Turning the Nephilim into a Liner.

[Reddy]

i'm sick of seeing these threads about zoner caps every few months.
just end this thread quickly please, its a waste of time

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[MotokoSusu]

dear Reddy games and forums are generally a waste of time any way. if you had something better to do you would have been doing it and not here

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[Kazinsal]

The last big zonerzonerzoner thread lasted SIXTY-EIGHT PAGES. The OP of it was Jinx, and he clearly stated in it that the Nephilim was originally intended to be, quote, "a secret Zoner dreadnought of power".

Each Zoner official faction was going to get one Nephilim dreadnought, the Nephilim was going to become effectively a supersized battletransport, and the Aquilon was going to become a hybrid battletransport/carrier.

You know what? I'm reminded of the time (unfortunately one I missed direct witness to) that Discovery banned furry RP and all but two people just retconned their furry RP to be human RP and life went on. One freaked out so hard he got himself banned and the other spent six months trying to skirt the rules before finally quitting because he couldn't separate his otherwise decent RP from the furry stuff.

Ironically, he was also a Zoner.

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Retired, permanently.

[Karst]

I think that proverbial ship has sailed.

I have never bought into the argument that ships should have their combat abilities adjusted due to roleplay concerns. It is undesirable to artificially limit ships' gameplay mechanics because of roleplay, and just as the Voyager or the Ahoudori are not categorically worse than their freighter and gunboat class mates despite being "roleplay-oriented" representatives of their respective classes, I don't think the overall situation of capship RP would be improved by making the Neph useless in combat.
Balance is (ideally) done with one thing only in mind: the capabilities of comparable ships of the class, and the pvp performance against other classes, to create a system for enjoyable combat interaction. Roleplay has nothing to do with it.

If you take away the Nephilim or nerf it stupidly, it'd just result in more Ranseurs, then people would start complaining about Ranseurs in NomHeart and Ranseurs docking at FP11 and farming nomads.

Keep that in mind. Gimping the Neph will simply cause lolBS pilots to move to the next lolBS of choice, while punishing those that actually fly it for the RP and want to stick with it.

Edit: If something were to be done to prevent the problem of lolnephs farming/attracting pews, it should be the restriction of the ship to SRP or something similar, but that too was brought up countless times and ultimately discarded.

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[MotokoSusu]

soooo from what I gather you telling us because of some 68 page thread made .... how long ago?
is something that now all of a sudden needs to be adhered to after there has been evolved RP by people
and I do find your need to point out a furry that was the last to die was a zoner. well I take that as a complement
because if you do not hold true to yourself no one else will. but I sure that some in the community took great pleasure in forcing him to comply.
which seems to be the case with most of these issues

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[Antonio]

I view this same way as I view things like restricting mining IDs to 4,300 cargo ships or battleships to official faction IDs.

If we were a few years ago, it'd be a good idea. It'd shape the landscape of the server for the best, make lots of sense and be a generally positive change. Unfortunately, we are now in a time where we can't be taking such things, that have existed for many years, away from people. I agree with the premise of this suggestion, as I do with others, however it is so late in the game that making this change would ultimately be detrimental.

For better or worse, this is one of the toys we'll just have to let people have.

Seconding this, it probably would have worked 10 years ago when it got introduced but people have invested billions of credits into it by now. Turning it into a liner would make people lose hundreds of millions and unless the admins compensate them (which is work), it'll cause an outrage. Even with that, I find the arguments lacking. Nephilim is already so big and the guns are so spread out that it's barely usable in PvP. What should happen though is restricting it from entering house space. Such a massive ship has no business outside of Omicrons/Omegas/Sigmas.

Something people forget way too often is that player ships do not represent lore assets. Just because you see 5 Nephs farming Nomad remains in Delta and ooRP in local doesn't mean they represent the Zoner lore. For all intents and purposes inRP Zoners can have 1-2 Nephs and they can be roleplayed like a mobile colony ship, a liner or whatever you want while ingame it's a tool given to players with a purpose. Being a liner would make it even more useless than it is and remove any potential it had. You can roleplay your Neph however you want, if you think it should be a liner then roleplay it like one and use only half of your guns, but don't restrict the others especially since their ships aren't connected with the lore.

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SNAC Montage Part 1 | Part 2 | Part 3 | Part 4 | Thruster SNAC

[Ikarus_Hagen]

Better make it a carrier, liners would mean that even freelancers can fly it, so better not.

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For a better Sirius!

[Unlucky_Soul]

Too late to change it. If it ain't broke don't fix it.

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[misterich]

Seconding this, it probably would have worked 10 years ago when it got introduced but people have invested billions of credits into it by now. Turning it into a liner would make people lose hundreds of millions and unless the admins compensate them (which is work), it'll cause an outrage.

That is the reason why this will not happen.

Anyways: There is no need for a Zoner BS. You rearly see them. In all the time I am playing discovery I seen this ship once; once! That was also in conn. I heart this ships is not a good bs and there are almost no time where you can use it. Zoners do not need such warships normally! So there is also no reason to change anything on it - there are other Battleships, which should maybe be changed like the Togo or Sarissa, because they are played or not played but not because of RP reasons like in this case.

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#notmykoeln

[Geneva Shipping Platform]

Why not make the Neph a combat decent ship again?
One of the most underlined caracteristics of the Zoner ships used to be theyr hull,
they wouldnt have the best turn rate or in fact they wernt the best at nothing,,, but they had an hull only comparable to the Nomad one.
The Zoner neutrality was achieved and maintained by theyr firepower, the Freeports were gained because of the Houses not whanting to disturb the otherwise peacefull Zoners.
They are even alowed to trade with criminals and all (or most) factions inside House Spacenot because they were alowed but because the Governments wouldnt whant to engage in a war they knew they couldnt win.
And the neutral position of the Zoners was theyr handicap, you had strong ships but couldnt shoot anyone.
Then came the "balance" update were most of the caps received extra hull points , but not the Neph, cause it already had 2.95 milions and so it became similar to most ships of the same class but with the handicap of maneuverability the it always had.
As someone that always flew Zoner ships i am very disapointed with the way things are going with Zoners.
If you make the Neph a liner give us the Persephone https://discoverygc.com/wiki/%22Persepho...an_Warship
And make it a decent combat ship, maybe balance it.
Balance in a way the Zoners stop being some pety refugees almost like outcasts or parias, its ridiculous, Freeports lost??? Out of Zoner control? Absurd in RP terms, see the consequences of the destruction of a freeport in the vanila game, then tell me how this "balancing" crap is working out RP wise.