Because I have seen this type of gameplay so many times before and it's become incredibly lame.
Before I begin I would like to say that I'm not part of the TF7, neither am I part of the group which are sending the transmission to the LN High Command. But I'm part of the [LN].
This discussion is about having fun versus what has become in-game obligations.
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Here is the situation, read it carefully, since it depicts the situation where all of these problems stems from:
Player Bob is a pirate, but he carries a Freelancer ID with no tag. He utilizes technology available to almost everyone, such as borderworlds equipment. Hence, why he flies a Sabre, or a Kusari Explorer Gunboat. He uses civilian/universal technology such as Codenames, Flashpoints or default Gunboat gear.
Therefore, on a technology or affiliation basis, he is NOT considered a criminal. Because there is simply nothing inherently criminal with using universal equipment.
This same guy has in the past, shot down multiple times lawful characters. In this specific situation being Liberty Navy vessels. Official Liberty Navy members and independents alike.
Player Bob is then caught in a situation in-game he can't escape from. He is caught by Player Joe, a patrolling Liberty Navy pilot that halts him and states that he is a criminal, and therefore is subject to termination if he refuses to leave Liberty space. Player Bob immediately begins to argue that he is not a criminal which Player Joe replies instantly that he indeed is. Because he recalls being shot at by the exact same guy in the past, but not only that, he has also caught Player Bob red-handed pirating a trader.
Player Bob continues to argue that he is not a criminal. Player Joe becomes tired of this obvious criminal's excuses and therefore engages in combat since he refuses to comply to Player Joe's orders.
Player Bob loses the fight (and obviously we aren't gonna expect a kudos). But instead compiles screenshots of the event and sends a message to the appropriate authority shouting and screaming that Player Joe is acting out of line.
Now since Player Joe didn't spend half his time in-game taking screenshots IN THE PAST that Player Bob committed criminal activities he has no way to prove his case.
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Now two questions arises from this situation.
Question #1 - Are we supposed to as lawfuls, spend the majority of our time compiling screenshots of all the ambiguously disguised criminal characters, so we can prove our actions every time we encounter them or shall we actually try to play the game?
Question #2 - Are screenshots considered in this particular type of situation, the only form of "real evidence"? Why can't we simply say that the Liberty Navy officer recorded the criminal in the past which was then sent to a criminal database. Therefore if any patrolling wing would encounter the same individual again, they would simply identify him immediately as a criminal?
Sub-question of #2 - Is this only valid if for example Fleet Admiral Hale can confirm as an eye-witness of said criminal in comparison to some unknown independent Navy officer?
Zoners cant pirate.
Or participate in any unlawful actions.
So. The very idea that a zoner eitherA pirated or B shot up a navy pilot is absurd.
EDIT:
ALso.
yes.
Some people, even those who play LN or navy characters, are ignorant of the actual laws of liberty.
I was once arrested for carrying liberty rogue pilots after shooting down a npc rogue convoy.
An idiot with a cruiser blew me up, even though a member of the actual LN told him i hadnt commited a crime.
gone four years, first day back: Zoners still getting shot in Theta :|
' Wrote:Zoners cant pirate.
Or participate in any unlawful actions.
So. The very idea that a zoner eitherA pirated or B shot up a navy pilot is absurd.
Well, to refute this logic, I have personally been involved with a similar case as the thread I provided, with a Zoner. As to who this exactly was I will not reveal since I'm trying to avoid trial by forum. But I can assure you, that I have seen Zoner players commit illegal activities. Some for smuggling, others for example providing supplies to other criminals which are engaged in combat with the Liberty Navy. Both actions are considered illegal and completely within the ID of a Zoner.
As a sign of confidence, our faction's Fleet Admiral and our Commodore was present at the case.
' Wrote:EDIT:
ALso.
yes.
Some people, even those who play LN or navy characters, are ignorant of the actual laws of liberty.
I was once arrested for carrying liberty rogue pilots after shooting down a npc rogue convoy.
An idiot with a cruiser blew me up, even though a member of the actual LN told him i hadnt commited a crime.
This is not a thread for bashing individuals who are part of the Liberty Navy. Do not stray away from the original topic and its purpose.
@ question 1.
You only need one unedited ss.
Not that hard.
@ qeustion 2.
Maybe that would work, if they actually did have a database.
But they dont, at least, not one they regularly use.
I can make up stories too ya know.
EDIT: Not a bash.
Mostly its the LNS-independents who speak only basic english.
gone four years, first day back: Zoners still getting shot in Theta :|
' Wrote:@ question 1.
You only need one unedited ss.
Not that hard.
@ qeustion 2.
Maybe that would work, if they actually did have a database.
But they dont, at least, not one they regularly use.
I can make up stories too ya know.
No. In most cases a single screenshot is not sufficient. Besides, the amount of players I have encountered that are of "disguised criminal" nature, are plenty. Since we are talking about Liberty.
We do have a database, but I'm speaking of a "Role-Played" existent one.
Yes, we can make up stories. But that is exactly why I put up a sub-question. What if the Fleet Admiral of the Liberty Navy himself, was an eyewitness. Is that really not a valid "evidence"?
I am sure taht there are zoners who commit crimes, and freelancers, and mercenaries.
But that doesnt mean you can go around and shoot all of them up.
Besides, teh issue at hand in the article you referred, was whether or not a gunboat was a warship.
ITs not.
Nowhere it is counted as a warship.
Once again, independents with limited knowledge of the Laws they are supposed to be enforcing.
Anyone who wants to play a Navy or police character shoudl almost be able to recite the Laws they are supposed to be enforcing, or have a copy handy.
In regard to who is trustworthy to provide testimony without evidence, it mostly has to do with how they carry themselves.
For instance, most of the Liberty high command is polite, and not insulting or hateful, most of the time.
Thus, they are trusted to be impartial.
For a case of the opposite, see here. http://discoverygc.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=76236
gone four years, first day back: Zoners still getting shot in Theta :|
' Wrote:I am sure taht there are zoners who commit crimes, and freelancers, and mercenaries.
But that doesnt mean you can go around and shoot all of them up.
Besides, teh issue at hand in the article you referred, was whether or not a gunboat was a warship.
ITs not.
Nowhere it is counted as a warship.
Once again, independents with limited knowledge of the Laws they are supposed to be enforcing.
Anyone who wants to play a Navy or police character shoudl almost be able to recite the Laws they are supposed to be enforcing, or have a copy handy.
Ok, first, please do not misunderstand me. This is not about Zoners. If you wanna pinpoint it, it's actually more about Freelancer ID'ed characters. The main point is, is about players disguising their characters as non-criminals. Which is fine, but they are abusing the concept of whether a human is constantly taking screenshots as they play the game or not. Disregarding that there should by default, at the very least for military organizations, to have "built-in" databases. If official faction members have eye-witnessed them committing criminal activity.
Yes you are completely right about the law that is being quoted and its relevance to the thread I referred to.
I dont know if i am right, but wouldnt pirating with a freelancer id and no pirate iff be sanctionable?
With the id restrictions and the Player rep matching player conduct thing?
gone four years, first day back: Zoners still getting shot in Theta :|
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