Hellfire Legion - Junker relationship.

[Lythrilux]

So, the Hellfire Legion and Junkers really don't like each other. The Hellfire Legion ID used to have a line where they could go and engage Junkers actually, but for some strange reason this was removed.

Hellfire Legion and Junker hostilities still exist. Yet for some strange reason neither ID can shoot at each other. In fact, unlike before where the HF ID could start the engagement, it's now impossible for an HF ID'd player and a Junker ID'd player to shoot at each other.

So, I propose this should be changed so that both IDs can be given lines which will allow them both to engage each other. Given previous and current RP, both in game and on the forums, it makes sense.

and on another note, the HF ID should be reverted back to the old one.

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[Moberg]

I think the change on the Hellfire Legion ID went along with other changes that removed "May treat faction X as combat target" lines from all IDs. Even though Red Hessians and Daumann have a very hostile relationship, the "May treat Daumann ships as combat target" was removed from the ID.
One of the reasons for this change, and probably the change in Hellfire Legion ID too, was that players abused the rights given through this line excessively, hunting down all ships affiliated with said faction and destroying them regardless of their ship type. While this makes sense inRP and would be a possible approach, it has become a very harmful line that in the wrong hands eventually made disadvantages outweigh advantages.
You can probably still attack/kill Junkers, but the usual rules to protect the traders are still in place, so you have to give them a proper demand and kill them only if they don't meet that demand.

[Zen_Mechanics]

One of the primary reasons is the fact that Junkers smugg Cardamine.

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Were fools to make war on our brothers in arms.

[Lythrilux]

I think the change on the Hellfire Legion ID went along with other changes that removed "May treat faction X as combat target" lines from all IDs. Even though Red Hessians and Daumann have a very hostile relationship, the "May treat Daumann ships as combat target" was removed from the ID.
One of the reasons for this change, and probably the change in Hellfire Legion ID too, was that players abused the rights given through this line excessively, hunting down all ships affiliated with said faction and destroying them regardless of their ship type. While this makes sense inRP and would be a possible approach, it has become a very harmful line that in the wrong hands eventually made disadvantages outweigh advantages.
You can probably still attack/kill Junkers, but the usual rules to protect the traders are still in place, so you have to give them a proper demand and kill them only if they don't meet that demand.

One of the big and very awkward problems I find with the Junker faction is that 99% of Junker players are flying transports. That proves very problematic with an ID line that would not let them shoot transports.
Junkers have salvagers, as well as a large amount of bases to dock at. It seems quite balanced really.
I guess the HF ID could be required to make a demand before engaging.

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[SnakThree]

Some Junkers do smuggle Cardamine. But that's not really the lore of Junkers, it's just what players do.

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[Sciamach]

Some Junkers do smuggle Cardamine. But that's not really the lore of Junkers, it's just what players do.

Please point me to where you got this information.

Citation needed.

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[ sci·am·ach ]
/sīˈamək/

A simple, angry man casually working his way through life on a personal quest to acquire copious amounts of street cred.

[SnakThree]

Some Junkers do smuggle Cardamine. But that's not really the lore of Junkers, it's just what players do.

Please point me to where you got this information.

Citation needed.

Or you could counter my argument by providing extensive background on Junkers main activity being Cardamine smuggling instead of salvaging scrap fields where their bases and depots are located with exception of Iverness.

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[Sciamach]

Or you could provide evidence of your claim.

Seeing as you wont however, seems like you don't have any.

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[ sci·am·ach ]
/sīˈamək/

A simple, angry man casually working his way through life on a personal quest to acquire copious amounts of street cred.

[Mephistoles]

Vanilla information does suggest Junkers are involved in smuggling.

The Junkers make their official money from salvaging debris within the fields, but also have a good deal going with various criminals, who like their "no questions asked" policy. Tolerated by the governments, Junkers sometimes deal in contraband, but they are extremely hard to catch red-handed. They are frequently patronized by the criminal element for the refuge they offer within the often hostile territory of House capitol systems.

The phrase "deal in contraband" doesn't necessarily mean they actually move it themselves, but I wouldn't say it's a massive stretch of the imagination for it to be possible.

Oh, more vanilla infocard:

Liberty has two groups: a major population in the New York system, and a smaller enclave in Texas. The Junker base of operations in New London is located near the shipyards within the Southampton Debris Field. In New Berlin they scavenge the remaining pockets of industrial waste and scrap within the asteroid fields. Their latest foray is a departure -- a base in the Border Worlds. Attracted by the ALG operation in Sigma-13, they have set up shop near the facility and do most of the dirty work, picking off the best loot from the old ships for themselves. It also serves as a convenient launching point for Cardamine and Artifact runs into New Berlin. Long-distance smuggling is new for the faction, which is still perfecting this skill.

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Sigma & GMG Discord Chat: https://discord.gg/d4j3W4v

[Zen_Mechanics]

Its not even open for arguement, Junkers do smugg cardis and their co relations with outcasts is also another factor. HF is fighting the authorities, not the people - the people are victims of said factions - a trinity by all accounts

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Were fools to make war on our brothers in arms.