RP with Military ID

[Praetyre]

The Mandalorians and Asgard Warriors are primarily hired guns with a political agenda of sorts, in the case of the latter actualy being a government (military-run governments are not uncommon among Earth's history) affiliated with the Zoners.

---

Sig by Blackstarr.
The Man With No Name: Prologue|1|2|
After reading The Man With No Name, please comment here
The Man With No Name's Dramatis Personae (Spoilers within)
Please read

[gauliez]

//seconded Robert Fitzgerald, I don't see how an ind. trader could buy such big ships RP-wise. You need a whole company/faction to support the initial cost I think. How many Captains own their boats in freight transport ? Still, they might drive it all their life long. So I think generic trader ID = ind. trader in RP = should be limited to ship with lower cargo.

Now, about the Agnus Dei and our military ID.
From my ingame experience, I noticed indeed some people where not understanding how we were using it and why.

To me, a military ID means you are part of a lawful army, a gathering of many pilots obeying to a strict hierarchy, and with enough means to engage massive operations supported by some flagship (Well, in Agnus Dei, our flagship is a GB...).

Now, the whole question of this ID is the ZOI and who you should target.

* A military House ID (LSF, RAF,...) has for ZOI its House territory and the surroundings, maybe more in case of war. However, their goal is to protect their house, so they should not go to far away from home (supplying issues, weakening of home defenses).
Concerning their targets, well almost anything that is threatening their respective Houses : Pirates, Rebel factions, Rogue Nations, enemy Houses, ... Well, everything that is defined by House diplomacy. BUT, a house military ID doesn't mean you should engage all unlawful, i.e., BAF will not engage the Outcasts, because of their agreement in the war against Kusari.

* For the generic military ID, one should make a proper RP that will define the ZOI and targets of this ID. And he should also have a big enough army to justify this ID (which means concretely only factions and maybe some important unofficial groups should use it...). As far as Agnus Dei is concerned, here is our description and how it justifies the generic military ID. We are a private army, mainly made of former convicts, and based on a brain-washing religion that calls to the Crusade against Nomads and their like. So a bit like the Templar in Middle-Age, we definitely are an Army, and we have a lot of fun RPing it. Our religion is also pretty tolerant to unlawful, as there is always a chance that one day they will repent, understand our cause and join us. But we do not like unlawful killing other humans, as we consider every life to be important, and it might be a reason to engage. Now, about our targets and respective ZOI :
- Nomads, Wilds, Phantoms, Cylon, Corrupted are considered as Evil, they are the reason of our Crusade. They will be fought Sirius-wide. That is why we need the generic ID, to be able able to go fight them even in their homeland (if one day we are strong enough to do so:P).
- Unlawful, we will not engage them on sight, they are not our main concern. However, we will engage them in the following situations.
+ We are/will be working for some House as an army-for-hire. Which means some of us will be attached to this House, and help their Police or Army to enforce the laws. We will probably not attack on Sight, but always let a chance to the unlawful to repent and follow us. We will never act alone, but always under the order of a Police/Army member online. And our people will strictly respect the police/army ZOI, and will not chase targets through Sirius.
If we are present in the system and not linked by any contract, we will just mind our own business, without caring for unlawful, except if :
+ they carry some Nomad stuff, artifacts, as they can be corrupted. We will then enquire and act depending on the answer we get.
+ they carry slaves, or kill a lot of people, as every life should be preserved. We will therefore try to convince some to stop their slaughter, forget their meaningless fights and join our Crusade. If the answer are not satisfying, we might engage.


OK, I guess it is the bulk of our rules of engagement...
I know it is pretty long, and a bit complex:P, but I think it has a great potential for RP, and we are only at the beginning of it. A lot remains to be explored. Now, I don't see any other ID that could allow us to do so. But I also don't see any other faction that could use a generic military ID.
Maybe still we could still keep it, as it somehow leaves a potential for good RP, if anybody else comes with some new and original (well-Rped) idea needing an lawful army against a precise target.

[agnusdei]

Military ID ? They are a private army strictly lawful (no weapons or ships unlawful as it would be ooRP) who never take bounty and cannot use more than a gunboat ship size.

How to use ? Some government, need a private army to do their dirty job without being implied (as killing a dictator in a banana republic, or destabilizing a government by regular assault on their main supply base). A private army get their money by signing a contract with a miltary house. The difference with Merc ? Once again no bounty hunting and no contract with unlawful

Final detail : a Kusari military IDed ship cannot go in bretonia or Liberty systems. If a pilot with Military ID fly a house military ship he is necessarily under contract with the high command of this house. I don't see how he can have the ship otherwise. So any house militaries should consider him under contract for the house that commisionned the ship. For the Kusarian ship, he will be shoot at sight by any Bretonian ships.

So compared with Merc ID, i see the military ID like a more restricted ID. If we remove the military ID = more Mercenary Id = more confusion between lawful and unlawful.

---

Faction status
Recruitment thread
Diplomatic channel

[monsterlancer]

Military ID ? They are a private army strictly lawful (no weapons or ships unlawful as it would be ooRP) who never take bounty and cannot use more than a gunboat ship size.

How to use ? Some government, need a private army to do their dirty job without being implied (as killing a dictator in a banana republic, or destabilizing a government by regular assault on their main supply base). A private army get their money by signing a contract with a miltary house. The difference with Merc ? Once again no bounty hunting and no contract with unlawful

Final detail : a Kusari military IDed ship cannot go in bretonia or Liberty systems. If a pilot with Military ID fly a house military ship he is necessarily under contract with the high command of this house. I don't see how he can have the ship otherwise. So any house militaries should consider him under contract for the house that commisionned the ship. For the Kusarian ship, he will be shoot at sight by any Bretonian ships.

So compared with Merc ID, i see the military ID like a more restricted ID. If we remove the military ID = more Mercenary Id = more confusion between lawful and unlawful.

I must say that I would agree with this.

[ryoken]

Military ID ? They are a private army strictly lawful (no weapons or ships unlawful as it would be ooRP) who never take bounty and cannot use more than a gunboat ship size.

How to use ? Some government, need a private army to do their dirty job without being implied (as killing a dictator in a banana republic, or destabilizing a government by regular assault on their main supply base). A private army get their money by signing a contract with a miltary house. The difference with Merc ? Once again no bounty hunting and no contract with unlawful

Final detail : a Kusari military IDed ship cannot go in bretonia or Liberty systems. If a pilot with Military ID fly a house military ship he is necessarily under contract with the high command of this house. I don't see how he can have the ship otherwise. So any house militaries should consider him under contract for the house that commisionned the ship. For the Kusarian ship, he will be shoot at sight by any Bretonian ships.

So compared with Merc ID, i see the military ID like a more restricted ID. If we remove the military ID = more Mercenary Id = more confusion between lawful and unlawful.


I so agree with this.:cool:
Remove military, and Merc's will be everywhere.

---

[monsterlancer]

Well, one-man companies aren't generally rich enough to purchase what someone correctly compared to massive fishing barges.

The Question: How does "one man companies" do this?

The Answer: You start with a small ship. Find a good route or routes. You stay with it untill you can get a bigger and better ship. Have a good set of scanners so you can dodge pirates or hostile houses in your path. Make your runs and keep your schedules even when house shippers cannot due to politics or open hostilities. Some think it is best to go on getting bigger and bigger ships but some will find that right one and will continue to do the same thing. There are some retired Independant Traders that may have more pocket change that most house shippers have to borrow just to cover payroll.:cool:

OOC- Or you can buy just one more ship and pay the proper fees and go back to your trade routes to look for that one unlawful person that made your early life miserable and catch him waiting for that next poor independant transport and you come out of nowhere with him fully in the range of your new battleship and chase him or her down every four hours. (maybe not OOC after all):laugh:

[monsterlancer]

[quote name='spec' date='Apr 17 2008, 06:59 AM' post='229926']
I'd have to disagree with the Trader ID being dumped. Having not many people with RP on an ID
doesn't/shouldn't make it a target for elimination.

Why can't there be independent traders - smaller traders, do more day to day business at cheaper rates
than larger corporations, there is a very good reason for them to stay...

Eliminating independent traders is like saying that only WalMart, Tesco and BigW can operate, not others ...
There is no faction/regulated owners behind trading, anyone should be able to setup shop for trading./quote]

I agree with you on this. Some people like to be their own boss and see how far they can go on their own with out a house hand out.

[tfmachad]

I see two issues with the current Military ID.

First if of incorrectness of terminology. Considering all the Houses have their own military IDs and that by our current standards it isn't possible for a military type character to fly a ship from another House; making it impossible for a player to buy, say, a Templar and play military in whatever territory he sees fit; there isn't ANY other military force present in Sirius apart from those forces of the Corsairs and Outcasts which could (should?) be seen as nations, not mere criminal groups.

The term "military" or "armed forces" imply, and I quote: the combined military, naval, and air forces of a nation called also armed services.

I think the correct term to use to describe an organization, not necessarily aligned to a government and that structures itself in a military fashion should be "paramilitary".

Second issue with this ID is that it reads:

Pilot carrying this ID has joined the lawful military forces of Sirius sector. Military ID grants its owner right to participate in military operations on lawful side, hunt pirates and terrorists, scan traders for contraband, and trade. Military ID owner cannot participate in any unlawful actions and fulfil bounty contracts.
Allowed ships: Fighters, Freighters, Transports, Gunboats
Carrying unmounted IDs in your ship, as well as not equipping an ID, is a serious crime.

A question arises: What is the lawful military forces of Sirius Sector? There is no such thing as an unified military force that has authority over all the "lawful" territory of Sirius (namely the four Houses territories). Two of the Houses are warring each other and the tensions between the other two are so dense you could cut it like a knife. The BAF and the KNF shoot each other perhaps on a daily basis, any LN ship entering Rheinland territory will be ordered out and shot upon if it doesn't comply.

The text of the ID - which has precedence over a lot of other things as it is clearly stated in the rules - could be interpreted as the one carrying that ID has the ability of playing military in whatever territory he sees fit and there's little arguing with that without resorting to common sense and perhaps the general interpretation the community has of the ID (does it have any?).

If there was to be an ID describing a private/not related to a government militarized force, I believe it should be named "Paramilitary ID" with some wording similar to this:

Pilot carrying this ID has joined a militarized force in the Sirius sector. Paramilitary ID grants its owner right to participate in military operations on either the lawful or unlawful side. Paramilitary ID owner cannot pursue bounties or trade.
Allowed ships: Fighters, Freighters, Transports, Gunboats
Carrying unmounted IDs in your ship, as well as not equipping an ID, is a serious crime.

---

Meet the Kriegers - The story of a family and of two men that shared more than just a name
Fantasmas de la Nube Siniestra
I Mon'Star: The Strange Case of Elizabeth Wallace

[AdamantineFist]

Hmm. Interesting suggestions, Gronath. I've always thought that it wasn't the concept of a military outside the houses (which is, in my opinion, perfectly acceptable) that was the problem, it was the fact that it seemed to imply being part of some universal organization. I say that if Gronath's changes are enacted, then it would be perfect.

---

[spec]

Well, one-man companies aren't generally rich enough to purchase what someone correctly compared to massive fishing barges.

Your point is valid, however, I would like to add that this issue is due to the Sirius economy as implemented
in FL. Firstly the economy is simple and the profits are too high and everyone can purchase any commodity
and sell it at the same price. The whole economy is too simplified, else no-one would play...
Imagine a place where anyone can earn credits at the same rate and become millionaires, impossible !

But then, we don't want to debate the economy here, it's there so people can fund other characters...

Even in RP terms, if you don't get an Independent trader and get RepEx ID, you as a trader cannot get
all the profit.... now where does that happen ! Just because you work for DHL doesn't mean that you keep
all the profits for the shipment you made, right ?
I don't see why we should eliminate Trader ID and keep RepEx or other IDs... As the ID has another
purpose - determining RP, which in turn will determine alliances and enemies... which in turn are more likely
to be fixed for a company.
For independent traders, they set their own reputation... exactly as done even in the real world...

As far as Agnus Dei is concerned, here is our description and how it justifies the generic military ID. We are a private army, mainly made of former convicts, and based on a brain-washing religion that calls to the Crusade against Nomads and their like. So a bit like the Templar in Middle-Age, we definitely are an Army, and we have a lot of fun RPing it.

From what you gave above, Angus Dei is a Militia...
A militia is not recognised as a Military by other nations, it's strictly considered a private force...
And usually, there will be many restrictions on their operations, mostly no-one will allow them to operate
freely within their ZOI. If at all a militia are involved, they try to do so on their own accord, or the
in-house military/government/opposition forces ask them to do so by funding them.



Anyway, back to topic now... I'm sure Trader ID and Angus Dei are 2 very interesting topics on their own...
As for the Military ID, I'm more inclined to believe that you must not own one without membership to
a specific House Military.

---

<span style="font-family:Century Gothic">Spec - Independent Trader</span>
Small Transport - Hauling without earning

Current Status: Inactive - Too Much Work and Travel