(07-28-2014, 06:23 PM)Mímir Wrote: But that just means that people will grind on their IC ships to buy their Corsair Legates.
I take offense to this as the leader of IC| just say "trader ships" lol .
Also +1 for bringing back Smuggler ID.
I have experience smuggling primarily with the Junker ID, and I dig making trade runs from Gallia (delivering black market munitions or other things, exporting Human Organs, etc). But it would be nice to have the Smuggler ID back so one could RP more of a "civilian" role rather than being set on using a Freelancer or Junker ID (or OC).
(08-01-2014, 02:01 AM)Highland Laddie Wrote: What's "un-civilian" about using a Freelancer ID, Dir?
I meant looking at the FL ID like the old Mercenary ID moreso than a civilian, and it would be nice to have the Civilian ID back as well <.< I just meant it in a sense that Smuggler ID would be looked upon as a Civilian until proven otherwise (discovery of illicit cargo)
Please lets not derail the topic. It is about unlawful trading and not smuggling.
One of the main differences is that as an unlawful trader you are dependant on unlawful and quasi-lawful sell-points unlike when you are smuggling, where you can and want to dock on lawful bases most of the time to maximize your profit.
Another one would be that as a smuggler you want to avoid being "caught" to maintain your neutral or freindly rep with lawfuls. As an unlawful trader you don't care about your rep with lawfuls, you actually want to be hostile towards them.
As someone who is trying to kick-off a faction which is built around unlawful trading I noticed while designing it, that the Pirate ID would be the most plausible to have the proper rephacks towards lawfuls and to have the opportunity to rob the counterpart aka lawful traders.
Unfortunately the lack of good trade routes within unlawful boundaries combined with the no-dock rephacks towards Rogues ,Lane Hackers, Mollys, LWB and Bundshuh bases as well as the hostile rephack towards Hogosha was too much, which made me switch to the Freelancer ID, losing the the ability to act appropiate to the desired rp ingame and "corrupting" the criminal ingame represantation via the ID to preserve enough available selling points for the faction.
I even think I would be totally fine with using a Freelancer ID and everything else mentioned if there were more attractive unlawful-to-unlawful (or quasi-lawful) trade routes except the already mentioned oldies, but goldies (Cardi, Artis etc.).
Well, that's the problem. I have not really a solution at the moment other than removing the rephacks from the Pirate ID, but I can see that this could and maybe would cause the same problems again which were the reasons why those rephacks exist now in the first place.
Obviously another one would be to revamp the unlawful trading routes, but I don't think that anyone wants to put that much work on Xoria. I wouldn't demand that at least.
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Smuggling between unlawful bases is a role already assigned by lore to Junkers. If the "problem" with this is that lawfuls do not necessarily treat Junkers as criminals, there are two ways to set yourself (and your unofficial smuggling faction) apart as criminal Junkers. 1) Always carry some amount of contraband, or several forms of contraband, in your cargo hold. Any lawful who scans you will then attempt to stop you. 2) Make it known through forum posts that your faction is engaging in criminal smuggling. Lawful factions are prickly enough that it shouldn't take much to get them to target you, or even bounty you.
Those suggestions work within existing conditions. If you want to petition for a Smuggler ID that rephacks all police, military, and corporations as hostile, and all unlawful and semilawful factions as neutral, you can do so. I have no control over that.
Unlawful bases already effectively have trade set up between them by resales of existing legal commodities. Establishing more profitable routes than these cannot be done without adding many new commodities that would be exclusive to unlawful bases, which basically means 1 or 2 new contraband for each unlawful faction. That is not possible this development cycle, and is unlikely for the future given the decreased size of the player population. If it were to happen, it would have to be by request from those unlawful factions themselves, and that has never yet happened.
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(08-01-2014, 02:33 PM)Xoria Wrote: Smuggling between unlawful bases is a role already assigned by lore to Junkers.
False, junkers only smuggled goods on short distances, i.e. Rochester - Manhattan. Rumors tell you they are not yet used to long trips.
Quote:65768
INFOCARD
<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-16"?><RDL><PUSH/><TEXT>Where there’s junk, there are the Junkers. They’ve been around since the earliest days of the Trade Lanes. Descended from the working classes, they developed within the House systems as a sort of necessary evil, handling the dirty work that no one else would. They do well salvaging valuable materials from the ever-increasing debris fields throughout Sirius, with the notable exception of Kusari. To this day they remain held at bay by the Hogosha. </TEXT><PARA/><TEXT> </TEXT><PARA/><TEXT>Anyone who deals with Junkers knows they live by a strict code; if you're not a Junker, you're not part of the family. A Junker will double-cross you without a second thought, and they're fiercely protective of each other. Most House corporations consider the Junkers to be simple criminals, but Junkers will occasionally do favors for the police, turning in the odd, mid-level criminal or letting them know about the occasional drug shipment. So despite some harassment, the police stop short of shutting them down. The infrequent police cleanup operations are little more than exercises in public relations, though there's no love lost between the two groups. </TEXT><PARA/><TEXT> </TEXT><PARA/><TEXT>The Junkers make their official money from salvaging debris within the fields, but also have a good deal going with various criminals, who like their "no questions asked" policy. Tolerated by the governments, Junkers sometimes deal in contraband, but they are extremely hard to catch red-handed. They are frequently patronized by the criminal element for the refuge they offer within the often hostile territory of House capitol systems. </TEXT><PARA/><TEXT> </TEXT><PARA/><TEXT>Liberty has two groups: a major population in the New York system, and a smaller enclave in Texas. The Junker base of operations in New London is located near the shipyards within the Southampton Debris Field. In New Berlin they scavenge the remaining pockets of industrial waste and scrap within the asteroid fields. Their latest foray is a departure -- a base in the Border Worlds. Attracted by the ALG operation in Sigma-13, they have set up shop near the facility and do most of the dirty work, picking off the best loot from the old ships for themselves. It also serves as a convenient launching point for Cardamine and Artifact runs into New Berlin. Long-distance smuggling is new for the faction, which is still perfecting this skill </TEXT><PARA/><TEXT> </TEXT><PARA/><POP/></RDL>
Wait now...
...you can cull the infocards for pretty much any point that you want to make.
A good many of the junker infocards have been rendered retroactively incorrect by Igiss's re-write of Junker lore.
They have been edited in, at best, a haphazard manner, and many that should have been, weren't at all.
But Xoria is correct. He's kinda a Dev. (Kinda)
...and Junkers aren't alone in outdated In-game data which does not reflect years of server gameplay, either.
With a BHG sig, I imagine you know of which I speak.
Having said that, I'm all for exposing missed updates.
I also think having mildly less profitable but shorter smuggling routes would be wise and can concentrate activity.
I think it could be way more easily done with Admin-controlled POBs.
And there's so many RP paths that branch from that road.
You're telling me I'm wrong cause I'm not a dev? Oh boy oh boy oh boy, that's a whole new level you've reached. Alright, play your game the way you want it.
He brings valid points in the discussion and all you see in his post is that... Q_Q much?
From all the suggestions I saw here, bringing back the Smuggler ID with all the lawfuls rep hacked hostile and all the unlawful factions neutral seems to be the best idea. But in order to keep interest for the Junker ID, Outcasts and Corsairs should be kept as hostiles for the Smuggler ID. The routes towards these two should be a privilege for the Junker ID, in my humble opinion.