General capital ship weaponry feedback

[mjolnir]

Due to the turret split the stats of most BS weapons as well as some Cruiser ones were changed rather a lot.

What each type of weapon should do:
The descriptions here are mostly about BS weapons, but almost everything also applies to cruiser ones.

Cerberus - the best choice for combat against a ship of similar size.
High damage, best efficiency, good range, not so easy to hit with (inaccurate)

Mortars - for long range bombardment or high damage in short time.
Very high damage, bad efficiency, very good range, needs aiming (accurate but slow)

Razors - for sniping smaller ships (gbs/bombers/fighters)
High damage, not so good efficiency, medium-low range, very high speed.

Missiles - long range bombardment, defense against smaller caps. Good for de-shielding other caps.
Very high damage, bad efficiency, best range.


Primaries - standard guns for for fights against similar caps, primaries do the job but guns mounted on heavy slots can change the outcome a lot.

Pulses - best as support for mortars/missiles in long range fights.


Secondaries - very good vs cruiser who come close and GBs, usable vs bombers

Normal Solaris - deadly to fighters (keep them out of their effective range), hurt bombers if they try to aim SN. Somewhat usable vs GBs.

Gatling Solaris - better dps and refire than normal solaris but inaccurate (create cone of fire). Good for "area coverage" support in combination with normal solaris.

Flaks - hurt fighters at close range, deflect novas/missiles.
For best effect the flak should explode to the side of the projectile so that it can throw it to wrong direction.

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This thread is for feedback on how well things work or not work on real server with tons of players. But please make sure you have some experience with 4.86 before posting (hence why this thread won't be opened at once).

General ship categories and weapons rather than single ships are meant to be covered here, there is a separate thread for ship-specific stuff.

Weapons stats can always be tweaked in one way or another. So feel free to suggest changes after you have tried things out properly.

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Igiss says: Martin, you give them a finger, they bite off your arm.

[mjolnir]

topic opened

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Igiss says: Martin, you give them a finger, they bite off your arm.

[Camtheman]

Love all of the changes except for the fact that Razors shouldn't be on heavy hardpoints because those are really short in supply and nobody will choose razors, which do they're job medicorely, over missles and mortars which are very effective.

It doesnt matter that what they are effective at due to the sheer lack of heavy slots.

You've got ~16 level 8 slots on some battleships, which would be more than enough to defend it from snubs.

So why use razors at all if they're going to take up valuable slots? That's my logic.

Razors should be on the lvl 8 slot with the rest of the anti gb/snub weapons.

[sadtranslation]

Guess it's the best thing the balance team made during my time here.

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[Vladimir]

Good and nice and all, but... Let's get to the bad parts, shall we?

Flaks are good but don't seem to deflect battleship missiles well;

Solarises are not really effective, gatling solarises are not effective at all. Consider upping their number;;

BS missile seem to do not full damage when targeting and hitting subsystems such as turrets, say, cerberuses - as i understand, they blow up not exactly at hull but at turret, which is a bit away from hull;

Pulses are totally useless because letting one all-powerful primary go for one pulse is already a sacrifice that'd bring you dead, consider moving them down to 8 with appropriate nerft;

Cerberuses and primaries have not perfect synergy due to difference in speed, that'd be bearable if refire was slower but as it's not, you can't reliably hop back and forth between prim&cerb groups to edit your aim so you have to fire them in one group;

Flaks due to some parts of ships covering their arcs can detonate prematurely, for example look at bottom slots on Jorm with those things that look like wings or pieces of armor to protect something, also they blow up prematurely in asteroids A LOT;

Hessian forward gun really lacks a punch at that refire rate;

While some ships now have to manuever to use their weapons to the fullest, example is, again, jorm, that can fire all heavy slots at sides at good angles, some still don't and can just rush head on, which is a shame;

I'm still in a strong favor for battleship torpedoes with very slow refire, ammo, bad tracking, very bad cover, like the forward gun has, but huge speed and range, as the alternative to forward gun or basically forward firepower;

It would be nice if novas/bs missiles had bigger projectile and splash so that they could be shot down to explode by solarises or gatling solarises, giving those guns a purpose of trying to make bombers/fighters blow up on their own/allied missiles/novas, also providing an alternative for flaks;

Razors are utterly useless, consider moving them down to class 9 with appropriate nerf;

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[Ursus]

Most of the changes were in the BS class, and I only have cruisers, but you are asking for caps feedback so I will answer. My boats are all the same basic mix of cruiser-class Pulse and LM for long-range, pulse and BR for GB and similar, and Solaris turrets to fend off bombers. LABC has BS pulse and one flak. My only complaint is BR damage is kind of low for the difficulty in using it against quick-moving targets at short range. If I hit a GB with LM it is dead, if I hit a GB with BR it is annoyed. That would be okay except it is almost as much work to successfully hit with either of them. Just not really worth it, but nothing else to use instead so I keep trying to make it work and keep getting frustrated. Faster refire rate would probably make them more usable. The rest works fine. My real complaints are with the ship turrets which is a different thread.

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Discovery 24/7 Negotiating Tactics:

[Camtheman]

Razors are utterly useless, consider moving them down to class 9 with appropriate nerf;

I do hope you mean 8 because moving them to 9 wouldn't make sense because primaries and pulses go there...

Completely different targets.

Solarises are not really effective, gatling solarises are not effective at all. Consider upping their number;;

Yeap. Both terrible.

If you can't hit with secondaries you shouldn't be flying a cap.

Secondaries are the new Solaris.

Cerberuses and primaries have not perfect synergy due to difference in speed, that'd be bearable if refire was slower but as it's not, you can't reliably hop back and forth between prim&cerb groups to edit your aim so you have to fire them in one group;

Agreed...

Oh, and Normal Mortars are still more energy efficent that Heavy Mortars.
Which is funny...

Mortar hull damage = 280,000
If you've got 2 that's 560,000

One Heavy Mortar does 520,000 damage for 2,500,000 energy, while 2 normal mortars do more damage for
2,400,000 energy.

I guess the Heavy Mortar is used as a slot slaving technique... but still... you have a higher chance of missing with just one than 2.

I still think 2 mortars is the way to go.

[pitockm]

please speed up flaks turning.

[str8]

Osiris has 1 x class 10 and 5 x class 9 , will it stay that way or you will make it be 2 x 10 and 4 x9?

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[mjolnir]

Razors - well they won't be moved to lvl 8 slots as that would mean bigger BS could mount rather many of them and 1600 m/s instakills of GBs etc aren't all that fun or balanced. Moving them to lvl9 is a bit out of the question as well. I'd like to hear proposals how to make them be worth mounting on lvl 10s instead.

Pulses - again they won't be lvl 8, as lvl8 slots should have little to nothing to say about how BS does in capship combat. What kind of stats should they have on lvl 9 slots is another matter. Imo there should be used loadouts that combine mortars/missiles?

Cerbs - they won't be synced in speed with primaries, their insane dps and efficiency is more than enough.

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Igiss says: Martin, you give them a finger, they bite off your arm.