(08-02-2019, 09:52 AM)teschy Wrote: I'm not sure if you were addressing me personally there, but if wanting to get an answer is labeled as clamoring for attention, then okay. I was speaking on behalf of several people that have gotten no response from the staff on official channels, not about myself.
No, I used your Post to highlight certain points (I should have taken your name off of it, my mistake. It was aimed at the Community).
(08-02-2019, 09:52 AM)teschy Wrote: I was only talking about discussions that are several months old and have not been addressed in a meaningful way.
(08-02-2019, 09:28 AM)St.Denis Wrote: We see lots of discussions like this, with lots of opinions for and against.
What we don't see is any follow-up of a Player's Request asking for things.
Just because there is a discussion, doesn't mean that people should act on it. Like I said, "should we listen to the vocal ones, only?"
If a PR is put in, after a meaningful discussion, then you are more likely to get an answer.
'I would like to be half as clever as some people like to believe they are' Life is full of disappointments, it is how we handle them that helps to define us, as a person
(08-02-2019, 10:05 AM)St.Denis Wrote: Just because there is a discussion, doesn't mean that people should act on it. Like I said, "should we listen to the vocal ones, only?"
If a PR is put in, after a meaningful discussion, then you are more likely to get an answer.
Isn't that a bit contradictory? You are reluctant to listen to the 'vocal' ones (even though the vocal ones are the only ones that actually give any feedback) yet you also think that it's okay for a single person to make a request that bypasses the entire debate process. Unless by vocal you mean those who discuss things publicly instead of behind closed doors.
Providing some feedback and input into a discussion isn't the same as acting on it. Nobody is asking that something needs to be implemented tomorrow, but the good ideas should at least be recognized, and the bad ones should be called out. I think that's what people want, a form of immediate acknowledgement or disapproval followed by actions at later time, if it's the case.
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(08-02-2019, 10:36 AM)teschy Wrote: Providing some feedback and input into a discussion isn't the same as acting on it. Nobody is asking that something needs to be implemented tomorrow, but the good ideas should at least be recognized, and the bad ones should be called out. I think that's what people want, a form of immediate acknowledgement or disapproval followed by actions at later time, if it's the case.
(08-02-2019, 10:05 AM)St.Denis Wrote: Just because there is a discussion, doesn't mean that people should act on it. Like I said, "should we listen to the vocal ones, only?"
If a PR is put in, after a meaningful discussion, then you are more likely to get an answer.
I will try to explain it a bit better.
No problem with people discussing things on a open Forum. I also said that with an discussion, there are people for it and people against it. My question was then 'should we only listen to those more vocal?'
My next statement was:
(08-02-2019, 10:05 AM)St.Denis Wrote: If a PR (Player's Request) is put in, after a meaningful discussion, then you are more likely to get an answer.
Effectively, what I am suggesting is:
a) Have a meaningful Discussion (and one where it doesn't degrade in to 'lol, you're stupid/your ideas hold no merit, because you have 15 Posts/I know more about PvP than you' or any of the such responses one can see.
b) If the person posting sees that a good amount of people are in favour of it, after a little while, then put in a PR.
c) The Team will review what is being asked and go from there.
At the moment, what I see is, lots of Polls/Discussions, people put their feelings/thoughts down for a couple of days and then it dies a death.
One must also understand that the Devs already have a Story Line with which (I assume) they are following along. So somethings may take a long time to/not get implemented.
If they followed along with all Polls/Discussions, Gallia would be deleted, Gallia would have defeated Bretonia, 4.85 would be back, Kusari would have invaded Liberty, Rheinland would have invaded Bretonia, Rheinland would still be fighting Liberty and on and on and on.
'I would like to be half as clever as some people like to believe they are' Life is full of disappointments, it is how we handle them that helps to define us, as a person
As far as I can understand from St.Denis messages, if some idea requires not tiny amount of work and has no poll/discussion thread behind, then none will ever care and request will be thrown into trash can eventually, maybe with explanation, possibly not.
Would be really great to see dismissed ideas in a special sub-forum, with an explanation of why they were discarded below.
And it would also be great to mention in pinned threads that ideas require poll/discussion thread or they'll likely go into deaf ears.
(08-02-2019, 11:57 AM)St.Denis Wrote: If they followed along with all Polls/Discussions, Gallia would be deleted, Gallia would have defeated Bretonia, 4.85 would be back, Kusari would have invaded Liberty, Rheinland would have invaded Bretonia, Rheinland would still be fighting Liberty and on and on and on.
Whilst in my time here I've never seen a poll about deleting Gallia or reverting to .85 securing a majority (in fact, I distinctly recall the latter being crushed in a poll), the other things you list have been voted on by the community, have reached a majority, and are in demand. I am sure the state of the community and mod would have been far better if those polls were listened to.
So are there any actual good reasons why there shouldn't be a visible section of player requests, and why the exact process of making suggestions for the staff shouldnt be made more clear?
First of all, just requests in general have no any form, and i tbh sure some people who have ideas even dont know they can just submit idea in form of requests. If more people will see requests they would know that exists and they can participate.
Secondly, as well some requests could give ideas to other people about how it could be done better.
There really very need transparency, at least just for posts with requests itself. Making staff voting transparent will just flame yet one round of accusations about staff-players relations so it probably not best idea, tho short resolution approved/denied would be already helpful. If its will also have reasons why it was denied, it will be just beautiful world.
I feel what the main problem is, that there's a lack of communication between the community, and devs. The community doesn't know what's going on, so we don't know what the GM's/Devs have in mind.
SO I kinda feel that just a little pinned thread, of a development diary of sorts.
Just so sections for small things, and small term.
And one for the larger stuff and long term. Obviously the devs will have to hide some stuff due to storyline progression. ( I.e name is Project Yum ) - Then we know SOMETHING is in the works, the DEVS know it's in the works.
Then we can stop bitching about the devs/GMs asking for updates as the thread will be updated as time goes by.
Wake up one morning - " Oh hey guys, this idea you came to us about, we're discussing it" or "Hey guys, small update, <Insert Dev name here> is working on cosmetic skins" or "Guys, we currently ran into a blockade with the cosmetics, just sit tight, we're still working on it.
I know that the devs/GMs have lives too, and honestly if I was a dev, and I just finished my day job, I doubt I'd spend much time developing - I mean, do devs get paid to put up with the communities demand?
Just a thread, pinned, development diary, communication.
Then, of course, private character requests should remain private I feel. It's their request, and if someone doesn't like it, you know they'll be hell to pay for it on the forums.
But publically effected request could be put forward, discussed, and then the devs explaining how hard/easy it would be to implement, and see if the community wants it or not before the devs spend hours develpoing it.
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