Battlecruisers

[Titan*]

sad to see people saying battlecruisers was anti-battleship and more useful before. No they were not, battlecruisers was anti-heavy battleship mostly because heavy battleships was easier to hit with BS Primary.
They were useless vs Any type of Snub,Gunboat,Cruiser,Light and Medium Battleships. Light/Medium Battleship was dodging BC Prims from 1.2k-1.4k
Battlecruisers was group fighting ships only they were super hard to hit and nearly impossible to deshield from 2.5k with battleship weapons. BC vs BS fights was taking lots of time and it was super boring for both sides, fight was usually ending up on draw. Battlecruiser had to get close like 1.5k to hit Battleship often and it was close enough for Battleship to kill BC easly

Battlecruisers scaled up to make BCs easier to hit with Battleship weapons
If you think BS Primary was better for Battlecruisers, you are wrong because range doesnt mean anything if light and medium battleship can dodge them from 1.4k
If you compare BS Primary and BC Primary, you'll notice that BC Primary is faster and still light and medium battleship can dodge them easly
Range is not -very- useful in group fights, it is only useful for duels
Currently Battlecruisers have 4 BC Prims, that means they do way more damage than 2x Battleship Primary do

[Lythrilux]

I strongly disagree that they were as useless as you say they were. With the right loadout, you could gear them to be at least somewhat survivable against snubs (defensively), devastating to gunboats (I once killed 5 Hathors in Delta in a 5v2 where my only support was a snub), potent to Cruisers (skill dependent fight) and potent to Medium and Light Battleships (skill dependent, once again).

The end result of all those changes has made Battlecruisers immensely boring to fly and without a niche. It sucked out the skill dependent gameplay that was different from Discovery's usual "my thing is bigger than your thing so I always win" style cap combat.

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[Spectre]

battlecruisers was anti-heavy battleship

No they weren't. It's clear that our BC dev doesn't even know his own sips, because BCs were far more versatile ships.

They were useless vs Any type of Snub,Gunboat,Cruiser,Light and Medium Battleships.

I've not only seen but actually fought every single other ship type in the game with a BC, and the only troublesome vessel that could peeve me in a BC was the fearsome Light fighter. No amount of solaris turrets would eat them with my lag.

Light/Medium Battleship was dodging BC Prims from 1.2k-1.4k

That was easily countered by properly aiming your shots.

Battlecruisers was group fighting ships only they were super hard to hit and nearly impossible to deshield from 2.5k with battleship weapons

BCs could easily be torn apart in group fights. They were beautiful soloers, and nearly any group fight I've seen a BC jump into, it was torn to shreds by any ship heavier than it. As Giorgi pointed out, any ship is screwed when anything heavier cruises on it.

Battlecruisers scaled up to make BCs easier to hit with Battleship weapons

Half a good idea, but overdone to the point where now they're too easy to kill.

If you think BS Primary was better for Battlecruisers, you are wrong because range doesnt mean anything if light and medium battleship can dodge them from 1.4k

Firstly, telling people they're wrong on the internet is asking for controversy. Second, it's your personal opinion, and as I stated above, is easily counterable.

If you compare BS Primary and BC Primary, you'll notice that BC Primary is faster and still light and medium battleship can dodge them easly

Faster doesn't mean anything when you don't have the range to engage the target. You're only undermining your own argument further by stating that ships can dodge the shots easier, which is made laughably simple by the fact that they don't get hit in the first place.

Range is not -very- useful in group fights, it is only useful for duels

Which is what the BCs excelled at. You're bending a ship class in the direction you want, not the way it was designed.

Currently Battlecruisers have 4 BC Prims, that means they do way more damage than 2x Battleship Primary do

Except they don't. Every battleship in the game has at least four primary slots, and giving BCs the same amount with less damage, less range, less efficiency and less usefulness is like saying you took a Toyota Corolla, removed half the gas tank, dummed down the engine and screwed with the steering and called it the exact same car, but with 'better' features.

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#BringBackTheCommonwealth

=CR=-----IN|G
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A plurality is not a majority, and a majority is not everybody.

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Spec's RP Consortium
V-3X | CV-Montu | Fort Murray
Unum pro Omnibus, Omnes pro Uno

Your signature grew too big, I helped downscale it. ~Vex
Your adjustment grew too big, I helped downscale it. ~Spectre

[Titan*]

I strongly disagree that they were as useless as you say they were. With the right loadout, you could gear them to be at least somewhat survivable against snubs (defensively), devastating to gunboats (I once killed 5 Hathors in Delta in a 5v2 where my only support was a snub), potent to Cruisers (skill dependent fight) and potent to Medium and Light Battleships (skill dependent, once again).

The end result of all those changes has made Battlecruisers immensely boring to fly and without a niche. It sucked out the skill dependent gameplay that was different from Discovery's usual "my thing is bigger than your thing so I always win" style cap combat.

well how about veteran BC pilot vs veteran BS Pilot? If you killed 5 hathors that means they literally didnt know how to play this game. Because 5 Hathor with some knowledge would blast you off from the space less than 10 min

Like i said, BCs was complete garbage class before, you should've fight more skilled players with old BCs

battlecruisers was anti-heavy battleship

No they weren't. It's clear that our BC dev doesn't even know his own sips, because BCs were far more versatile ships.

it is clear that you dont know anything about capital ships. Wish we had one old BC to show how garbage they are

[Titan*]

"my thing is bigger than your thing so I always win" style cap combat.

also give me an example of "my thing is bigger than yours, so i win" style cap combat

[Spectre]

also give me an example of "my thing is bigger than yours, so i win" style cap combat

Ransuers. Arbiters. Valors. Bismarck.

Need I go on?

it is clear that you dont know anything about capital ships. Wish we had one old BC to show how garbage they are

I've flown enough BCs to know that their niche was a unique one, and that what you've done to them is not only remove that niche, but turn them into a fish out of water. They don't function how you imagine they do, so quiet implying that you're 'fixing' them, when all they've been turned into is an expensive decorative piece for your military collection.

---

#BringBackTheCommonwealth

=CR=-----IN|G
----
A plurality is not a majority, and a majority is not everybody.

---

Spec's RP Consortium
V-3X | CV-Montu | Fort Murray
Unum pro Omnibus, Omnes pro Uno

Your signature grew too big, I helped downscale it. ~Vex
Your adjustment grew too big, I helped downscale it. ~Spectre

[Titan*]

also give me an example of "my thing is bigger than yours, so i win" style cap combat

Ransuers. Arbiters. Valors. Bismarck.

Need I go on?

okay lets compare Arbiter and Bismarck so Arbiter is bigger so it should win right?
Tell that to some veteran cap player they will laugh at your face, im not going to explain pretty sure you know how bismarck will win you've got knowledge about capital ships right?

I've flown enough BCs to know that their niche was a unique one, and that what you've done to them is not only remove that niche, but turn them into a fish out of water. They don't function how you imagine they do, so quiet implying that you're 'fixing' them, when all they've been turned into is an expensive decorative piece for your military collection.

Old BCs with Battleship Prims = Unique
New BCs with Their own gun class = ???

it seems you didn't flown BCs enough.

Light/Medium Battleship was dodging BC Prims from 1.2k-1.4k

That was easily countered by properly aiming your shots.

Aiming while Turret Steering? Would be nice if you can teach that to every capital player, Turret Steering Meta would be nice

[Lythrilux]

well how about veteran BC pilot vs veteran BS Pilot?

Those matchups made for very fun and very intense fights that kept you on the edge of your seat. It's what I lived for in this game.

If you killed 5 hathors that means they literally didnt know how to play this game. Because 5 Hathor with some knowledge would blast you off from the space less than 10 min

A correctly equipped Battlecruiser could instantly kill Gunboats at both long and close ranges.

Like i said, BCs was complete garbage class before, you should've fight more skilled players with old BCs

Maybe you just weren't good in them, didn't understand them or both? I don't recall mass outcry that the class was garbage and needed a redefining rework.

also give me an example of "my thing is bigger than yours, so i win" style cap combat

Smaller classes having absolutely no chance against larger classes irrespective of skill. Taking the element of skill out of the game makes it boring.

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[Titan*]

Those matchups made for very fun and very intense fights that kept you on the edge of your seat. It's what I lived for in this game.

at the end you know, you will lose right?, or maybe BS will force you to run because like i said Light BS and Medium BS was able to kill Battlecruiser
I've tested that many times, Light Battleship was able to kill Battlecruiser or if BC doesnt want to get close, it becomes boring after 30 min of gun shots and i did the opposite, BC cant win against Light or Medium Battleship

If you killed 5 hathors that means they literally didnt know how to play this game. Because 5 Hathor with some knowledge would blast you off from the space less than 10 min

A correctly equipped Battlecruiser could instantly kill Gunboats at both long and close ranges.

as far as i know Battlecruisers didnt had a weapon that can hit a gunboat and instakill it from long range, that means 5 hathor was very weak.

Like i said, BCs was complete garbage class before, you should've fight more skilled players with old BCs

Maybe you just weren't good in them, didn't understand them or both? I don't recall mass outcry that the class was garbage and needed a redefining rework.

Actually I was but i fight skilled players instead of newbies
Also i fight skilled bc players enough to see how garbage they are

also give me an example of "my thing is bigger than yours, so i win" style cap combat

Smaller classes having absolutely no chance against larger classes irrespective of skill.

you know that it is up to loadouts and skill right?

a medium battleship with close range loadout can easly takeout long-range heavy battleship loadout
cruiser can easly takeout any battleship that doesnt have proper anti-cruiser loadout
battlecruiser(mostly ones with 4 heavy slot) can also tank long-range light battleships and kill it with close range loadout <- tested today it is very possible

basically everything is up to your loadout and skill level

[Spectre]

Old BCs with Battleship Prims = Unique
New BCs with Their own gun class = ???

it seems you didn't flown BCs enough.

I'll keep it short, since you nailed it with old BCs.

New BCs with Their own gun class = fat, slow, underpowered, lacking range and lacking the niche they had before.

Don't imply that I haven't flown BCs enough when I used to fly it primary before the reform. On the contrary, I can tell from your responses that you have no idea how BCs even worked, or how they fit into the Discovery capital class lineup.

Aiming while Turret Steering? Would be nice if you can teach that to every capital player, Turret Steering Meta would be nice

It's honestly not that hard, and I'm sure plenty of people can do it anyway.

as far as i know Battlecruisers didnt had a weapon that can hit a gunboat and instakill it from long range, that means 5 hathor was very weak.

It was called 'Cruiser Turret' and 'Cruiser Pulse Turret'. They honestly work pretty well.

battlecruiser(mostly ones with 4 heavy slot) can also tank long-range light battleships and kill it with close range loadout

You aren't taking anything being brought forth to you to mind, though. Not to mention Hellbore's can act as cerbs regardless of range, just with a slightly slower firing rate.

basically everything is up to your loadout and skill level

And yet you'd rather remove any amount of skill based combat from a battlecruiser and just have it be a niche that doesn't work, instead relying on surviving 'tanking a light BS with long-range based loadout'

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#BringBackTheCommonwealth

=CR=-----IN|G
----
A plurality is not a majority, and a majority is not everybody.

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Spec's RP Consortium
V-3X | CV-Montu | Fort Murray
Unum pro Omnibus, Omnes pro Uno

Your signature grew too big, I helped downscale it. ~Vex
Your adjustment grew too big, I helped downscale it. ~Spectre