Hi there, just feel like posting some experience and my opinion on the Luxury Liner. I've only bought this ship for about a week, and can honestly say I'm not sure its the right choice.
Don't get me wrong, its a beautiful ship to look at, and I find myself using turret mode as I cruise through trade lanes just to admire its aesthetically beautiful side profile, and its a fun ship to RP, but that is where the problems start. I try to stay in RP by only transporting human cargo, usually doing the Munich to Edinburgh and back two way trade route with passengers and VIPs, which is by no means a great money maker, traversing over 8 systems for a measly 4mil profit with passengers with 4000 cargo space and an initial cargo outlay of 4million. (Also safer, in my opinion than traveling through Liberty with the other routes.)
I've done other trade routes in transports before, but never have I felt more like pirate prey than with the Luxury Liner. Carrying the expensive cargo pirates always put special efforts to demand unreasonable sums of money (in the range of 2-4mil, which is half to all of my profits on one way which takes more than half an hour)
Now the last incident was especially discerning, I had carried my cargo over 6 systems and was close to my destination, when a pirate transport disrupts my engines and demands due payment. Naturally, fed up from being pirated I began to flee after some brief RP, the 14k distance to the nearest base, which trying to shoot him off the best I can.
Needless to say I ran out of bots and batts 4k short of the base from his transport fire alone, and shot down after his friends arrived just outside the base. By sticking just besides my hull my spread out weapons had no way of effectively shooting the pirate transport, 1-2 turrets at a time at best, and my movements were too sluggish to pull away. Now I've spent quite a lot on this craft, some 200m for the ship and almost 100m on Cap V armour, but is it reasonable to be able to be pirated and blown to bits by a lone transport (seems absurd to me, it it seems any small vessel can overcome the liner by flying at a distance almost touching)? Even in RP I'm sure the passengers would not want to see their Captain of such a large vessel submitting to the commands of one lone pirate.
Anyone else had this experience in a Luxury Liner? Expensive ship, expensive cargo, but all the more vulnerable.
' Wrote:Even in RP I'm sure the passengers would not want to see their Captain of such a large vessel submitting to the commands of one lone pirate.
I'm pretty sure that the class of people who would be flying a Lux Liner would greatly appreciate not being blown into tiny pieces.
On the subject of the Liner itself, I think that most of the liners are a bit large. The Lux Liner is (I think) about the size of a cruiser, but it only has a Transport shield. It practically screams "SNAC Me!"
Well, there's a group of people who think the Liner should be a moving fortress, designed to protect its inhabitants with thick armour and powerful weapons.
And there's a group of people that think it shouldn't be anything past an oversized transport with some armour thrown on it.
Choose your camp, I personally don't fly them and never see them, and don't hold a position on this issue.
' Wrote:Well, there's a group of people who think the Liner should be a moving fortress, designed to protect its inhabitants with thick armour and powerful weapons.
And there's a group of people that think it shouldn't be anything past an oversized transport with some armour thrown on it.
Choose your camp, I personally don't fly them and never see them, and don't hold a position on this issue.
Personally I'm indifferent about guns, however I do believe a Liner should be sufficiently capable to survive at least a 15-20k trip to seek safe harbor at a nearby base until the pirate issue is resolved, at least from other transport or heavy fighter pirates acting alone anyway(Which doesn't seem to be the situation even with a 3.3x armor hull multiplier, and I don't see Cap VIII armor making much difference with the extra 0.7, but just imagine those new liners without any at all). Does one need to spend over 1.1bil to even have a chance of escaping to the nearest base from a lone transport or heavy fighter?
Let me guess, the owners of the liners understand the feeling of vulnerability and believe them to be under performing, whilst pirates believe the liners should not be any more armored (else it would take even longer and more effort to hunt one down, the ones with heavy expensive armor upgrades mind you, costing many times the value of their ship and equipment put together), and the current liners, with its limited cargo routes and large, sluggish sizes, are completely justified by both its price, and its current performance. Or perhaps I just don't understand the Discovery populace.
It's a trade ship. The only way it can under perform is if you somehow lose credits. Heck, I believe Liners are more of an RP vessel, and therefor are fine as is. As long as you pay the pirate's non-ridiculous demands (More than two million=Too high) you should be fine.
Saying a liner is purely an RP vessel, and "as long as no losses are made its fine" is wrong. Even in RP, liners are commercial vehicles, employed by commercial corporations, which are profit seeking entities. Have you considered the fact that liners are not always people's side for fun RP ships which they log on to when they feel like RPing a liner, but rather, such as in my case, the liner is their main and only ship. I could be wrong, but if I wanted to RP a liner purely for RPs sake, I would carry passengers and sit around in New York and let them admire the view. However being my only ship and all, and being a commercial vehicle, I believe profits to be something I have a right to work for. Pirates these days seldom ask for under 2mil, especially if your cargo cost you 4mil and the sale of which will net you 8mil. Their rationale seems to be, 'if demanded just the amount the pirate will receive, with no negative loss incurred, the trader should be indifferent between fleeing (and getting blown up), and paying the ridiculous demands'.
I believe being blown up by a sole transport or heavy fighter whilst aiming to send passengers from A to B (docking at nearest base for refuge), without even the intent to fight back, in a liner, is under-performing per se. An organized assault with a party of bandits, on the other hand, makes sense.
It seems like you're flying the wrong ship. I fly a Liner as my only ship, too. Sure, it's a Junker Pilgrim that never hauls slaves, but liners are not meant to be an "uberpwnzorz of teh pirates" ship. Neither are any other large transports. And you got killed by a pirate transport, which is meant for pirating. Pirate T-Ports have an insane amount of firepower for their size.
Your problem seems to be that you aren't making much money off of in-RP human transporting. Unfortunately, lawful human cargo doesn't make much money. So either A) get a different ship so you can make money, or B) Stop complaining and deal with the fact that large transports suck in combat
Just for reference, what kind of guns were you using?
Again I'd like to point out I am not a strong supporter of weaponry, and I do not want to "uberpwnzorz the pirates", I just believe that a liner should be able to escape to the nearest docking base when under attack from a LONE pirate transport or fighter when I am trying my hardest to escape. I believe you are reading this thread wrongly, as I am just sharing my experiences and seeking to find other liner pilots with similar problems, not looking for changes or buffs to destroy pirates claiming a significant share of my income. It seems so difficult to find people to empathize nowadays without others posting defensive arguments along the lines of "OMG the liners are suppose to be like that, your just not suited for it".
Again, in reference to your post Gauss, I have a mixture of Transport turrets 2 and 4. I am not trying to make liners good at combat, although I disagree liners should be grouped with large transports, they are identified as their own class, and can only carry limited forms of cargo in RP. Its not that I'm trying to make lots of money, I just struggle to see how anyone can enjoy hour long trips yielding 0% return. Perhaps that is just the kind of liner pilot you are, but a slave liner is completely different in purpose to a luxury liner in RP. One that travels in openness and glory, the other choosing its own path, whether it travels dangerous alternate routes or not.
Not every topic is looking for a buff of said ship.
Oh, sorry about that. I thought that you meant that you were angry because a liner couldn't defend itself.
On the subject of fleeing in a Liner, the problem with that is the Liner's sheer size. It's almost impossible to miss with a TCD, and because CMs are nearly useless fleeing is impossible. Therefor, the thing that needs balancing is the trade routes, and not the ship itself.
I would classify the Liner as a large transport. Sure, Liners technically have their own class, but they're still large and move cargo.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't believe changing the trade routes would change anything. As a liner in RP would traverse on open space, relocating trade routes would only result in a relocation of pirates, unless of course a profitable route exists for human cargo not coinciding with any other trade routes employed by traders.
