Please no more of these insane amounts of hitpoints. Current bombers shouldn't have more armor than very heavy fighters. They're the same size, they pack more firepower, no energy drain, one shot kill weaopons, way too many regens and only a tad less of agility. They can do everything and they're just too good in fighter vs. fighter.
On the other hand, this one could get 20.000 hp armor but not 30k
No, VHF kills bomber almost without fail (Cat, Red Cat and Snubnose non-withstanding) if the VHF has any idea what they're doing and the bomber pilot isn't Dustin or Gurjiv. Aside from the bombers I mentioned and a few others, they are all far less agile and far larger than fighters, and rarely win unless they get lucky. Bombers need the armor to survive, and it still doesn't help them too much against capital ships, where dodge > all.
Making this thing bigger/slower/less agile than a Barghest is suicide. Thors and Barghests already have issues dealing with some capital ships (difficulties exaggerated by competent pilots, not "sit in place motionless and in turret view" like most seem to be) and this would need armor nearing that of a gunboat to work like this. At the very least, freighter shields (Barghest needs them too).
While a rear-mounted CD would be devastating in one-on-ones, the rear-mounted torpedo won't be too useful unless you can fire both in one pass.
And why does it have class-9 and class-4 guns/turrets while all VHFs and Bombers have class 10s? I'm confused...
class 9 weaponmount / class 4 turret for a simple reason. - if it is able to fire two supernovas with one energybar, it ll have a transports energycore that is far bigger than a bombers. - such an energycore might make it possible to mount the most powerhungry weapons and still regenerate easily ( current bombers still loose energy while firing some codes [ slowly ] or a full load of shieldbreakers [ 4 coladas drain even a bombers power ] )
by limiting it to class 9 weapons - i limit it to faction guns for one - and make sure it is not overpowered in the anti-fighter department ( a bomber in the end, not an anti-fighter ship ) - by adding only class 4 turrets, it won t be able to mount the high level turrets like buckshots - and rheinland hasn t got lvl5 turrets anyway, i think.
so the idea is to make it REALLY useless against any fighter. - not just a semi uselessness that turns out to be quite effective. - but i admit, i am quite disgusted at bombers that do better in antifighter pvp than fighters. - they fire their weapons with more ease than fighters, cause they don t need to do burst fire, but can simply spray the heaviest weapons - they turn and dodge like fighters and are small enough to avoid fire like a fighter while still able to fire a weapon that does 140.000 damage.
so, there i am highly biased of course. - but thats also why this thread exists. cause i am biased towards bombers - i need other points of views before that ship can be submitted ( or send to xing to submit ) - cause when its just about me.... i would make sure that it does its one mission well ( anti warship ) but sucks when it comes to fighting fighters ( and that means - an ace bomber pilot getting his butt handed to him by a rookie fighter pilot )
when you re biased like that - you think of the worst case that can happen with a ship of such power - and so you start to nerf it down to something that others who have a different point of view think its utterly useless.
anyway - here is a compromise.... - it was discussed for the barghest, too - maybe a lvl 6 ( 30.000 ) freighter shield [ this shield has quite some power, but it regenerates REALLY slowly - not overpowered ] - turn rates of the barghest should be fine - the valkyrie hitbox makes it a big enough target from the top. - one could suggest lvl10 - lvl5 turrets to igiss - it won t do too much - or i can add another 2 hardpoints for 2 lvl9 guns - giving it 4x lvl9 and 2x lvl5 turrets.
another option is to simply make it a normal bomber with 4x lvl10 weapons and 2 torp slots and a normal bombers powercore. but then - any reasonable pilot would choose to fly the RH bomber which is 1/3 of this ships size.
Keep it how you have it. Even an experienced bomber pilot will feed you those back firing torps. Ask Caylith. She is or maybe was, dunno her status, with blowing her mines behind her. I know I've eaten a few. A rear firing torp will make you cry if Dustin or I or a few others have them. And have the energy to use 2 SN's? in one pass? forget a second SN, keep the second blast for your return shot, I'd mount a Nova and use the blast radius on all the fighters following.
I have given this a bit of thought. You might not be able to use this bomber against fighters, even NPC's, send the mod you make to an experienced pilot and let us test loads till we are comfortable. We'll eat you anyway, even if you make us the size of a barn.
But thats just my bomber whore experience speaking.
Hate to be that big, no arguing, but for the extra SN blast, I'll take it and make you cry.
Edit: Oh and for the Hit Points and such, no reason to make it have less if its so easy to hit. 30K is fair. RH Bomber already has 21 and change. Others are close, if not better. Bigger target makes for more hits. need more bots and bats, and more hit points naturally, as well as the sheer extra size and armore to be added for that size, it makes perfect sense to have more hit points.
Well, due to size, there is no fear of this thing taking on fighters... (unless with nova torpedos, where it will work just as good as any other bomber, so balance is there)
I think that with a power core larger than what bombers have right now, it will be able to fire some gunboat cannons, that are only lvl 7 to 9 i believe,... so perhaps giving it turrets only, (and giving it lvl 5 turrets) can cure that. With 4 turrets it is hardly of any danger to fighters and can perhaps fend of an attack coming from behind, when it tries to flee... (very unlikley thou)
Otherwise I like the stats... it is not realistic thou. If the Rheinlanders would come up with a core powerful enough for two supernovas they would mount them up front...
I wouldn't fly it... but submit it anyway, i hope Igiss sees the reason within those boundries... perhaps making rheinland supernova use some less power... and deals less damage proportionaly, enabling this craft to function on Rheinland weapons only...
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@jure: yes - of course anyone that mounted one torp backwards when it was able to fire 2 foreward would be outright silly ( or a traitor ). - the backwards torp is really only a balance thing. - the reasonable thing to do would be to scale it down to a normal size and give it normal bomber stats - only problem there is - rheinland has a bomber already - so why make another one. unless you give it to the unioners or other rheinland pirates as their own. ( but that d be xings decission ).
- if the supernova wasn t such an overpowered weapon, i wouldn t mind giving it more than 1. - if it was still like 4.83 ( 48.000 damage ) - i wouldn t hesitate to give it three foreward torp slots. - but the supernova as it is - and the sheer believe that a bomber is only a bomber when it has a supernova makes me not suggest more than one. - if factions agreed that the minirazor was their heaviest weapon - i wouldn t mind giving it 4 for an extra punch against their smaller bombers that only mounted 2 razors.
the one thing that limits bombers from solely destroying cruisers is that the SN needs the energy to refire. -- i m a horrible pilot and won t hit anything if i haven t got tracking missiles.. but even i managed to take down a cruisers shields easily in my BHG bomber ( and the BHG has a reasonable hitbox even ) and the only reason i wasn t able to destroy them was that my secondary weaponry are missiles mostly - so i cannot keep the shield down with the gunpower while getting the SN into the hull. - so the SN always only takes out their shields when it replenished.
when i was able to fire two supernovas, i would always take down the shield and do 140k damage to the hull - easily. the poor cruisers would have no chance. - even if ppl cry : use an escort! - to the cruiser... it doesn t help much.
if i could limit a torp slot to the nova torp instead of the supernova - i d make it fire 4 foreward...... . about gunboat guns.... they use a lot more energy. - i think a normal bomberpower is like 54k - to fire two ... you d need something like 80k - i think a gunboat gun needs 90k. ( not to mention - who wants to fly with a turret the size of the entire fighter - ooRP much? )
I think it?s a funny concept ....I would certainly fly one if it gets into game...
The stats look nice and funny except one thing
It should get lvl 6 freighter shield - 24k (just like Barghest is getting I believe), else it would be out of shields all the time and would die extremely fast to anything.
Also did you think about bats/bots? I'm thinking about 150.
Igiss says: Martin, you give them a finger, they bite off your arm.
Well presented. It could be a fine addition but I agree with Martin. Freighter shield would fit that thing better. It could be a bit useless otherwise no matter what the firepower capabilities of the ship are. But yet again, I couldn't find a great motivation in this concept to make me abandon using the Snubnose and get my hands on this thing instead. Looking forward to see the progress though.