And just to add a last bit of information; aparently 3 IMS leaders are disbanding; one due to RL and another 2 due to group's inactivity :mellow:
What ever happens in the next week might be decisive. The IMS is the reason for sigining the mutual aid treaty and seems we are going to have to scratch all that and get back to the famous turf wars :P
' Wrote:I would like to point out those that the ships RM is flying are built in Rheinland, not in Kusari or Bretonia, and are constructed with the minerals Daumann and Kruger extract, surely not from minerals IMG extracts.
We thought the same when we "ran crying" to the RM; we thought that since we were an important corporation for the nation they would assist us. But wewere wrong of course
' Wrote:I would like to drop the note here that his behaviour is part of his roleplay. The character Gunther Rall cares about his pilots and where they die in.
He won't sacrifice them in the Omegas due to a stupid turf war between two corporations.
Rheinland has a war to fight and the soldiers should not die at all, but that is what happens in a war.
He knows that his men will die, so he sends them to the liberty front, so their death was worth for something.
If a man dies at the liberty front, he died for the freedom of Rheinland.
If a man dies at the Omega front, he most likely died for a civilian greedy corporation.
That are most likely his thoughts.
Just you understand his roleplay behind it.
Since you repeated the part that his behaviour and stance towards the Omega problem is really annoying you.
On another note, I like the approach that Daumann and the IMG dont like each other at all.
Its like IMG and BMM. The IMG tries to get rid of the BMM competition and even managed to set a foot into bretonia.
We understand and we told him too, we dont need his pilots if he dont have enough, but at least diplomatic steps. The war like all war is a supply war, the end strongly hanging from raw materials. If Rheinland or rheinland corporations acquire more mining field in Omegas then they can build more ships, weapons and so on. Expanding borders and get more mining fields more important in war than in peace. This must be important for Rheinland Government too and they must give us full support for this work. And hey, can you imagine better goal for RM pilots than dying for more Daumann profit?:D. Sorry but soldiers always die for private corporations profits - the nice words just hide the truth. Who the hell sacrifice his life for: Soldier you must die for *Company Name* higher profit? Noone. So the politics say: Soldier you must die for Freedom!. But they dont say Freedom = company profit and my part from it. :S
But if Gunther dont wanna give help in actions, at least in words please. We can keep IMG under pressure alone too. Wanna win the war? You need more resource. Where is more resource? In Omega systems. We must expand our rights there, and kill or push out the foreigners. Im sure it is possible with Bretonia agreement, they dont like IMG too (at least BMM but BMM must be enough influence for the government). So if you give support in words, ban IMG from Rheinland. Ban them from Omegas. Kick them out from Freistadt and declare them as hostile, because they are hessians allies. Then we grab their fields (mostly Kruger, not Daumann). Then hessians lose an outpost (Freistadt what they use openly), a good supporter so they weakening ergo so lesser RM pilot die.
Could be fine if RM represent or diplomat think over the thing before he tell something. And could be fine if he is more diplomatic, not his personal feelings controll him. Just a note: we was close for giving a radical RP answer for this - a 2nd revolution (like was in 702 in Von Rohe day) on the Daumann bases in Omega systems or something like.
' Wrote:The IMG surely tries the same in Rheinland, but currently they have to face 2 mining corporations at the same time. So its logical that Omega 7 is contested between the two groups.
An interesting situation.
I wish and should be fine. The problem is how the IMG and Kruger made a (bad) marriage, they work in full agreement in the northern field. And not just independents but organized Kruger teams, the future officials and KMV or like tagged (they have more members). I dont see even more peaceful groups like this two:). They all time defended and defend each others like we do this just some days ago.
So for finishing this, and answering shortly for the starting point, we tried to do, but until we dont get support at least in words from our government against our competitors (IMG at this moment - they are the largest now), we cant do too much. But its good news how RM leader wanna see Daumann and IMG as real competitors, so I think we try again somehow.
' Wrote:I would like to point out those that the ships RM is flying are built in Rheinland, not in Kusari or Bretonia, and are constructed with the minerals Daumann and Kruger extract, surely not from minerals IMG extracts.
Good point we think same. And for more RM ship need more minerals. For more minerals we need kick out IMG from their fields in Omegas. But for it need some government back up against IMG as I said sometimes before:).
' Wrote:Could be fine if RM represent or diplomat think over the thing before he tell something. And could be fine if he is more diplomatic, not his personal feelings controll him. Just a note: we was close for giving a radical RP answer for this - a 2nd revolution (like was in 702 in Von Rohe day) on the Daumann bases in Omega systems or something like.
D:
This would be something. It really would. Would certainly prompt a lot of action from the RHA that most people probably wouldn't suspect.
Quote:I wish and should be fine. The problem is how the IMG and Kruger made a (bad) marriage, they work in full agreement in the northern field. And not just independents but organized Kruger teams, the future officials and KMV or like tagged (they have more members). I dont see even more peaceful groups like this two:). They all time defended and defend each others like we do this just some days ago.
Don't understand this though. We keep trying to get them to stop defending the Kruger miners by shouting that the system should belong to the Hessians and IMG and not to Kruger. Limited success so far. It's mostly IMG lolcaps that "defend the miners" though.
Maybe DHC should try to discredit their rivals by hiring a few mercenaries who will hack their IFF to Kruger and attack IMG miners, hmm?:P
' Wrote:Don't understand this though. We keep trying to get them to stop defending the Kruger miners by shouting that the system should belong to the Hessians and IMG and not to Kruger. Limited success so far. It's mostly IMG lolcaps that "defend the miners" though.
Maybe DHC should try to discredit their rivals by hiring a few mercenaries who will hack their IFF to Kruger and attack IMG miners, hmm?:P
Seems like they dont understood this. All time when I flew to the northern field I see not 2 rival but 2 allied company. And errr Im sure you heared about some mercenary what is in our payment list. They standed down for a time, until the situation not clearing but they get the take off order soon. Kruger IFF not bad idea. Have a rumors how Bounty Hunter use IMG identification in Tau systems (but they hired by BMM against outcasts - BMM want that how the outcasts think the IMG attack them - very very dirty company trick, I LOVE IT) - so our mercs can do the same... thanks the idea. Rumor here Tau 37-Freeport-Jared Darcy Bounty Hunter
Why do the DHC pilots keep backing up the *HESSIANS* verbally whenever we fight them in Omega-7? Today's a good example: The RM takes the trouble off your hands, that's what you've been asking for. They attack your enemies, you sit and spectate. Not a problem there.
But please tell me: Why the hell do you keep expressing your oh-so-great problems to the Hessians, even INSULTING the Rheinland Military High Commanders present? What you did today was pretty much treason. Is there an actually valid reasoning for siding your worst enemies against your greatest protectors? Since this is not the first time this happened.
Why do the DHC pilots keep backing up the *HESSIANS* verbally whenever we fight them in Omega-7? Today's a good example: The RM takes the trouble off your hands, that's what you've been asking for. They attack your enemies, you sit and spectate. Not a problem there.
But please tell me: Why the hell do you keep expressing your oh-so-great problems to the Hessians, even INSULTING the Rheinland Military High Commanders present? What you did today was pretty much treason. Is there an actually valid reasoning for siding your worst enemies against your greatest protectors? Since this is not the first time this happened.
(Yes, I have screenies.)
Well 1st not need to thank how we kept up a hessian with speech, until he typed he didnt fight. Next time use out and dont lose this little advantage for typing. You're welcome.
We just watched the fight, for that reason how in the past half year you, the RM never let us fight with you when we offered our help. Only one time we got permission. So of course we wont join anymore. Or you invited or asked our help? No. We sent a Bounty Hunter for help and he killed an enemy so we sent aid for you, better if you thank it, and next time if you need help, ask.
We was there for investigating the rumor about 101st and RM cooperation. Seems like it was true. Our 2nd reason was the investigation of Krugers. We got a lot of info about that how Kruger miners (indies and future official members too) are under hessianss protection in Omega 7. Until we fight all day with hessians, our competitors who are true rheinlanders just made a business contract with the enemy. So who is the traitor? Of course we have evidence. But we understand them and maybe we will follow them. Today the discuss was the 1st step for it. You clearly declared you never guard our mining fields, where we really need the protection.
And if we are here, at this point, lets talk about the protection. Hessians there every day, RM? Max once a week. We awaited real help and we held back the patrols, let you the guard role. until we didnt kept the law, we got a lot of unwanted element but zero back-up from RM. The final point how we must change our politic was an RM member who dont have any idea how IMG cant land on Daumann bases. What did you promished last time? You will protect our bases from all illegal IMG dock? How when your member dont have idea about it. Of course we have evidence for it too.
In my readings (well actually a lot of think the same but I talk only in my name) RM totally lost the point with the reinland civilians. Did you do something for us? I dont really see. Did you save us anytime? Never. You did the fights for yourself. When we need a hand and RM are on-line a lot of time they just ignore us or refuse the help. Those military pilots who give real help, threatened with sanctions by you, so they dont really help anymore. Yes the WD guys. Maybe their RP not so excellent like yours but at least we can count them.
And what was the insult? When a vice admiral died I just noted:
[01.04.2010 17:00:34] DHC-Patrol.Beta-1: Oops our military wont be happy if they lost their command officers
[01.04.2010 17:00:46] [RHA]Gunther_Hoerst: Heheh... Daumann has a sense of humour I see!
[01.04.2010 17:01:03] [RHA]Gunther_Hoerst: Well, let me inform you that you won't need to pay that hunter...
[01.04.2010 17:01:04] [RM]Va.Alec.Voelkel: They do more verbal damage to us than they do to you, I agree with that.
[01.04.2010 17:01:21] CONSOLE: ?Possible cheating detected: Daniel_2010
[01.04.2010 17:01:26] [RM]Va.Alec.Voelkel: Whose side are you on, corporates?
sorry if I just post from the log I dont cared with screenshots. Where is the insult?
I dont know maybe better if you not handle the problems in Omega systems as a minor or local problems. The wars mostly material war too and if you dont care the resources, RM lose the war Im sure. Your reactions about our requests show us, you dont care. So slowly we wont care to you. We are corporation and as I see I must explain what does that mean.
A corporation never corrupt just make business decisions (private sphere cant be corrupt just government side). The corporations cant be traitor because they loyal only themselves. We dont care the government and politic just for business and profit. If somewhere a corporation dont get what it want, then the corporation walk away and search a better place for the HQ and factories. The responsibility and loyality only for shareholders. Not to Military not to Kanzler or Government. And for the shareholders we must show up higher and higher profit. This is the only what really important. How we do this - thats our business. We can do it with legal business decisions, but if it not work (and not work because you, RM) the illegal business decisions coming. There are more: deal with hessians and revolutioners, deal with corsairs or making steps for new place and deal with BAF and Bretonia example. What is our goal what we wanna reach? Simply: we wanna be the dominant and if it possible the only one mining corporation in Omega systems. Its I think an understandable and good RP goal. All our act against IMG, Kruger, BMM and foreigner miners, the mining area guard serve this goal. Do you help in this? No. You block us - thinking about your reaction for IMG capital fleet and all our report later about IMG. You give us just a promishe, you protect our bases from IMG docking in the core systems. This was the maximum help. Well as I wrote before your member dont heared about it. Thank you for the help. Another goal expand our influence, bringing new business partners who are already have good relation with Liberty. Yes, council. A lot of new possibility. Do you help? No. Again a block what we got. So why you are surprised on our negative reaction?
It maybe not your fault but the game mechanizm, but somehow impossible to make the policy and capitalizm or money concentration or interlacement. You are too arrogant because you have all, so dont really need civilians. That is a problem. I can continue the line but doesnt really matter. When we see you try to work on a better relationship, maybe we change too. At this moment we are close for a 2nd revolution, and the Daumann mining bases in Omega systems will rebell. It maybe bring some changes. At least hessians are trustworthy - eh was hard to type it but this is the true. 2nd possibility a new RM who really care with the civilians. It help you too, you get some new allies. We are ready for it. Check this half-ready website we made steps for it too. We tried cooperating with you but we never got what we wanted. Im sure you realized we not a common trader faction we really try to play as a real dirty corporation, so forget the victim role if you think about DHC- we are or at least wanna be on the winner side like corporation in RL. One way or another but we reach our goals, no matter the cost. Better if we do it with you, but I personally dont mind if I must rebell and need to shoot down you.
' Wrote:Well 1st not need to thank how we kept up a hessian with speech, until he typed he didnt fight. Next time use out and dont lose this little advantage for typing. You're welcome.
Typing. RP. You might have noticed, I actually typed more than you did, in response to what Hoerst said, even though I was fighting.
Is it relevant? Nope, because:
' Wrote:We just watched the fight, for that reason how in the past half year you, the RM never let us fight with you when we offered our help. Only one time we got permission. So of course we wont join anymore. Or you invited or asked our help? No. We sent a Bounty Hunter for help and he killed an enemy so we sent aid for you, better if you thank it, and next time if you need help, ask.
The outcome of the fight was TOTALLY irrelevant. It's NOT the point that you didn't assist us, because I don't care how the fight ended. The problem is NOT that you sat there and didn't assist: The problem is that you were supporting the Hessians VERBALLY while making obviously sarcastic comments at our forces. You even called the Hessians' revolution "mighty". Seriously... they are your worst enemy, not us.
' Wrote:We was there for investigating the rumor about 101st and RM cooperation. Seems like it was true.
That was a twisted RP from Blodo's side. If you would take your time into reading things, getting your facts right:
No, you don't have access to that thread in-RP, but the RM DENIED to deal with the 101st and keeps treating it as hostiles. Why did we attack the RHA regardless?
Three reasons:
1) They were outnumbering the 101st. Attacking the outcasts thus, would have been ganking. I'm not really into that stuff, personally. Also, I was hitting two flies at the same time with hitting the Hessians, who were busy with the 101st already losing. But why didn't I keep out with my men? Point 2:
2) A Flieger of ours was already under attack. I never gave him orders to move in, but leaving him to die in the hands of our enemies was not the right punishment, since other measures would have followed afterwards. But wait... why did I go in afterall if he was acting against my orders? Point 3:
3) Some Hessian (I could clearly see the natters) attacked me sitting there, draining my shields almost entirely. Given the above two points, I saw the time was opportune to strike.
So again: We did NOT support the Hessians. Yet, you acknowledged the Hessian leader's statement calling them "our masters". My entry to the fight was merely a tactical one, since if the Hessians would have gone down, the Outcasts would have been the next.
' Wrote:Our 2nd reason was the investigation of Krugers. We got a lot of info about that how Kruger miners (indies and future official members too) are under hessianss protection in Omega 7. Until we fight all day with hessians, our competitors who are true rheinlanders just made a business contract with the enemy. So who is the traitor? Of course we have evidence. But we understand them and maybe we will follow them. Today the discuss was the 1st step for it.
I have no idea what that's supposed to mean. Also, there's no Kruger official faction to deal with in the first place. I am not aware of such issues and I don't see how that's relevant to this case.
' Wrote:You clearly declared you never guard our mining fields, where we really need the protection.
Who did?
Where?
When?
Why?
That's something you made up there, buddy.
' Wrote:And if we are here, at this point, lets talk about the protection. Hessians there every day, RM? Max once a week. We awaited real help and we held back the patrols, let you the guard role. until we didnt kept the law, we got a lot of unwanted element but zero back-up from RM. The final point how we must change our politic was an RM member who dont have any idea how IMG cant land on Daumann bases. What did you promished last time? You will protect our bases from all illegal IMG dock? How when your member dont have idea about it. Of course we have evidence for it too.
Again, how is that relevant to this case?
Regardless, I NEVER said you can't patrol or protect your own space, I even specifically told you you can. If you see some Hessians pirating and there's no RM available, why don't you help your guys out?
PLEASE use your common sense.
About the IMG case, that's a server rule violation, not our fault.
' Wrote:In my readings (well actually a lot of think the same but I talk only in my name) RM totally lost the point with the reinland civilians. Did you do something for us? I dont really see. Did you save us anytime? Never. You did the fights for yourself. When we need a hand and RM are on-line a lot of time they just ignore us or refuse the help. Those military pilots who give real help, threatened with sanctions by you, so they dont really help anymore. Yes the WD guys. Maybe their RP not so excellent like yours but at least we can count them.
You keep demanding that we do nothing but sit in Omega-7 all the time, just like the WD does.
Why don't we do that?
-We can't have a member online 24/7 for your disposal, nor can we predict when the pirates are attacking.
-We have the whole of Rheinland plus the war front to cover. We are the RHEINLAND military afterall. Not the OMEGA-7 military. We can't sit in your mining fields all the time waiting for something red to pop up.
-This is a game. What if you loose an ore shipment because our men were occupied elsewhere?
' Wrote:And what was the insult? When a vice admiral died I just noted:
[01.04.2010 17:00:34] DHC-Patrol.Beta-1: Oops our military wont be happy if they lost their command officers
[01.04.2010 17:00:46] [RHA]Gunther_Hoerst: Heheh... Daumann has a sense of humour I see!
[01.04.2010 17:01:03] [RHA]Gunther_Hoerst: Well, let me inform you that you won't need to pay that hunter...
[01.04.2010 17:01:04] [RM]Va.Alec.Voelkel: They do more verbal damage to us than they do to you, I agree with that.
[01.04.2010 17:01:21] CONSOLE: ?Possible cheating detected: Daniel_2010
[01.04.2010 17:01:26] [RM]Va.Alec.Voelkel: Whose side are you on, corporates?
sorry if I just post from the log I dont cared with screenshots. Where is the insult?
However, later on as I was being shot at rather heavily, you openly started discussing a hypothetical scenario of the revolution being victorious and the DHC's place in such a world. Should you really be doing that with your worst enemies?
' Wrote:I dont know maybe better if you not handle the problems in Omega systems as a minor or local problems. The wars mostly material war too and if you dont care the resources, RM lose the war Im sure. Your reactions about our requests show us, you dont care. So slowly we wont care to you. We are corporation and as I see I must explain what does that mean.
As again, we can't sit in O-7 all the time. And the only source of Rheinland's minerals is not just Omega-7. There's Dresden also being a major one, where I somehow never see anyone around. Maybe because the fields are not mineable? Just because some Red Hessians occasionally trash up O-7, that doesn't mean we will loose the war.
' Wrote:A corporation never corrupt just make business decisions (private sphere cant be corrupt just government side). The corporations cant be traitor because they loyal only themselves. We dont care the government and politic just for business and profit. If somewhere a corporation dont get what it want, then the corporation walk away and search a better place for the HQ and factories. The responsibility and loyality only for shareholders. Not to Military not to Kanzler or Government. And for the shareholders we must show up higher and higher profit. This is the only what really important. How we do this - thats our business. We can do it with legal business decisions, but if it not work (and not work because you, RM) the illegal business decisions coming. There are more: deal with hessians and revolutioners, deal with corsairs or making steps for new place and deal with BAF and Bretonia example. What is our goal what we wanna reach? Simply: we wanna be the dominant and if it possible the only one mining corporation in Omega systems. Its I think an understandable and good RP goal. All our act against IMG, Kruger, BMM and foreigner miners, the mining area guard serve this goal. Do you help in this? No. You block us - thinking about your reaction for IMG capital fleet and all our report later about IMG. You give us just a promishe, you protect our bases from IMG docking in the core systems. This was the maximum help. Well as I wrote before your member dont heared about it. Thank you for the help. Another goal expand our influence, bringing new business partners who are already have good relation with Liberty. Yes, council. A lot of new possibility. Do you help? No. Again a block what we got. So why you are surprised on our negative reaction?
It maybe not your fault but the game mechanizm, but somehow impossible to make the policy and capitalizm or money concentration or interlacement. You are too arrogant because you have all, so dont really need civilians. That is a problem. I can continue the line but doesnt really matter. When we see you try to work on a better relationship, maybe we change too. At this moment we are close for a 2nd revolution, and the Daumann mining bases in Omega systems will rebell. It maybe bring some changes. At least hessians are trustworthy - eh was hard to type it but this is the true. 2nd possibility a new RM who really care with the civilians. It help you too, you get some new allies. We are ready for it. Check this half-ready website we made steps for it too. We tried cooperating with you but we never got what we wanted. Im sure you realized we not a common trader faction we really try to play as a real dirty corporation, so forget the victim role if you think about DHC- we are or at least wanna be on the winner side like corporation in RL. One way or another but we reach our goals, no matter the cost. Better if we do it with you, but I personally dont mind if I must rebell and need to shoot down you.
I think I'm better off with not responding to that part because...
1) It is irrelevant to this discussion.
2) My response would include some degree of trolling, due to the amount of irrelaism this holds.
"You're a Rheinland corporation, loyal to the Kanzleramt. Act as one." As I said no, its impossible now. We are corporation so we cant be loyal to noone just for ourselves. This is what a real corporation do. Why need to be loyal to Kanzler? Or Rheinland, if he dont help our business but block our ways, hmm? Try to make away from stereotypes what is a trader faction on discovery. We are different.
You think we must serve you. No. You must serve us. You must die for our higher profit, this is your job. I believe you dont like it, like soldiers in RL, but whatever they die eventually for corporations profits and you must do the same. The nice words about "Freedom" and "Duty" and like just make more beauty the awful reality. Could be fine you dont forget your job in the future. Being a corporation dont mean we follow your orders or we need care with the military, we arent your dependant. The real group what can give us order the police. You never thought about why separated the military and police in game and in RL?
About our worst enemy: the worst enemy is that group who dont let us operating freely. If hessians shoot out us all time of course they are, BUT if we can make a deal with them then they arent. We dont care policy as I said, dont care who lead Rheinland, Kanzler, Emperor or Communist part. We care just profit and if we can do our business in communism or in military dictatourship we dont mind what is the name of the leader. Like a real corporation in RL. Learn about it a little bit more, then you will see - as a player noted earlier - the corporations are worse than pirates. We are loyal for Rheinland because we have good business contracts thats all. Because the government give (gave) hand to us.
"You clearly declared you never guard our mining fields, where we really need the protection.
Who did?
Where?
When?
Why?
That's something you made up there, buddy."
My answer for it:
"This said, I have to add that the Rheinland Military has not the authority to protect the Daumann and Kruger mining fields due to missing ressources at the moment. Daumann and Kruger is responsible for their fields on their own as it is now." - From Malexa link
"First of all, as noted before, the Rheinland Military is mostly occupied with the war, thus we tend to be too busy to assist you in the Omegas." - from you, Voelker link
So it show me clearly you errr wont really help us in Omega systems. What do a corporation who dont have ideas just wanna higher profit? Well we use up the locals. We try to repell the danger so we send the pirates to our competitors side. Now how they errrr pay a protection money to pirates, it wont work. We fight or we make business with them too. We better like fighting but - because we are interest the outcome of a PvP - we wont do it if we dont have chance for victory. Without back-up of course we dont have really, so we must select the 2nd way. As I noted my goal to save my men an their ships, and its work. If I need something for it... well ... not a high price. Some word for piece - the best business. And be sure Totally dont care if the RM dont like it. Give us real back up continuosly and I will remain in silence, but until you cant grant our safety let me to defend ourself in any way. We will do it and if we need to say for it the Kanzler is an idiot mad dictator we will paint it with upper case on outer side of Briesen dockbay. I repeat myself and you can read it in my order on the 1st page: WE MUST DO EVERYTHING FOR SAVING OUR CREW AND SHIP. The 1st and most important RP: saving the life. All other secoundary.
"Regardless, I NEVER said you can't patrol or protect your own space, I even specifically told you you can. If you see some Hessians pirating and there's no RM available, why don't you help your guys out?"
We of course do this. Check our message dump. We keep clear our area, and we are sad we cant the whole Omega 7 for limited resources. The problem is when we face a really strong band, when we really need help, we dont get nothing. We reported IMG capitals what insult and shot us multiple times, RM reaction - zero (errr truely "It is Daumann fault, your problem not our"). There was the incident with Zoners, reaction - "our laws are flexible, we dont care and we close our eyes because we dont wanna mess with zoners." So if it is flexible then we are flexible too, we handle flexible the policy.
"About the IMG case, that's a server rule violation, not our fault." Thats true but shame how your member never heared about it, and because Malexa promished the protection of our bases from IMG dockings (check the 1st link) thats your shame too as leaders of RM.
"-We can't have a member online 24/7 for your disposal, nor can we predict when the pirates are attacking.
-We have the whole of Rheinland plus the war front to cover. We are the RHEINLAND military afterall. Not the OMEGA-7 military. We can't sit in your mining fields all the time waiting for something red to pop up.
-This is a game. What if you loose an ore shipment because our men were occupied elsewhere?"
Well as I see you are errr very rare there. Was you ever on our or Kruger mining field? I think you never - against your own rule. Its a game yes, but RP game so we must do all against losing any shipment. It must be important. If you dont think the same, then I must say WD guys have better RP than you - dont wanna abuse you:D.
I can continue but whatever. We have clear and good RP goals and we act like a real corporation, not a common trader faction what will disappear sooner or later, because boring their gameplay, what dont do nothing just help to others for growing their own money. Better if you understand it finally (or at least see around what does that mean "corporation"). Loyality to government haha - just until its profitable. Othewise - no.