Love it.
The attitude I mean:
U R NOT LPI U KNOE NOTHING! YOU NOT ALLOWED TO AVE AN OPINION BOUT US!
As for your challenge. Let's see... I make a lpi corrupt cop and after a week a magic fairy will descend out of the sky and bestow on me an enlighted opinion about the matter?
Or will it simply become:
U ONLY BENN LPI FOR 1 WEEK U KNOW NOTHING!
After a year?
I BEEN LPI FOR 2 WEEKS MOAR THAN U! U. KNOW NOTHING!
So apart from the fact that I have to play as LPI to be "allowed" an opinion about it..
Back to your topic.
Logistically that station can't sell slaves. Population is too low. The arguement ends there really.
There is a "possibility" that they -might- sell slaves but on a much much more secure area or somewhere away from the prying eyes of navies.
Something to point out to you. While YOU are trying to stamp out corruption YOU are also a law enforcer IN A SPACESHIP.
In other words. The prison wardens could be trying to do it BEHIND YOUR BACK AND AGAINST ORDERS.
But then again.
I AM NOT LPI! I NEED A LICENCE FROM THEM IN ORDER TO HAVE AN OPINION ABOUT THEM KK THX WTF? BBQ? KK THX BAI.
The lulz.. O the lulz..
Edit:
To add a lil more to this.
Goverments and corrupt organizations are filled with beuracracy and red tape. You may be trying to stamp out corruption but things like this take ages.
Why not try to make it part of your rp? Make a news article to put on a big show to the navies how you are fighting corruption.
"We are offering a reward of xxxxxx amount for any information or proof of corruption in our ranks" I would make the amount really low so to keep the rp going rather than have every lolwut try to offer bribes like that.
For your molly-LPI arguement.
Mollies are freedom fighters, LPI are cops. Mollies are also in really bad shape (in rp at keast) they are barely surviving. A treaty like the one in place is something of nessecity to their survival.
Your survival and movement of your order is not under threat.
The ooRP reason I beilieve is because molly numbers are small. MR compared to LPI are not as active, mainly affect miners, live in a tiny piece of bretonia. None of this is relevant in your case.
Also no offence to you but mainly of the people I speak to feel liberty is full of lolwut caps. Its also busy, people have a very "un-liberty" approach. Could be half of what you are fighting is liberty's poor rp reputation. Unfair in this case, just stating.
(If you disagree on that point please feel to browse the forums to read the hundreds of anti liberty posts kicking about)
The "YOU MUST BE LPI TO COMMENT ATTITUDE" just re-inforces the above.
I find myself agreeing with the request to remove slaves as a commodity from these prisons. I can't think of one good reason why slaves should be sold from those prisons. I can see several reasons why they shouldn't be though:
1. Its bad PR for a corporation that is [at least] trying to look clean to sell slaves openly from their prisons. It makes it too easy for others to identify the corruption and say "you are corrupt! look, you sell slaves there!". Any joe random can point the finger irrefutably. If I was an LPI officer (indie or faction), I'd be disturbed by this. Why would they try to look clean? To prevent the people of Liberty demanding something be done about their corruption(/methods of labour recruitment), which could seriously hurt profits.
2. As people have said its not as profitable for the corporation to sell them than it is to keep them and release them after their tenure, waiting for another opportunity to bring them back for more work. If they go to Malta or Gallia they will most likely never be available for LPI work again.
I am not and never have been an LPI officer, but it's a corporation. It should take actions to protect it's image in order to maximise profits. If it does not do this, I would think it runs a serious risk of being replaced with a government funded department to appease the masses.
I don't claim to have much knowledge of the history or lore involved, but that is how it looks to me.
' Wrote:Love it.
The attitude I mean:
U R NOT LPI U KNOE NOTHING! YOU NOT ALLOWED TO AVE AN OPINION BOUT US!
Outrageous. I never said that. It is all a lie. Don't be ridiculous.
At the time it was directed 100% at Sprolf. There are several people here who are not LPI who have actually posted constructive non-biased or jerkish suggestions regarding this situation. So, this statement ^ . Write it off as a Kimble-fallacy. May or may not become a forced meme as I continue to talk.
' Wrote:Eh. If a faction wants to change the way they operate, so be it, as long as they don't change it so drastically that it's unbelievable.
I've never seen the LPI as 100% "corrupt". While I see slave trading as something that they might partake of, I can just as easily see them cracking down on it.
LPI is made up of ordinary people. Some are corrupt, some might not mind slavery and all that, but I won't believe that every single one of their officers is like that.
If the LPI wants to start doing its job in-RP, let them.
I agree with the above quote.
(I may have just taken a vacation from going in game recently, but since I'm still gonna browse the forums a little bit to try and keep up with what's going on in this crazy place, I feel I should contribute here. (But not really)
As an additional note, The LPI, is a Private Police Force in a similar sense to that of Washington DC's "Capitol Police Force" (Not DC Metro, they're government paid cops) is a Private Police Force. (Note: The Capitol Police Force is considered a private force, even though it's made up of federally paid people, they're like Private Sector but government at the same time, it's weird.)
Corruption? Eh, it happens, are some members of the LPI's space force corrupt? sure. Are all of them? certainly not.
Do their superiors know they're corrupt? Hells no.
Are some of the superior officers corrupt? Probably.
If corruption is found, it is eliminated, just as it would be in the real world.
Now....if we want to get into the realm of, LPI prison guards, or what I'll term as LPI "Planetside cops" and corruption...Well, come on, it's fairly logical to assume that there are corrupt cops. Just as there are clean cops, just as there are cops who aren't quite corrupt but are willing to bend rules to do "Good"
But uh...there I've gone off and talked about something that wasn't the main issue of this thread...
Back onto the topic of Sugarland selling slaves...well, hell. It kinda makes sense, and it kinda doesn't.
As the infocard states, the station isn't populated by nearly enough inmates for 3-5000 of them to be bought by who knows how many slavers during the course of one Sirius Standard Day.
If you know...the station infocard stated that it had something like several hundred thousand people aboard it, well, that would make much much more sense, and justify how small numbers of inmates could go missing here and there without the guards caring/noticing.
(But then, I also think that many of the stations throughout Sirius also need larger populations, not just Sugarland, like some of those MASSIVE stations out there that only have populations of like 600 people...makes no sense >_<, but I digress)
Do I think that the LPI's Chief and Deputy Chiefs would condone the selling of Slaves? NO.
Do I think that if Sugarland had a much larger population, a sneaky-clever Prison Warden could lie to the chief and falsify inmate counts in order to sell a few of them off here and there so that he could line his own pockets? well, why the hell not? What the chief doesn't know can't hurt him, yeah?
but at this point right now, with the current population of Sugarland as stated by it's infocard, the selling of inmates as slaves from that station, does NOT make sense.
Another note, I've noticed alot of the "Slavers" out there who are trying to stay in character while making money for themselves usually don't stop off on Sugarland to pick up their cargo, they usually use Niverton, could be wrong but that's just an observation I made during my many many hours performing that run.
ANYWAYS.
That's my non-server playing community members' two cents.
P.S To Zapp: If the LPI is Nationalized in my absense, please please please please (did I say please?) go with a name like "Liberty(onian) State Police" or "Libertonian National Police" as opposed to "Liberty Police Department":P
' Wrote:Outrageous. I never said that. It is all a lie. Don't be ridiculous.
At the time it was directed 100% at Sprolf. There are several people here who are not LPI who have actually posted constructive non-biased or jerkish suggestions regarding this situation. So, this statement ^ . Write it off as a Kimble-fallacy. May or may not become a forced meme as I continue to talk.
I beilieve sprolf is the only non admin player who has posted here to be disagreeing with you.
So the "non jerkish non-biased constructive" opinions are the ones that agree with you?
Good move lad, flaming the people who agree with you is a bad idea, they need to be praised as non-biased and constructive.
I invite you to look at hack's post on page 5 (sadly the quote feature on the blackberry doesn't work. Only reply does) and the post straight after.
Let's not even mention the "being a pirate doesn't make you special" from a while back.
Or this "LPI CHALLENGE" I keep seeing.
Or the 3 examples of this "YOU NOT LPI U KNO NOTHING" attitude in the original request thread you made when players didn't agree with you.
So the general attitude I see from LPI is:
"You guys don't understand us or our RP, take the LPI challenge"
It does tend to lend itself close to the whole emo movement:
"We so mis-understood, you need to join us to understand us"
/wrists to follow perhaps?
You guys claim you want to be treated like other factions "with respect"
The examples of emo I keep seeing doesn't help you. Respect is EARNED.
Back to the point.
The population on that station can't allow slaves to be sold. I beilieve there is nothing more to add to topic.
' Wrote:What I find most hilarious is those complaining the loudest have neither been, nor have the desire to play the BHG|.
Yet they seem to think they control the [color=#ffff33]BHG|.
So its ok to limit the BHG|, but everyone else is good to go? Ah, but its ok, its just the BHG|, they don't matter.
There is a word for that. Actually 2 different words come to mind. It seems both of those concepts are alive and well.
Fixed that for you. :P
Slaves should NOT be sold at Sugarland. Sell prisoners (which equates to todays prisoner transfers). If you absolutely have to sell slaves in Texas, do it off of Houston. Since slavery IS against the law in Liberty ... this is one gigantic facepalm regarding the commodity placement.
Quote:I. Contraband possession.
It is illegal to have any amount of these goods on your person at any time:
Cardamine
Liquid Cardamine
Counterfeit Software
Black Market Munitions
Human Organs
Synthetic Marijuana
Artifacts Slaves
Blood Diamonds
Nomad brains
There's no way you can reconcile having slaves sold from the prison when bounty hunters and others actually drop their criminals off there. I could see having a bit of a black market on Houston where slaves are sold, similar to the UN base in what was Yugoslavia. (Which only goes to show just how corrupt the UN is today, too.) Blatantly right out of the prison - nope.
(11-21-2013, 12:53 PM)Jihadjoe Wrote: Oh god... The end of days... Agmen agreed with me.
See Zapp, there's something about your post I don't like. Not the content, but the tone of it. You're ranting.
That said, LPI is by it's nature corrupt in how it handles it's profit making capabilities, it rounds up vagrants and makes them work. I'm sure there is a law that allows them to do this, they wouldn't be doing something so blatantly if it was obviously illegal. That is my definition of LIP corruption. that is the way the LPI runs in Vanilla and how it has been noted to run in Discovery as well. However there's no rumour that says every cop is a bad one, there's no rumour that you sell the workforce to the highest bidder. LPI arrests folks on crap charges and forces them to make Space Jumper Happy Bears, it doesn't sell them to the OC. Corruption at the heart of the corp is canon, corruption throughout the ranks is not.
Saint Del is considered a holy healer of diseases of children, but also as a protector of cattle.
' Wrote:I beilieve sprolf is the only non admin player who has posted here to be disagreeing with you.
No. There are plenty of overly accusative fingers in this thread and others besides Sprolf's silliness.
Quote:So the "non jerkish non-biased constructive" opinions are the ones that agree with you?
No. Those who have posted suggestions which I would call a compromise are constructive. The LPI has already conceded that we are not white knights, we are trying to achieve middle ground between our desire to be viewed as non-corrupt and a large portion of the community's opinion that we are the worst of the worst. People don't have to agree with us 100% to reach a middle ground. However, many people here don't seem to be interested in a compromise.
Quote:Good move lad, flaming the people who agree with you is a bad idea, they need to be praised as non-biased and constructive.
Stop whining!
Quote:So the general attitude I see from LPI is:
"You guys don't understand us or our RP, take the LPI challenge"
This entire debate has made it abundantly clear that the majority of the community has one impression of our RP while we in fact practice a nigh-polar opposite RP (that is, clean cops). Therefore, the vast majority does, in fact, not understand us or our RP.
Quote:It does tend to lend itself close to the whole emo movement:
"We so mis-understood, you need to join us to understand us"
/wrists to follow perhaps?
You guys claim you want to be treated like other factions "with respect"
The examples of emo I keep seeing doesn't help you. Respect is EARNED.
Take it BACK! You think you're bad? You think you know better!? You're a freaking CHOIR BOY compared to me! A CHOIR BOY! You lack discipline! Now why are you being so immature about all this?
' Wrote:Ok, I have just finished this thread but I'm getting a bit tired of that first sentence of yours. Which you repeatedly have to use as a counter-attack to any Faction-complaint regarding the LPI.{/quote]
This whole thing about every-time someone makes a statement about your faction you shout back: [color=#FFFFFF]"WELL GO DO THE LPI CHALLENGE!!!!11111"
Just because they haven't flied for the LPI or been in the faction dosen't mean their opinion has any less value. Maybe I should make the Hale's Angels challenge, and every-time someone complaints about my group, I just shout back and tell them to make an Eagle flying as Vigilante ID being hated by both sides of the law. Or maybe I just do the reasonable thing and listen to what the fella has to say.
That said, thinking back now on the last thread, I can agree on putting slaves on Houston instead.
Here's why:
People have a pre-conceived notion of who we are and what we are all about after they come here from Vanilla.
They have no idea.
I wouldn't DREAM of barging in somewhere telling Del or Xoria or Dusty / Tanker / Joe how the LR or the Hackers or the Xenos are supposed to be.
Why?
Because I have NEVER had one of those characters. I have never walked in their shoes, experienced what they have, shared their pain.
Also added to the list BHG, Outcasts, Corsairs, RM, AU, LN BAF Mollies, KFN, KSP, and any other faction or group that I don't have a character in. IF I haven't done it, I don't comment.
I do have a pirate character, a indie trader, a faction trader, and a TAZ character. Used to have a Vigilante back in the day.
Do some people have some good ideas? Yeah. Constructive criticism and suggestions are good.
When you show up and start off with a superiority attitude because you can hide behind a keyboard and figure you will never be found? Useless. Wasted bandwidth, wasted time.
' Wrote:Summarized for time:
Troll troll troll, flame flame flame.
Whose line are you toeing? see above.
' Wrote:Fixed that for you. :P
I bow to your superior intellect.:)
' Wrote:See Zapp, there's something about your post I don't like. Not the content, but the tone of it. You're ranting.
That said, LPI is by it's nature corrupt in how it handles it's profit making capabilities, it rounds up vagrants and makes them work. I'm sure there is a law that allows them to do this, they wouldn't be doing something so blatantly if it was obviously illegal. That is my definition of LIP corruption. that is the way the LPI runs in Vanilla and how it has been noted to run in Discovery as well. However there's no rumour that says every cop is a bad one, there's no rumour that you sell the workforce to the highest bidder. LPI arrests folks on crap charges and forces them to make Space Jumper Happy Bears, it doesn't sell them to the OC. Corruption at the heart of the corp is canon, corruption throughout the ranks is not.
And Yes the LPI will still be corrupt. If it wasn't the Xenos and LR's RP and Lore would have to take a major turn.
Is there still corruption? Sure. Most corporations couldn't give a hoot about their workers. It's all about the bottom line.
Are there corrupt cops? Yeah, but they know sure as heck that they need to keep it out of sight, because if they don't, they will end up in one of those prisons making toys / washers / whatever.
Take a look at today's companies. How many reports have we seen lately?
The thing is we are trying to be less obvious.
Another question that was raised in the LPI chat that we couldn't answer is this:
The LPI arrests these people, but who runs the courts and convicts them? Not the LPI.
Formerly known as LPI Police Chief Hull O'Brien.
Creator of Sgt. V. Price, 207th Precinct out of Chula Vista Station