' Wrote:The premise that one can't exist without the other is inaccurate, so TAZ exists, but PAZ does not.
If TAZ exists, this breaks the original premise of the existence of being permanent, as permanence is the Yin to the Yang of temporariness. The one exists as the opposite to the other, like good and evil. There can be no evil without good and hence no state of being temporary without there also being a state of permanence.
TAZ has been autonomous for a period of time longer than what can be considered 'temporary' and thus entered the realm of being permanently autonomous in its leadership.
Thus, PAZ has, by the decree of legitimate concern, voiced through the epochs of thought and debate, become a reality.
1. "If TAZ exists, this breaks the original premise of the existence of being permanent, as permanence is the Yin to the Yang of temporariness."
No, it is not. A state of temporarity does not have to be made temporary by transformation into permanency. It goes from one temporary state into another temporary state. One temporary state is the Ying, and another temporary state is the Yang, if you will.
2. "The one exists as the opposite to the other, like good and evil. There can be no evil without good and hence no state of being temporary without there also being a state of permanence. "
There can be evil without good, and there can be good without evil. Who gives you these crazy ideas?
There can be temporary states without there having to be a permanent state. There cant be a single temporary state without it being permanent.
3 "TAZ has been autonomous for a period of time longer than what can be considered 'temporary' and thus entered the realm of being permanently autonomous in its leadership. Thus, PAZ, has by the degree of legitimate concern, voiced through the epochs of thought and debate, become a reality."
You can only say it is or was permanenty autonomous once you can exclude the possibility that it will become non autonomous in future. The only way you can exclude that, is if its existence ends. If its existence ends, it was not permanent. Thus, it can only be temporary.
' Wrote:The time has come for the name to be changed to "Strangely Permanently Autonomous Zoners", snip
Fixed for you.
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' Wrote:1. "If TAZ exists, this breaks the original premise of the existence of being permanent, as permanence is the Yin to the Yang of temporariness."
No, it is not. A state of temporarity does not have to be made temporary by transformation into permanency. It goes from one temporary state into another temporary state. One temporary state is the Ying, and another temporary state is the Yang, if you will.
Changing states between being autonomous and non-autonomous is the only change relevant here. Has TAZ, in anyway, recently changed to being non-autonomous and then back again? Nope, therefore they have been autonomous for a great deal of time, almost to be considered permanent. One could further state that if this state of being autonomous was only temporary, as soon as the autonomous reason for TAZ's existence comes to an end, so does TAZ. Therefore, TAZ must be permanent in its autonomy simply to maintain its existence.
Quote:2. "The one exists as the opposite to the other, like good and evil. There can be no evil without good and hence no state of being temporary without there also being a state of permanence. "
There can be evil without good, and there can be good without evil. Who gives you these crazy ideas?
There can be temporary states without there having to be a permanent state. There cant be a single temporary state without it being permanent.
Good and evil exist to fight each other. If you have a world full of good, you wouldn't recognise the good as it exists, as you would have nothing 'evil' with which to compare it to. Same as a world full of evil.
Quote:3 "TAZ has been autonomous for a period of time longer than what can be considered 'temporary' and thus entered the realm of being permanently autonomous in its leadership. Thus, PAZ, has by the degree of legitimate concern, voiced through the epochs of thought and debate, become a reality."
You can only say it is or was permanenty autonomous once you can exclude the possibility that it will become non autonomous in future. The only way you can exclude that, is if its existence ends. If its existence ends, it was not permanent. Thus, it can only be temporary.
As stated above, if TAZ stops being autonomous, it simply cannot exist in its current form and therefore this point is moot. In future it either becomes permanently autonomous or falls under another body of Zoners that rule it and thus loses its autonomy.
To help you understand, I will show you how a universe which has mutliple temporary states can not also contain a permanent state. Permanent and temporary are not like Ying and Yang, but their existence is rather mutually exclusive and not complementary.
The first law of thermodynamics has for consequence that mass and energy in a closed system can not be created or destroyed out of nothing. Therefore, a temporary state has to interact with another state in order to change. This means that if the temporary state interacts with the other state, the other state also has to change. If the other state also has to change, it can not be permanent. In addition to this, it also means that a permanent state can not interact, or be noticeable to the rest of the temporary states, without changing. Therefore we can not have, or notice, any permanents states, in our universe, without changing it, which would make it temporary.
1. "Changing states between being autonomous and non-autonomous is the only change relevant here. Has TAZ, in anyway, recently changed to being non-autonomous and then back again? Nope, therefore they have been autonomous for a great deal of time, almost to be considered permanent. One could further state that if this state of being autonomous was only temporary, as soon as the autonomous reason for TAZ's existence comes to an end, so does TAZ. Therefore, TAZ must be permanent in its autonomy simply to maintain its existence."
"As stated above, if TAZ stops being autonomous, it simply cannot exist in its current form and therefore this point is moot. In future it either becomes permanently autonomous or falls under another body of Zoners that rule it and thus loses its autonomy. "
The fact that they havent changed their state yet doesnt mean they wont in future.
When the Temporarily Autonomous Zoners become non autonomous, the Zoners will not stop existing. They will just have changed. If all of them change to bein non autonomous at once and no autonoumous zoners exist, then they will probably want to rename, which doesnt mean that they stop existing. Furthermore, some TAZ members may leave and stop being temporarily autonomous, which doesnt mean that the name of TAZ will become inappropriate. All the Zoners in TAZ can be autonomous, and leave TAZ as soon as they become non autonomous, and they will still have been temporarily autonoumous. Even if all of TAZ become non autonomous, they still wouldnt necessariyl have to change their name. The "Temporarily Autonoumous" can refer to the fact that they were autonomous for a time, even if they arent anymore. It can also mean that they are autonomous now, but were not autonomous throughout their lives, before they joined TAZ.
2. "Good and evil exist to fight each other. If you have a world full of good, you wouldn't recognise the good as it exists, as you would have nothing 'evil' with which to compare it to. Same as a world full of evil."
Something can be good without it fighting evil. For example being well fed and healthy is still good even if there are no malnurished sick people. You may appreciate it less when you dont know the oposite, but it doesnt change the fact that it is still good.
Okay... I'm laughing now. When I first saw this post, laughter wasn't the first thing to come to mind. However, I see the humor now. Well played. While I cannot and will not speak for TAZ. I will say that, in my humble opinion, the faction would cease to exist long before a name change. But of course, that's just my opinion.
Your premise deals with entropy, which of course, in a thermodynamic sense, deals with the level of interactions between molecules, from which, energy is derived and at the end tends to nothingness as you use up the amount of matter, which is converted to energy, in a closed unit. Your very 'temporary being' will eventually be permanent as it changes to nothing.
The very idea of nothingness is permanent in its grasp, once matter and energy is used up, there is nothing upon which to change this state and thus, nothingness prevails in permanence for eternity.
Also, I don't believe you fail to see that if TAZ becomes non-autonomous, it invariably loses the title of being autonomous altogether and becomes 'TNAZ'. I never said Zoners will stop existing, merely TAZ will change and thus not exist in its current form.
Merely having a child fed doesn't preclude evil. You cannot classify the idea of 'good', in any meaningful sense, without having the comparative of evilness upon which to compare it.
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