[RHA] Reputation Adjusted

[Lythrilux]

I think it's fair shooting something and then docking on it's NPC base that there'd be a rep adjustment. The only fault of this I think is that it's worded so strangely, unlike similar 'sanctions' in the past where people have had their reps adjusted after shooting something.

Although being rep-hacked no-dock to all Zoner bases for something that happened outside Freeport 1 brings into question the power of Zoner-related rep changes again and Zoner 'laws'. I feel like this specific situation is a definitive argument for why Zoner-based rep adjustments are too powerful right now, and why individual Zoner bases should probably have their own or regional IFFs. It also brings to light the weirdness with Zoners being generic in lore, but not in the rules.

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[Binski]

Here's what Zoners need for a real FR5 if they want it. https://discoverygc.com/forums/showthrea...tid=181455

How many official Zoner factions are there? Not all have direct interests in the FP1 area yes, and if the factions don't care then you might as well let them have it.

And if I were a Zoner base owner of one of the bases at FP 1 I'd move to a safer house space system and pay the house fees instead. That or you should all form a faction and get started on officialdom so next time you would get the FR option no questions asked. If it were me, I'd probably risk my base to FR5 the whole faction from Zoner bases.

[sajuuk111]

Quote this from the original post: How long will this be the case? For a while.

This is not how you do it. It is bad. The punishment should be clear. How long is it gonna be? How is it decided? This is a rushed decision. This does not make any sense.

Otherwise, Where are Velvet or OSI? The Bretonians have defended the base. If Zoners dont care about the base and they dont show up or, punish the people who violates their rules, maybe they should go away. GMs stepping in to punish people for actions in NFZ shows that current official factions are incompetent.

I have attacked Omega Ore Depot as a single Corsair Battleship just 3 days ago from RHA attack declaration. NoMe paid me 37.5M, and i stopped my attack. Do you know what was i expecting? Some consequence for my actions from Zoners. There was an Official member of Zoners at my attack too. The result? Nothing happened. I was expecting some heavy-rp, turning myself to an enemy of Zoners but well who cares?

The universe should be player driven. The choices of factions should have some consequences. If Official Factions do not represent and defend the well-being of indies, they should get punished.

The punishment from GMs should happen. The thing is, this was directed towards the wrong party.

Zoners should've been punished, not RHA. They have failed to do anything at all. Punish Zoners for doing nothing. Not RHA.

[Venkman]

Y'all fail to understand that the problem isn't that RHA got this LIDL FR5, but how they got it. Either do it properly or don't do it at all please.

Now, I'll wait one month for this thing to expire. I suggest you do the same and stop posting cringe. Thank you.

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Orex Armaments

[pulha]

Nobody here knows what is transpiring in the background

Everyone is making assumptions

Most don't even know how fr5 work, other do.

The abuse from staff is obvious as they have no inrp right to do what they have done, at least at the current rules/game standing

[LuckyOne]

To me this is a simple enforcing of unavailable/impossible to do/not flexible enough game mechanics.

And since there was no previous RP from neither RHA or the Zoners on brokering a deal in "overlooking" No Firing Zones laws, it seems justified.

Yes, it would be better if the official faction used a FR5, or the GMs gave them a bit more time to respond instead of this weirdness but I believe the GMs are simply acting for the greater good. Otherwise other factions might also get idea of breaking the inRP laws and getting away with it...

Now if the RHA is so butthurt on what is essentially a very minor and temporary incovenience, maybe they should consider RPing a bit more extensively than "gib money or die plox" next time.

[Sabru]

As someone who has previously led, and is still involved (to an extent) with, an official zoner faction i personally applaud @Champ (and any other GMs involved) for making this sensible, reasonable and understandable move that displays that actions have consequences.

I would also like to point out to other commenters that zoner FR5s are not as easy as other faction FR5s. They are, have been and will probably continue to be frankensteinian (with multiple personalities) endeavors just to get them together to request. first, as has been pointed out by Champ, the official zoner factions (as well as the prominent unofficial ones) are all different from each other (part of the inbuilt diversity of zonerdom). Thus some faction rights, FR5 mainly, are a more complex problem than most factions have to deal with.

this situation is simple and RP'ly explainable:
- RHA shoots zoner affiliated base right near FP1
- Zoners get angry and slam the proverbial door in their face for a period of time.
- base point provided as a chance for RHA to do some RP with zoners to work the situation out.

All GMs did is exercise their ability to enact temporary mechanics changes (ie rephacks) to convey the RP consequences of the RP and actions RHA took.

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[sajuuk111]

As someone who has previously led, and is still involved (to an extent) with, an official zoner faction i personally applaud @Champ (and any other GMs involved) for making this sensible, reasonable and understandable move that displays that actions have consequences.

I would also like to point out to other commenters that zoner FR5s are not as easy as other faction FR5s. They are, have been and will probably continue to be frankensteinian (with multiple personalities) endeavors just to get them together to request. first, as has been pointed out by Champ, the official zoner factions (as well as the prominent unofficial ones) are all different from each other (part of the inbuilt diversity of zonerdom). Thus some faction rights, FR5 mainly, are a more complex problem than most factions have to deal with.

this situation is simple and RP'ly explainable:
- RHA shoots zoner affiliated base right near FP1
- Zoners get angry and slam the proverbial door in their face for a period of time.
- base point provided as a chance for RHA to do some RP with zoners to work the situation out.

All GMs did is exercise their ability to enact temporary mechanics changes (ie rephacks) to convey the RP consequences of the RP and actions RHA took.

That's the problem.The "Administrator" of Freeport 1 was on the scene. Yet, GM made this call?

Then why do we have Freeport administrators?

[Shiki]

Just to clarify, if LN will siege illegal DSE IFF base, will similar consequences be applied? As in limit LN docking ability on DSE bases?

If you start implying that POB IFF matters, then I see a lot of things for GM to enforce. Unless, of course, this is not an action for this base or players involved specifically.

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[Hemlocke]

That's the problem.The "Administrator" of Freeport 1 was on the scene. Yet, GM made this call?

Then why do we have Freeport administrators?

It's just mob rule at this point, anything regarding someone sieging a POB is bad, so the indie that has had basically no roleplay took precedent over a person that has roleplayed the administrator of that station for an exceptionally long time now. Basically regardless of how much someone has done it all becomes meaningless if they don't pick the defenders side, even though nobody showed up to defend this station. Strangely, the POB's owner broke a bunch of rules, pretty sure I think it was 4 in less than a week and got a slap on the wrist, meanwhile the rules were amended and an FR5 (regardless of what the GMs want to call that, it's a god damn FR5, the only difference being that RHA and Zoners can't shoot each other, like in an FR5, so the combat aspect is missing, and it's just there to be annoying and make no sense.) was put in place supposedly "temporarily" until the Hessian faction "works it out" with the administrator of the station that didn't have a problem with it to begin with. Most likely because they resolved it the usual pirate way and demanded tax rather than straight up blowing it to pieces, which they ended up having to do anyway.

While Justin unironically claimed things were mob rule when people didn't agree with him, there is a bunch of people legitimately mobbing anyone that doesn't say Base Owned Players are a godsent centralized attraction to the mod, and the primary feature of the mod.

If you don't want your base being destroyed, don't make one, it has a health bar specifically so that it can be removed from existence, if you're too lazy to defend it, and too bullheaded and or lazy to pay out protection money, be it protection from the tax demander or anyone else, you should've thought about that before making the base. Especially considering that in a span of 1-2 hours, you can easily make 150mil, be it ore trading, sci-data mining, or mission running. It's a non issue.

Now I saw someone somewhere argue that bretonian ore bases don't make money and purely exist to help players, as ludicrous as that claim is, I'll use your logic then. So you made a POB for the sole purpose of helping out players, someone comes along and wants money from that base, offering to leave it alone if you pay, rather than straight up destroying it, which would indeed be a dick move. Because helping those players is no longer an automated task and you are inconvenienced does it become an issue, despite how easy paying 100mil in a month actually is, pricey? yeah sure, but these things are holding valuable ore, and they have easily more than 30k cargo, which is definitely more than 100mil.

Now before anyone says "You're all nothing but a bunch of filthy base siegers" and then turns around and declares sieges on other POBs, I've owned 4 separate POBs in my time here, they're ugly as piss, they're annoying to upkeep, they're time consuming, costly, pretty much all around pointless to have, and if you make one and you're too damn lazy to defend it, that's your own fault, don't go crying about "filthy base siegers" if you knew the risks when you made the base. 2 out of 4 of those bases were sieged cause I was too busy or lazy to defend it, I deserved that. The others died because I got sick of how much of my time they consumed. Now that's not to say that you're not allowed to enjoy POBs, good for you if you do, but if you're not willing or able to defend it, life happens, make a new one. I've both defended these abominations, and sieged these abominations, every interaction I've had with these has been horrid, they turn people against each other in a game of all things. Just chill out, you are literally crying over pixels. A good rule of thumb for not getting your POB sieged, don't put it within 10k of a damn station, that pisses pretty much everyone off.

Well then the next argument would be. "But muh roleplay", my answer to that is, I rarely see roleplay done in regards to a POB. The only POB I actively hate the existence of is FP12/ZoG using two different tags for the same faction to fly house shippers. But guess what, they can use that excuse because they actually roleplay actively with that station.

One more note in here. None of you cried when the IMG POB got ripped open in Tau-37 or any of the gallic POBs over the course of the war, hot take, because it had nothing to do with bretonian player assets.

le gasp

Conclusion, this is stupid and without the input of either the RHA faction or any of the what... 3 zoner official factions, or any of the what 5-6 factions in general, you made a decision on their behalf. Questionable at best.

As to what Sabru said, guess what, that's why GMs shouldn't go getting involved unless a faction with that ability is actually calling on them for action, because you get messes like this, and I'm pretty sure with OSI already being cool with it, Velvet not operating in that area, GRG being fairly dead, and with Phoenix not being official, it would've safely not had been an issue to begin with.