Looking at how things are right now, perhaps reconsidering the whole ''official'' thing as a system would be a good idea. I think it has been a tad too long since we had to threaten people with what is essentially a timer that somehow is used to judge their roleplay contributions to the server.
Minimum players, minimum online time. That makes any faction seem like a chore, which the players involved have, usually, no interest in. If someone wants to contribute to a faction's development, they want to do so without pressure from above and without obligations. That is something I learned the hard way.
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PSA: If you have been having stutter/FPS lag on Disco where it does not run as smoothly as other games, please look at the fix here: https://discoverygc.com/forums/showthrea...pid2306502
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(11-23-2015, 10:10 AM)sindroms Wrote: Looking at how things are right now, perhaps reconsidering the whole ''official'' thing as a system would be a good idea. I think it has been a tad too long since we had to threaten people with what is essentially a timer that somehow is used to judge their roleplay contributions to the server.
Minimum players, minimum online time. That makes any faction seem like a chore, which the players involved have, usually, no interest in. If someone wants to contribute to a faction's development, they want to do so without pressure from above and without obligations. That is something I learned the hard way.
What dead server are you playing on!?
Emergency broadcast to the 2008'ers who yell 'disco is dead', stop judging this game by the standards of 7 years ago, and adapt. Metamorphose, move on.
THE SYNDIC LEAGUES
(A co-operative of Rheinland's Shipping Unions, retired from a life of piracy.)
(11-21-2015, 08:15 PM)Croft Wrote: In theory we could break down the faction system into tiers rather than the official/unofficial we have currently so that factions can apply to which ever tier matches their acceptable responsibilities. The base tier could be something simple like being added to the tracker, mid tier could be added to the forum section and the ability upgrade a PoB level and top tier would be all the bells and whistles, or something like that.
(11-21-2015, 11:54 PM)Dunc- Wrote:
(11-21-2015, 11:05 PM)Croft Wrote: How would simply layering the current faction system across several tiers create a standard that couldn't be achieved? By spreading out the perks and requirements a lot more factions could get useful bonuses that would otherwise be inaccessable with the current model.
The problem is that official factions need more power, not unofficials or indies.
I have to agree with croft because i can see where he is going with his tiering idea. It's not taking away what small amounts of power official factions have but having opportunities for small groups, indies et al who put in effort but who, under the current system, cant access the benefits traditionally associated with putting all the effort in because of a matter or official or not. A tier system, as Croft suggests, would allow factions and groups to say \'this is what we do, this is what we want to do\' consult the tiers and see which fits best with their needs. This crosses over with Shiz's post about how, in some areas, factions with non-standard goals and RP and methods have come into being and become successful. Part of the problem as well is that in some cases, official faction leaders and HC can denigrate unofficial factions for petty reasons or no reason at all. They only see position and influence (or lack thereof) when what should be considered is the quality of their RP and actions. Dunc, i think, has the right mindset in treating UFs as just another faction and not as some inferior group that isnt worth anything.
(11-22-2015, 12:29 PM)sindroms Wrote: Imho, official status is a flawed concept in the first place. It judges factions solely through a clock, regardless of RP quality or actual RP contribution to the server.If there was no such thing as officialdom, we might have more people trying to cook up groups for the same faction and their worth would be judged by actions, not by what is essentially a stopwatch.
I think i get what Spazzy is on about is that going for officialdom and being official, at the beginning of each it is fun but then it becomes tedious as the shine wears off and the (as frequently stated earlier in this thread) negatives start to outweigh the positives.
(11-23-2015, 10:10 AM)sindroms Wrote: Looking at how things are right now, perhaps reconsidering the whole ''official'' thing as a system would be a good idea. I think it has been a tad too long since we had to threaten people with what is essentially a timer that somehow is used to judge their roleplay contributions to the server.
Minimum players, minimum online time. That makes any faction seem like a chore, which the players involved have, usually, no interest in. If someone wants to contribute to a faction's development, they want to do so without pressure from above and without obligations. That is something I learned the hard way.
What dead server are you playing on!?
Emergency broadcast to the 2008'ers who yell 'disco is dead', stop judging this game by the standards of 7 years ago, and adapt.
Quote the exact part of my post that says something about disco being dead.
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PSA: If you have been having stutter/FPS lag on Disco where it does not run as smoothly as other games, please look at the fix here: https://discoverygc.com/forums/showthrea...pid2306502
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(11-23-2015, 10:26 AM)sindroms Wrote: Quote the exact part of my post that says something about disco being dead.
Pedantic. Believing that disco requires fundamental systematic changes to survive pretty explicitly equates to the concept of disco being dead, final nail, all the memes we like to clothe the server with like it's a particularly narcissistic yet-forever-self-hating Chihuahua. I don't necessarily care if you don't view yourself in the 'disco is dead' camp per say, but saying that we have to change one of modern disco's core fundamentals to a fairly disruptive impact equates to that. You know that, I'm sure.
THE SYNDIC LEAGUES
(A co-operative of Rheinland's Shipping Unions, retired from a life of piracy.)
(11-23-2015, 10:23 AM)Sabru Wrote: I think i get what Spazzy is on about is that going for officialdom and being official, at the beginning of each it is fun but then it becomes tedious as the shine wears off and the (as frequently stated earlier in this thread) negatives start to outweigh the positives.
phew, didnt expect to say so much.
My general experience is that players give up once the faction is official, which is a little anal since it's the point when the faction has the most evolutionary potential. However, a good faction leader will either just:
A) roll-call out the old farts who do nothing but make degenerative skype comments.
B) kick rudeboy wannabees.
C) recruit new people. They can afford to be selective now.
D) run events and develop lore. Keep that freshness up. Remain relevant. Become one of the old boys. If you created the faction just to be official-mc-gee-SirianLoremeister, then you're doing it wrong.
E) Ensure the 1ic and the 2ic can do each other's roles properly to give that faction some RL-proofing. A faction shouldn't be official if it's just one dude's pet project he's grooming for his own inaccessible vision.
Any of these steps will counter this problem. Some factions survive the post officialdom "where do we go now" point and stick around for years. Recent examples include JM|. Legions of others, like CL| don't - it's a great filter that works.
THE SYNDIC LEAGUES
(A co-operative of Rheinland's Shipping Unions, retired from a life of piracy.)
@Sabru
That is exactly what I intended, in my mind it would allow factions to steadily rise towards officialdom and prevent or at least minimize burnout by allowing them to pause at which ever tier works best. Not to mention reducing the "official or bust" effect whereby promising factions lose momentum or outright disband after a failed attempt.
The major upside is how easily such a system could be introduced, we already have the application process and a starting tier in place (registering for the tracker) all thats needed is to divide the perks (both present and potential) between the tiers and line up sensible requirements along side them. Personally I'd suggest a 5 tier system with every tier above 1 including the previous perks and reqs, something along these lines:
1 - Tracker - No reqs.
2 - Forum section - No member sanctions for previous month.
3 - Included in ID/Storyline decisions - 4 Members minimum.
4 - Custom ID - 6 months consistant activity.
5 - Full officialdom - 5 Member minimum.
@sindroms
The tracker isn't the best way of judging a faction's contribution, the dev and admin teams have both agree with you there but it is the simplest way of monitoring activity and if I may play Devil's advocate, the tracker is still a useful tool which I can't see being replaced. That being said we can marginalize its effects by only ultising it at strategic times such as during a contest for the top spot as a faction or as an early warning sign that a faction may be struggling rather than the defacto ruling used currently.
@Dunc-
Some excellent points, though some times its that one person who becomes the heart and soul of the faction and the loss of whom causes it to fall apart. Officialdom burnout I think stems from officialdom being the goal of the faction, not a means to progress it.
Overall I think we've got some good ideas rolling in this thread, towards the end of the week I'll collect all the suggestions and we can discuss those in greater detail and see if we can't pick a winner.