same people that had tons of capital ships before, but recently they are getting harassed by small squads of bombers so it's just not fun anymore. They are looking for different targets to pump up their ego now - sadly those are traders.

But here's few suggestions. Hire two escorts, make them blow up your pirate and you're free for 4 hours to trade around. Join a faction. Some factions pay rackets to the pirates and pirates leave them alone.
Negotiate a racket alone. change a trade route.

Oh and.. about losing all your ilegal cargo and getting fined. Thats exactly what you deserve when you do illegal things. Maybe you're too young, but its a good adjustment for the real life punshiments you get for having illegal things with you.
If you let everyone do what they want just to have fun, soon noone will have fun and everyone will moan. Hippies did not have it right. trust me.

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<span style="color:#33CC00">I AM GIVING AWAY MONEY TO CREATIVE MINDS*</span>

[Bass_masta992]

good adjustment for the real life punshiments

I completely understand what you're getting at, but this isn't 'real life'

Should there be compensations to make the game a bit more fair, even ones where police wouldn't really be losing anything by 'forgetting' to grab the rest of it?

My answer now is No. We/I can't control what other people do just because of my opinions, and clearly they aren't shared by everyone. But Athenian brought up a good point about the abilities of ships to fend off pirates. Obviously there are some ships that sacrifice that ability for more cargo space, and then some the other way.

Should we get more well rounded trade ships into more factions? I've seen the Salvager, for example, take on several ships, only coming out on top, but I've also seen it dropped by a Waran and a Roc. It's not invincible, but it gives you a chance.

Also, what would be good ship setups for fighter/bomber/gunboat escorts? For when you need to drop the bomber or gunboat fast before it eats your trader?

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[darthbeck]

as a pirate, i have tried taxing people for 50k.... and ended up having to blow him up. i have taken a reasonable amount of cargo. and have ended up pirating someone for 9 milllion. however, that was a lifetime pass for the entire faction.

as a trader, i have been pirated for large sums. and i have been pirated by transports. and piracy should not be used for making any real amount of money. if you want an armor upgrade, trade 12 million, and pirate the rest. dont try and pirate it all.

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<span style="font-family:Century Gothic">Violence is Golden</span>