' Wrote:So rather than 4 OC Dessies flying around pvp whoring, we have 4 Corsair Praefects? Or 4 House Cruisers? Or, since these people are disinclined to RP in the first place, 1 OC Dessie, 1 Corsair Praefect, 1 Zoner Destroyer, and 1 Huntress? I fail to see how this helps in any way..
Isn't that the result anyway if the outcasts deny them a cruiser (which frankly I don't see how they can)
The reason these people go for the OC is because they have the notion it's the best one for PvP, and they are pvp whores, right?
If they have a mix like you describe they aren't nearly the black eye on the outcasts, which was the complaint.
They also need to be properly tagged and ID'd. and act accordingly. If they don't then there is reason to sanction them. If they are oin zoner ships they are not going to pvp whore very much, are they?
' Wrote:if they are all the same whats to make people play a different faction?
The outcasts have the best fighter, the corsairs have the best gb. The outcast have the best destroyer, the corsairs have the best BS (Osirus). We dont want them all the same for a reason. If everything was the same you could get all the enjoyment out of one faction and then it would get boring.
But that's exactly the reason you see so many corsair lunchboxes and OC's used by the PvP whores.
Do you really think the best RP'rs join a faction because they have the best ship? Or do you get the PvP whores wanting in the faction instead?
Another point is that if no ship in a class has a clear cut advantage, it actually gives you more options to try instead of "I don't want that ship, it sucks!"
The bigger issue in this--more important than "controlling cap spam"--is not assuming a "we get to decide for you what good rp is" attitude.
This isn't trivial and saying, "Well we are official", "well we have been around longer", "well we are reasonable" doesn't justify any factions taking over the server.
An Outcast group can do just like Liberty and make a faction rule that "Outcast destroyers require a license" and within their space attempt to enforce it.
But you can't mandate and call it "oorp" behavior if another Outcast doesn't buy into it.
"We were here first" doesn't justify this. That whole attitude is wrong.
Have you guys ever been to a server where factions manipulate their way to a position of moderating other players? You haven't lately because none of them are left.
' Wrote:The bigger issue in this--more important than "controlling cap spam"--is not assuming a "we get to decide for you what good rp is" attitude.
This isn't trivial and saying, "Well we are official", "well we have been around longer", "well we are reasonable" doesn't justify any factions taking over the server.
An Outcast group can do just like Liberty and make a faction rule that "Outcast destroyers require a license" and within their space attempt to enforce it.
But you can't mandate and call it "oorp" behavior if another Outcast doesn't buy into it.
"We were here first" doesn't justify this. That whole attitude is wrong.
Have you guys ever been to a server where factions manipulate their way to a position of moderating other players? You haven't lately because none of them are left.
See, the point is that anyone who RPs a capship is fine- while registering is fine and dandy, no grudge if you RP. It isn't a "we were here first" its a "there is a problem, a big one, and it is our duty to do something about it"
*Gets out of trash bin, spits out scraps, and sighs*
Tinkerbell...that's not what he means. It is VERY clear what decent RP and poor RP is. VERY CLEAR.
Good RP that will be exempt from this ruling:
RoS - Whoa...what's that Dreadnought doing in front of Malta, amigo!?
101st - No idea.
Battleship - This is battleship Reconquista...commencing scan. Friendlies detected, powering down weapons.
or
Battleship - This is the Reconquista, we've been commissioned for the defense of Malta. State your intentions.
Poor, Unacceptable RP that will result in what Eppy has stated on doing:
RoS - Whoa...what's that Dreadnought doing in front of Malta, amigo!?
101st - No idea.
Battleship - Hi.
RoS - State your intentions!
*No response*
101st - State your intentions! You are in violation of Outcast space!
Battleship - But i r outcast
RoS - If you do not state your intentions immediately, you will be engaged and destroyed!
Battleship - lol
Battleship - I am in bttleship. u cant kill me.
-------------------
Of course, if either of these ships have other problems, such as mounting the wrong ID, tagged with the wrong faction, mounting oorp equipment, or attacking the wrong people...it is a demonstation of poor RP, and will either be sanctioned or the person will be continuously attacked until he/she sells the ship.
Quote:[7:42:05 PM][6:51:36 PM] Igor (Smokey): btw terry
[6:51:48 PM] Terrance Cooper: Ye?
[6:52:00 PM] Igor (Smokey): nothin
[6:52:03 PM] Igor (Smokey): just sayin btw
[6:52:05 PM] Terrance Cooper: <_<
Quote:Johnny_Haas: you shot anti criuse speed rockets!!!
Johnny_Haas: but why????
Johnny_Haas: ??
Johnny_Haas: why you shoot criuse speed rockets?
I don't recall the RM taking this much flak for limiting their capital ships... seriously people, it's within the 101st's rights, being the owner of both the Guard system, and Outcast space in general. Since that's not in dispute (it better not be!), then what's all this noise for?
Get over yourselves. You can talk about balancing ships or what to do with PvP whores somewhere else, but this mandate is going to stand, I will personally enforce it, and any ooRP Outcast capital ships are going to be dealt with. We're not even taking it as far as the RM (or KNF, wasn't aware they did it, but then I'm not active in that space)! We're saying it's fine... if they RP. If you people don't have a problem with ooRP capital ships flying around, then that's a problem.
' Wrote:If someone isn't following the RPing rules, there is already an avenue to report them, and they will be sanctioned.
The problem isn't so much the stuff outside of the rules, but the stuff inside the rules that is still... distasteful and ooRP, despite being legal. THAT is what this is aimed at- any infractions will of course receive screenies and reports.
I'd like to ask whether there will be a definition somewhere of what will be acceptable as good RP?
Simply saying that 'this is good' and 'that is bad', with a couple of examples is not really enough (imo). There needs to be a clearer definition of what qualifies as good (in this case as defined by the 101st - although personally I'd rather see a community wide definition). How else can new players (especially) be expected to adhere to good RP when there is no indication of what that might be.
Equally there will be players whose first language is not English, and to a greater or lesser extent they will be limited in how well they can RP (I accept that this is an English language server and as such people playing here can be reasonably expected to have a good command of the English language). This does not mean that they are not trying hard, or that they do not in fact have a great RP story posted on the Disco forum - but trying to type it and answer questions in game might be very difficult for them if English is not an easy language for them.
We put a great amount of store on the fact that this is an 'RP' server. It adds a whole new dimension to the game, and makes the game significantly bigger than it ever was, both during gameplay and on the forums.
I'm also wondering whether this is an issue about cap ships or RP? I have to ask that if Cap ships are felt to be unbalancing the game when in the wrong hands why are we not be requesting them to be banned, and removed from the game altogether?
If I was being cynical (and I'm not - this is just how it might appear to a new player), it might appear that the official factions/clans simply want to keep all the nice big shiny ships to themselves and if people won't play by their rules then they will be thrown out of the sandpit that is Discovery. It sounds a little like bullying to me.
There are rules about wrong weapons/ships etc etc and these are well documented and will get you sanctioned if you get it wrong. But RP'ing a character is a lot less clear, and a lot harder to make clear.
About Capship regulation... There is a lot of dedication [RP wise] into making anything bigger than a gunship/boat. First off, you need the brains and schematics to make such an large ship, that usually only come into play with people with a certain amount of power. There is a decent amount of space or resources made to actually put together the pieces in the right manner that make a capship up needed to MAKE the capship, way more than ships, bombers and gunboats. The resources and components needed to make capships are often twice as expensive as anything smaller than a gunboat/ship. Only specific places have this kind of dedication and the shipyard to make the capship, and I'm guessing that the Outcasts control this place with that kind of dedication, specifically the 101rst. This means that they should be able to control the majority of capships due to the fact they are the people that have the schematics and time to make such capital ships. Not only that, but factions, especially one such as the Outcasts, don't have the resources to create capital ships using credits! Much like currency in the present in real life, currency in Freelancer is just a promise of what you can get by trading a set amount of promises for something of equal value. In real life, you can't always get anything you want with money, especially if nobody has the resources to make such ships. If this was not an Roleplay server all of the above things would mean absolutely nothing, but since we Roleplay we need a certain degree of reality that ties into the freelancer universe, and I really don't think that the outcasts have infinite resources to construct capital ships for everyone to buy. If someone doesn't want to sell something to someone that they own and make, then the buyer can't buy it. No matter how much they worked for it.
That is why they really need a valid roleplayable reason for owning such ships that require dedication to make and maintain. :D At least in my honest opinion!
EDIT: Oh yes, And most people would be wary of giving people a weapon. Weapons can be used against your own wishes, so you ussually try to give weapons to people you trust.