Simple question for the balance team: Do the Argus and LABC get thrusters in .84, like the rest of the cattlebruiser feel of disco ?
If not, do they get some corresponding buff to some other area ?
With the addition of various slots for battleships, prehaps allow the thrusterless BCs to mount BS light weaponry (solaris/Secondaries) as defenseve armament
Battlecruisers are currently a joke. Giving them thrusters would make them completely overpowered against normal cruisers. So really, LABCs and Arguses are stuck between a rock and a hard place.
In that case we need a battlecruiser class turret to give them a method of defence.
Hell just take BS secondaries (which are worthless on BSs, 3.0 refire cruiser turrets) and turn them into BC turrets.
Have BCs use crusier heavy weps and BS Secondaries, plus whatever two class10 turrets they use.
Of course the problem with no thruster is that a lone bomber can solo one, simply put BCs lacking a thruster are unable to get in a reasonable range to attack as at most they could mount two turrets with 3k range, turrets that are even slower than cruiser turrets, while the SNAC can hit them at 3k.
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Gafwmn posting ? Well I think were about to hear from one of .84s best BC pilots....
' Wrote:In that case we need a battlecruiser class turret to give them a method of defence.
Hell just take BS secondaries (which are worthless on BSs, 3.0 refire cruiser turrets) and turn them into BC turrets.
Have BCs use crusier heavy weps and BS Secondaries, plus whatever two class10 turrets they use.
Of course the problem with no thruster is that a lone bomber can solo one, simply put BCs lacking a thruster are unable to get in a reasonable range to attack as at most they could mount two turrets with 3k range, turrets that are even slower than cruiser turrets, while the SNAC can hit them at 3k.
I agree.....I had the oppertunity to watch a lone bomber take on a LABC......it took 15 minutes,but the bomber won,and the LABC had a base to back it up !
That right there says something is not right.....and its nothing to do with skill or luck.
And if you want more about it...just ask..I'll tell you.
The issue is that due to the lack of a thruster, a bomber can too easily stay out of range.
If a BC had a thruster, it could at least chase the bomber at a high enough speed (like crusiers) so that the bomber would be forced to (if he chooses to fire from a range at which he cannot be hit. And that is the key, the SNAC enables bombers to fire while being untouchable) run long enough to allow the BC to regen its sheilds. If the bomber chooses to charge in and attack, he then could enter gun range, and then it would at least be more or less even as he would at least spent some time within gun range.
That said the bigger problem is the balance team purposly makes bombers (all snubcraft really) very over powerd against capital ships.
Making caps 'harder' to abuse only makes the cheaper snubcraft easier and cheaper alternitives to abuse.
I remember back in .84 that in my Taiidan I almost destroyed a Liberty Battle Cruiser and a BHG Battle Cruiser, though I get wrecked by gunboats much faster, this is due to their agility.
I think there should be a 'custom' BC thruster, maybe 140 - 150 max speed with low capacity. Roleplaying as 'emergency bursts' of speed.
' Wrote:- cause it is not considered required for how they are meant to be used.
I guess neither the Argus nor LABC are meant for defending against bombers. Or Cruisers. Or Battleships. Or Gunships. Or- what exactly are they for then?
Yes, I think both ships need a Thruster, but a really crappy one that works at half the speed of regular Cruisers.
' Wrote:I remember back in .84 that in my Taiidan I almost destroyed a Liberty Battle Cruiser and a BHG Battle Cruiser, though I get wrecked by gunboats much faster, this is due to their agility.
I think there should be a 'custom' BC thruster, maybe 140 - 150 max speed with low capacity. Roleplaying as 'emergency bursts' of speed.
EK means thruster capacity isnt as important, but it would also mean that CDig a BC becomes a tactic.
The LABC, according to the meaningless infocard, is supposedly designed to take out enemy cruisers.
The irony is whenever Ive seen a half decent RM crusier captain (or Rogue dessie captain) take on a LABC, the cruiser wins by kiting.
Prehaps give BCs a BS Sheild across the board, then they would at least require two bombers to take down (and once the sheild falls, they go down fast) or one fafnir, since everyone in the RM chats Im in say theyve seen them solo a BS sheild.
' Wrote:I guess neither the Argus nor LABC are meant for defending against bombers. Or Cruisers. Or Battleships. Or Gunships. Or- what exactly are they for then?
Yes, I think both ships need a Thruster, but a really crappy one that works at half the speed of regular Cruisers.
Well from what the devs Ive talked to on skype have told me, theyre supposed to be moneypits for nubs.
And Akura, prehaps just make them like the Nomie cruiser, really high impulse. If I remember rite nomie cruiser has 120 impulse.
They have speed to do their job, but fairplay wise smaller caps still can run away, albiet slowly.
ANd that said, BCs CAN defend themselves slightly, if they mount 4+ cruiser razors in the aft arc, then even when out of energy their regen lets them fire about a razor a second.
Amazing isnt it, a giant turret the size of the ship being shot at is the closest they have to a defence!
As for the dev team.... quit deciding what a ships meant for. All you do is create buggy ships that make even some of the devs mock you in private.
*sigh* i know that the labc works fine - and is balanced compared to the bhg BC...
it would be balanced with the light carrier, too - if that one was still the way i had submitted it ( without a battleship shield )
when a bomber kills a labc in 15 minutes - maybe its not only the labc thats somewhat too weak.
the LABC ( and i guess the argus, too ) feature characteristics that the BHG BC with its thruster does not share. - the fact that the light carrier is somewhat unbalanced is known - so no need to argue about that.
i dare say - a LABC can defeat a rheinland cruiser - and it will also do fairly well vs. a gunboat.
if you want to be serious about balancing .... try that:
fly a LABC vs. several enemies - at least three times
switch roles - now fly against the LABC with various ships
team up with friends - and simulate group fights, too - do that several times.