The Wild & Their Privileges

[Czechmate]

People were against giving intel multi ID
https://discoverygc.com/forums/showthrea...tid=189215

[Kauket]

I did not have my Fae within the Order, that would not make any sense, but I could fly around them and laughing at them for their "deluded fanatism" and they could not do anything to reveal me if I did not want it.

The Order is forced to fly with their tags openly, but Wilds aren't. How's that fair? How's that even fun for the Wilds?

Anyone can rat on a character regardless of affiliation. People don't need to be an Order to be suspect of something. Also, I think saying that only the Order can exclusively weed out compromised individuals is suspect. You are aware that the Order aren't the only threat, but rather everyone and anyone? Wilds don't really have allies.

It'd be nice if Intel IDs, or at least, let the rules allow intel ID based characters to have undercover alts that are generic like for FL ID etc

[Darius]

I did not have my Fae within the Order, that would not make any sense, but I could fly around them and laughing at them for their "deluded fanatism" and they could not do anything to reveal me if I did not want it.

The Order is forced to fly with their tags openly, but Wilds aren't. How's that fair? How's that even fun for the Wilds?

Anyone can rat on a character regardless of affiliation. People don't need to be an Order to be suspect of something. Also, I think saying that only the Order can exclusively weed out compromised individuals is suspect. You are aware that the Order aren't the only threat, but rather everyone and anyone? Wilds don't really have allies.

It'd be nice if Intel IDs, or at least, let the rules allow intel ID based characters to have undercover alts that are generic like for FL ID etc

Counterpoint: Discovery's ID system and community at large just isn't suited for having factions with perms to run multiple IDs running about.

[Kauket]

There's only two generic IDs in the game.

[xenomorph]

First and foremost, I would sincerely like to thank those who have taken the time to read my slightly longer text (although it is actually quite short, as there is still much more to discuss) and have not misinterpreted it. I am also grateful that constructive criticism has been largely accepted, as I genuinely wrote everything with the best intentions, aiming to break down some barriers that were not entirely necessary.

@Haste, @Darius, and @Erremnart have expressed nothing other than similar points to what I have said, and a bit more, which I sincerely appreciate.

Allow me to clarify a few more things.

Character Deaths Will Not Happen (Unless approved): It is true that it may seem odd to kill the same person repeatedly, but honestly, that is much better accepted than completely destroying a character. Regarding character destruction, it is not something that will happen because it is a bit more controversial. However, I will take RNS-Charente as a good example. The individual in question personally collaborated with the Order. The Order, of course, discovered the infection and, accordingly, with the permission of RNS-Charente, organized a series of interactions and events. In our last event, we "destroyed Charente," but that wasn't the end for the character. I haven't read much about Charente since then, but I happened to see that the person continued the roleplay and transformed RNS-Charente into something better. It's not something that can just fly freely, like a Valor (or whatever it was), anymore. And indeed, the Order is grateful for this humble teamwork with Charente. It's a good example of how such things can be done. There was no powergaming; everything was handled nicely as it should be. It's truly a rarity, but we are grateful for it.

Regarding the point of "useless roleplay," I explicitly meant roleplay that revolves around meeting the standards related to preserving "officialdom." You know well what I mean. I didn't call anyone else's RP useless, because it is not. PS For the most part haha =)

Regarding the point about taking any role, it specifically referred to Wild, and if you read it more carefully, you will understand what it's about. Wild OFs should not have access to every ID. If they want a specific IFF or something similar, they should go through SRP and create concrete RP so that they can receive RP consequences, rather than simply creating characters "out of the blue."

I also really liked the point raised by Erremnart that the Order is rendered useless even though it is doing its job. That is a very valid point. I believe everyone is aware that the Order does an excellent job but is not appreciated for it.

Someone else mentioned the infiltration into governments. Last time I checked, there was infiltration in the Gallic Government (but this is not the main point of the post, so). That character didn't have a concrete backstory yet, but that's a story for another time. Perhaps things have changed now, but I don't think they have. In general, the points made by the mentioned individuals have been well articulated.

[Czechmate]

There was always the issue of "wild, /1/2" that was fixed by multi ID.
Faces have more than earned in RP their freelancer status and shouldn't need any SRP for that dual ID.

(But then again by rules we can't see they are faes, confusing)

[Haste]

I did not have my Fae within the Order, that would not make any sense, but I could fly around them and laughing at them for their "deluded fanatism" and they could not do anything to reveal me if I did not want it.

The Order is forced to fly with their tags openly, but Wilds aren't. How's that fair? How's that even fun for the Wilds?

Anyone can rat on a character regardless of affiliation. People don't need to be an Order to be suspect of something. Also, I think saying that only the Order can exclusively weed out compromised individuals is suspect. You are aware that the Order aren't the only threat, but rather everyone and anyone? Wilds don't really have allies.

It'd be nice if Intel IDs, or at least, let the rules allow intel ID based characters to have undercover alts that are generic like for FL ID etc

I think you're overlooking something very obvious.

If I see a "5th" or a "46th" ship online on the server, I know what they are. I can log in a Rogue, Xeno, Hacker or whatever and fly at them and, potentially, have some good old Pee-Vee-Pee.
The same is true for a Corsair faction being easily recognizable for an Outcast player or faction to log for and fly towards. And so on, and so forth.

And it doesn't just have to be PvP. It can be whatever roleplay is appropriate for the character you feel like playing. But you kind of know what you're dealing with ahead of time.

There is only one (official, tagged) faction that is exempt from this system and that's Fae. I cannot log in an Order ship in response to seeing Fae ships flying around, and do what an Order ship should: hunt them down. Fae can simply point at their ID and go "nonono mister Order, I am a flawlessly unrecognizable perfect infectee, and you'd be POWERGAMING if you attacked me!". This sucks, and is a little bit ironic, as by doing so they themselves are powergaming.

It doesn't help that in my experience the only Wild faction left spends vastly more time on non-Wild ID ships than they do on Wild ID ships, depriving a faction like Order of content. It just feels really bad to know your natural enemy faction, the whole birthright of your own faction, is around quite a bit but entirely out of reach.

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[Kauket]

Well the reason why people have to use tags is because the rules suck. For both official requirements, and the "one id per char" rule thing. As well as people complaining about "nomads metagaming"

It would be preferable if there would be no tags involved at all. Because subconscious meta.

[Sombs]

WILD DIALOGUE?! This is now a somewhat controversial viewpoint, although it is based on lore foundations. However, almost all those who hide behind infested characters consistently speak like regular individuals with all the nuances of normal emotions, thoughts, and the like. Shouldn't infested characters be distinguished differently? Shouldn't they have a more direct and less complex dialogue, just to showcase some contrast? How is it possible that Nomads, who are massive parasites, find themselves within a human body and flawlessly control all processes? In vanilla, this was not the case. This aspect is also highly critical and greatly overlooked. "Just RP like a 100% normal human "

The entire point of playing an infected character is not to play an infected character. There are no dead giveaways for an infected character - which is why even 30 years after the Nomad War, there are still infectees around.

When Foxglove, Ramke and I founded the Vagrants, we initially were 100% against the idea of a Vagrant Infected faction. The way we preferred it, we wanted our infectees to remain as individuals and be secret operatives. 100% covert, 0% overt. No idiotic faction tags that half of the community doesn't know how to handle with restraint, including the ones who use them. If people wanted to play Scorpion Drones or infected capitals, they would either need to SRP them - and with this showing the effort required to earn them - or have another soulless Wilde/Aoi character, but not part of the Vagrants.

Hell, I even wrote a guide about how to play as infectee to help people avoid breaking roleplay and immersion. Every time I saw an infected character dock at Freeport 11, which is the one freeport that will definitely identify infectees due to increased security measures and matching equipment as the infocard itself says (with, honestly, all justification), I knew that player didn't really care about their infected character.

What we always wanted is a clear separation between infected characters operating covert and overt. Infectees are supposed to operate in subtle ways, with a plentitude of things to do, keeping eyes and ears open for their masters who can not do that themselves, for obvious reasons. A covert character would never fly around with any nomad technology, except maybe the one you can buy legally from the Core, but why do that, knowing one would be using the corpse of a nomad as a weapon. Overt characters would have completely different names and could use what they earned, not what they inherited by joining a faction.

Sadly, things changed, and I can't say I disagree with many points. I don't care for the Order, since the Order hasn't been the Order in decades with one exception, and I don't care about tech cell jealousy, but it always leaves a very bitter taste knowing how things developed the moment Foxglove and I left.

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[Leo]

As someone who plays an intel faction for fun (The Directive), you tend to walk a very fine line with metagaming.

As an example: I see a bunch of Fae players in New Tokyo with Auxo and Entity in the player list. So I log my Directive spy ship and go spy on them, collecting intel for myself and The Directive. Is that construed as metagaming? In my mind it's very close if not metagaming flat-out. I saw them on the character list, I went there cloaked to listen into what they're talking about and then reported it to someone. Intel factions should only operate in one of two facets:

1. When hired by an external faction/agency to run intel/surveillance on a faction for the means of collecting data.
   
2. When visible in open space and collecting suspicious ships locations or conversations.

Anything beyond this could be construed as metagaming unless you stumbled upon some ships whilst flying around under cloak. This has happened to me a couple of times, but I felt like it could be construed as metagaming so I didn't keep the information I heard.

Being intel within the confines of Discovery is a tricky business. It's difficult, if not impossible, to balance properly.

However, on the flip side, I will say the cloaks are fairly balanced alongside the scanners. If I want to scan you from a range where my cloak won't be detected, I only have a 5k range that I can do that and still remain undetected. There have been times where I've tried to scan ships and have had to get up to 6k away and risk being detected within the 4k range of the cloak detector. Makes for some fun RP when I'm hired to do recon and surveillance on certain parties.

Felt I'd give my two cents on this considering I have a lot of run RPing intel agents.

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Why are you reading this? Don't you have something else you'd rather be doing? Why are you still reading this? Go out and explore, trade, fight, pirate, or even die thanks to SLRC autopilot. You're still here? What do you want, a poem? Fine. Roses are red, violets are blue, I lose the game, and so did you.