Turning the Nephilim into a Liner.

[Karlotta]

pardon my memory, there was a dev thread about this years ago and even included in the patch notes once i think. the neph was supposed to be replaced with a new model liner but i guess it never happend.

I'm guessing the reason that failed is because replacing the beautiful model of the Neph would have been exactly the wrong thing to do.

The model is great, its great for a mobile colony, it's great for a person-carrier.

It's not even a problem that Zoners have caps, or even that they have carriers or battleships.

The problem is that something that looks like a mobile colony and is supposed to act like a mobile colony was made to be a battleship and will therefore inevitably be used as a Battleship instead of a mobile colony.

Give Zoners some other Battleship if they think they absolutely need one.

---

User was banned for: https://discoverygc.com/forums/showthrea...tid=200950
Time left: (Permanent)

[Sombs]

Zoners are people who left house space.

That's it.

That's all it has always been and all it should be.

The only Zoner groups -- which is a complex thing in and of itself -- which should be able to field anything even approaching the size of a Nephilim would be ones like the Consensus. And those wouldn't even be anything near warships. They'd be mobile freeports, capable of defending themselves from local nuisances.

If you seriously think that Zoner roleplay would be thrown in the trash without a heavy carrier and a dreadnought then maybe you should throw it in the trash and look back on what Zoners are supposed to be.

I love how you prove my point. You seem to have no idea what Zoners are.

The Zoners are a great community, a movement of people who quasi-loosely but organized enough have managed to establish themselves outside the colonies. They are not civilians. They are not pacifists. They are not "just people who left the house space". In that case, Curacaoans and Kurileans would be Zoners as well, which they are not.

Zoners are people who joined the Zoner movement, leaving house space because of many reasons. They get a certain repercussion for that, for example not being welcome with transports that otherwise would require a corporate license. That is why the Zoner Whale, inRP, is limited to Zoners and not allowed to dock everywhere. OSI has the monopoly on that, as they made deals with the houses to have that corporate license.

Zoners are actually strong people. They need to be strong, as otherwise all Freeports would have been overrun like Freeport 2. That however never happened. Freeport 4 was given into the hands of the IMG, they had to give it to the Liberty Navy and they lost it to Gallia. Freeport 2 was "sold" by its own administrator to the scum of Liberty and Rheinland. Freeport 1 still resists against the annection of the BAF for the sake of winning against Corsairs and Hessians. Zoners are strong people because they have to face the cosmical threats of Sirius and especially the Edge Worlds. They need mobile colony ships that are basically warships, fortified heavily with a focus on defense and rather limited offensive aspects (it would be neat if it was presented that way ingame). They need the Aquilon because it is a ship that brings craft from one end of Sirius to the literal other end. They need to resist against pirates. They need to resist against Nomads and any other thread.

Yes, the Zoner playerbase, especially the indie playerbase, is not reflecting those things very well. We have many indies that are literally lolwuts. Outcasts have that, too, especially in Liberty. Corsairs have that as well, however it doesn't differ much from the regular YALALALALALALALA Corsair playerbase. No, you all should stop whining around about that. It is how things are. People need to learn it the hard way, which is why I love to log Nomads or Core and beat the hell out of a lolwut ship, be it a Ranseur or a Nephilim. Now that the Arbiter is available to indies, I'll do that even in Liberty. However do not destroy the toys anyone can use because a few people are just not able to handle them well. This is a serious issue with annoyed people in Discovery. "This annoys me, so I need to lobby it out of the game!" It is a horrible attitude and each of you should feel bad about it, because you're literally complaining for the sake of complaining instead of doing something constructive. Helping newbies playing their ships the right way. Telling them the Nephilim is a horrible ship for PvP, or showing it to them.

Please, for the sake of sanity, if you guys are annoyed, stop wanting it instrumentalize things for lobbyism and trial by forum. Discovery - thankfully - is not a democracy.

---

---

Uncharted System Stories: 18 | 32 | 34 | 37 | 38 | 85

Templates: Character | Transmissions

Alternative Soundtracks

---

[Mephistoles]

I view this same way as I view things like restricting mining IDs to 4,300 cargo ships or battleships to official faction IDs.

If we were a few years ago, it'd be a good idea. It'd shape the landscape of the server for the best, make lots of sense and be a generally positive change. Unfortunately, we are now in a time where we can't be taking such things, that have existed for many years, away from people. I agree with the premise of this suggestion, as I do with others, however it is so late in the game that making this change would ultimately be detrimental.

For better or worse, this is one of the toys we'll just have to let people have.

---

Sigma & GMG Discord Chat: https://discord.gg/d4j3W4v

[Kazinsal]

No ships have ever created such a constant, never-ending torrent of problems, unrest, and torment in Discovery Freelancer quite like the Zoner battleships have. Ranseur drama is always solved with Legates or Overlords. Overlord drama is always solved with Barghests or Fafnirs. Valor drama is always solved with... pretty much every ship in Sirius. The Nephilim? Nephilim drama never freaking ends. It merely goes on hiatus for a few months after one thread hits 15 pages and the dancing lock shows up and Dusty or whomever greentexts "play nice kids" and we all go back to raiding Alpha or glitching POB weapons platforms or whatever the annoying trend of the patch is.

I could buy the Nephilim being a liner and/or being restricted to Zoner bases only. I could buy the Aquilon being used for long range transport if it weren't also a capable battleship and the Bustard didn't exist.

I do not buy that the Zoners need a literal dreadnought when they have a formidable cruiser (which is one of the best ship classes in the game), a fighter line including a pretty damn good SHF, access to the same bombers and bomber equipment as the rest of Sirius, and the historical lore to better support the use of small craft versus literal dreadnoughts. I do not buy that that Zoners need a battleship-class carrier warship when there is already an open market carrier and there is roleplay and mechanical precedent for a decade combined for liners and transports being retrofitted as carriers.

I have been here for a very long time. A lot has changed. Zoner battleships being absolutely daft and the people screaming their heads off every time it's suggested to change them have not. It is time to end this the way the majority of the community has wanted to for a decade.

e: Also, if you want Freeport 2 back, go get yourself the horribly-named Zoner Militant ID and do something about it. The team has given you the chance to do so.

---

Retired, permanently.

[Cælumaresh]

I see it being said here that a majority of the community doesn't want the Neph to be a battleship, but a large part of the people flying a Nephilim aren't active on the forums, and probably don't notice threads such as these. What if one day these players log, and notice that their favorite toy is suddenly a lot more worthless for their PVE farming than they remember it to be? Sure, a part would switch to ships like the ranseur and such, but another part would be pretty pissed off over the amount of time they put into getting the money for their shiny toy, and leave the server upset. Do you really think that's worth it, just to satisfy the vocal part of the community that has been crying for years that the Nephs aren't how they envision zoners being?

I' m with Sombra on this one. Leave it as it is. (altho while we are at it, those models Jinx made are damn sexy, and I wouldn't mind seeing the entire Zoner capline being changed to them, whilst keeping the current shipclasses intact)

---

This Galaxy is vast; its wonders and beauty are almost unfathomable. But the galaxy also hides dark secrets, some of which have lain dormant since the beginning of time itself. There is a danger in secrets, both in seeking and in knowing. Some things are meant to be hidden from view. Some mysteries defy understanding, and sometimes even the things we think we know are untrue. Some secrets should remain untouched.

Qui desiderat pacem, praeparet bellum

[Chronicron]

yes and please get this over with already

---

This is a feature as most Discovery players would not receive a response from women.

[Sombs]

And what drama does the Nephilim create? "Oh no, there is a big fortress out there that farms nomads!" - Core has law-enforcement lines for that. While they inRP want to be the only ones to farm nomads, Zoners have left house space to enjoy the riches of the edge worlds just as the next one. Deal with it inRP. Stop whining.

"Oh no, there is a Nephilim that enters house space for whatever reason!" - Enforce your laws as house space navy. You have those for a reason. Get rid of that giant target. Stop whining.

"Oh no, there is a Nephilim that fires at me although it is a Zoner!" - Lolwuts will always be a thing, no matter if Nephilim, Ranseur, Overlord or freighter-shield, armorless 5k-trains that write in sms-language. Kill them, report them for the rule violation, stop whining.

"Oh no, there is a Nephilim that -" - Stop whining, deal with it inRP. Be the better example or enjoy an easy blue. Stop whining, you're the person making a drama of it. Not the Zoner. It is you.

What you buy and what not, I don't care, honestly. Each faction has a certain ship line although Sabre and Falcon are the best ships out there, to many people, and so has the Zoner community every right to have a heavy, tanky, often function-foreign battleship-equivalent. It is not a dreadnough. It is a giant target with a horrible turret placement, so large you can kite it easily with even the worst capitals. It is not a good combat ship. It is defensive. It is perfect the way it is: Crap. It just so happens that tanky, dodge-weak battleships with horrible turret placement are still good at PvE because you are always in firing range once the Nephilim entered the mission area. Still, there are many better PvE ships (Legate, even Ranseur) out there, and any capital is better at PvP than the Nephilim. The Aquilon is quite similar. Like the Nephilim, it has a horrible shape. It can dodge up and down, and that is it. In comparison with most other carriers, the Aquilon looks nicer but is worse in terms of combat.

People scream because they want to scream. Let them scream. Let them whine. It speaks for them.

---

---

Uncharted System Stories: 18 | 32 | 34 | 37 | 38 | 85

Templates: Character | Transmissions

Alternative Soundtracks

---

[Kazinsal]

I' m with Sombra on this one. Leave it as it is. (altho while we are at it, those models Jinx made are damn sexy, and I wouldn't mind seeing the entire Zoner capline being changed to them, whilst keeping the current shipclasses intact)

The technical problems with Jinx models almost always outweigh their aesthetic value.

You'll notice that many of the Zoner ship model filenames have "mk3" or "mk4" in them. That's how many times they've been remodelled for various reasons, many of which were "this thing is a broken, horribly textured pile of feces".

---

Retired, permanently.

[Karlotta]

People need to learn it the hard way, which is why I love to log Nomads or Core and beat the hell out of a lolwut ship, be it a Ranseur or a Nephilim.

And here's exactly what (rightfully) gives this community such a bad reputation, because it drives and turns normal people away in disgust.

Many influential members love to "beat the hell out of lolwuts" so they support "community policing" of things like ships and bases, and oppose balancing things with game mechanics or rules so they can keep "policing".

Just so they have a license to "beat the hell out of lolwuts", feel all big and strong, and pass denigrating and bullying weaker players into submission off as "doing the right thing" or "community policing".

There's absolutely nothing wrong with "beating the hell" out of players in PvP as long as you respect them as fellow players, and as long as you'd be willing to endure the same thing you do if it came from them.

But what you describe there is to denigrate and bully people, treating them like you would never want to be treated, until they either submit to someone who is treating them like dirt, or leave. That's not a good basis for building a larger community whose members can get along with each other.

---

User was banned for: https://discoverygc.com/forums/showthrea...tid=200950
Time left: (Permanent)

[MotokoSusu]

you people are yet again cry crying about the Nephilim. you bunch of self center all so ran's (a more colorful word would have fit)
Blah Blah blah booo hoooo I have you know you I rp my Neph for clearance for entering house spaces through permits, visas, and what ever the required means to move ours through those spaces. you have the selfish gall to curb my game play and rp because you can not deal with it. Yeah yeah riiight take a ship that is suppose to defend it self against the horrors of deep space to a lesser version all so you can feel comfortable with yourselfs in the fact you forced other people to play the way you want them to play.... you can stuff that idea why up where the sun don't shine. But is ok for every swing you know what in liberty navy to have a bs bc or any manner of cap they want to spam cap a single pirate transport.. I think that is the poster child of lolwattery. I have a suggestion if you don't like it leave or RP I am tired of people and their constant cry cry over every aspect of the game and sadly it is not coming from the new player it coming for the vets that been here for ages and now when all their buddy have moved on thing they enjoyed doing all of a sudden become issues and they seem to take it upon themselves to be some kind of moral high ground. Sure there a pile of thing I don't like about the server but I keep to myself play through it. I don't try and make everyone else miserable because I don't like something. AND YEAHLOOK down thereV is that a Neph and proud of the lady. I even wrote a story about finding mine so BACK OFF read this

---