[RHA] Reputation Adjusted

[Sabru]

As someone who has previously led, and is still involved (to an extent) with, an official zoner faction i personally applaud @Champ (and any other GMs involved) for making this sensible, reasonable and understandable move that displays that actions have consequences.

I would also like to point out to other commenters that zoner FR5s are not as easy as other faction FR5s. They are, have been and will probably continue to be frankensteinian (with multiple personalities) endeavors just to get them together to request. first, as has been pointed out by Champ, the official zoner factions (as well as the prominent unofficial ones) are all different from each other (part of the inbuilt diversity of zonerdom). Thus some faction rights, FR5 mainly, are a more complex problem than most factions have to deal with.

this situation is simple and RP'ly explainable:
- RHA shoots zoner affiliated base right near FP1
- Zoners get angry and slam the proverbial door in their face for a period of time.
- base point provided as a chance for RHA to do some RP with zoners to work the situation out.

All GMs did is exercise their ability to enact temporary mechanics changes (ie rephacks) to convey the RP consequences of the RP and actions RHA took.

That's the problem.The "Administrator" of Freeport 1 was on the scene. Yet, GM made this call?

Then why do we have Freeport administrators?

As far as i can explain it, from my experience, they're the RP 'face' of freeports (when there is someone willing and able to take one on) and they usually would be the ones to handle the RP and issues surrounding their certain FP or base. If things cant be worked out through RP and requires an FR5, the one playing the FP admin then kicks it up the 'chain', so to speak, for the official factions to do the paperwork.

The system readily shows it's flaws though. more administrator characters have come and gone that who knows exactly how many have appeared over the years. By and large, they are effectively powerless outside of RP (and restricted even in RP generally) but they're an attempt to put an identifiable point of contact for other characters when matters concern a freeport.

It's not the best option but it's the only one to try and manage some sort of order to the complicated hodge podge that is the zoner meta-faction.

---

[Squad]

I'll re-iterate @Havok here:

In line with this quote from the original Post, I am reminding all parties to keep discussion and feedback civilized and relevant to the original post of the thread. Any further discussion beyond that, please start a thread in the General Discussions subforum.

Let's not resort to personal insults and criticism in relation to the thread topic.

---

[sajuuk111]

As someone who has previously led, and is still involved (to an extent) with, an official zoner faction i personally applaud @Champ (and any other GMs involved) for making this sensible, reasonable and understandable move that displays that actions have consequences.

I would also like to point out to other commenters that zoner FR5s are not as easy as other faction FR5s. They are, have been and will probably continue to be frankensteinian (with multiple personalities) endeavors just to get them together to request. first, as has been pointed out by Champ, the official zoner factions (as well as the prominent unofficial ones) are all different from each other (part of the inbuilt diversity of zonerdom). Thus some faction rights, FR5 mainly, are a more complex problem than most factions have to deal with.

this situation is simple and RP'ly explainable:
- RHA shoots zoner affiliated base right near FP1
- Zoners get angry and slam the proverbial door in their face for a period of time.
- base point provided as a chance for RHA to do some RP with zoners to work the situation out.

All GMs did is exercise their ability to enact temporary mechanics changes (ie rephacks) to convey the RP consequences of the RP and actions RHA took.

That's the problem.The "Administrator" of Freeport 1 was on the scene. Yet, GM made this call?

Then why do we have Freeport administrators?

As far as i can explain it, from my experience, they're the RP 'face' of freeports (when there is someone willing and able to take one on) and they usually would be the ones to handle the RP and issues surrounding their certain FP or base. If things cant be worked out through RP and requires an FR5, the one playing the FP admin then kicks it up the 'chain', so to speak, for the official factions to do the paperwork.

The system readily shows it's flaws though. more administrator characters have come and gone that who knows exactly how many have appeared over the years. By and large, they are effectively powerless outside of RP (and restricted even in RP generally) but they're an attempt to put an identifiable point of contact for other characters when matters concern a freeport.

It's not the best option but it's the only one to try and manage some sort of order to the complicated hodge podge that is the zoner meta-faction.

I'll bring in my personal issues here but,

I have tried a really interesting (at least the people that have interacted with me told) RP, and my RP required me to contact official zoners and acquire their permission. I have been cock-blocked instantly in every aspect when i tried that. They are pretty fast at declining requests from them, but they are non-existent when there's something they really need to login or hell even go to forums and do something about it.

Could the base saved? Absolutely not. The POB system is broken.
Could they at least revoke their docking rights from Freeport 1? Honestly, that should be the consequence of it. Demand a payment from RHA, hold their docking rights until they pay. Just like how they did to the PoB.

This game has become corrupted, and not necessarily *evil* with the power distributions. Some people hold a pretty influencive place in the hierarchy of factions but do nothing, some people are trying to do something but are actively blocked by these people. They are just there and occupying that seat.

I would've loved to be that administrator of Freeport. I could've done so many political things and negotiate with the Hessians really hard and I am sure just a semi-active player would feel the same way as well. It would make so many people happy that you get to RP your job.

A GM called for action, Freeport 1 Administrator is missing, Official Zoner factions are silent, and here we are. So, remind me again everyone, should we play the game or should we let GMs decide on the matters that a player should have done?
If that player is incompetent and inactive, get rid of him. If people are inactive get rid of them. Freeport 1 administrator did not step up, take him down and let's get a new one.

I mean hell the Freeport Administrator should've just drove the conversation and help out NoMe, which is clearly poor at English. It just screams incompetence.

[darkwind]

....

You're part of the problem.

Well, lets look close at your words

If you don't want your base being destroyed, don't make one, it has a health bar specifically so that it can be removed from existence, if you're too lazy to defend it, and too bullheaded and or lazy to pay out protection money, be it protection from the tax demander or anyone else, you should've thought about that before making the base.

So, NoMe had base inside protected Bretonia place, with one of second in might lawful forces at the server. At roleplay proper place for zoner base near zoner station.

Did it help him? No.

things are holding valuable ore, and they have easily more than 30k cargo,

Not every base exists to be ore holder and getting money from it. Not sure what was NoMe purpose behind it.

I've owned 4 separate POBs in my time here, they're ugly as piss, they're annoying to upkeep, they're time consuming, costly, pretty much all around pointless to have

It more looks like people who hated having PoB, 'help' in their f***** way to easy burden of other people, destroying their efforts.

if you make one and you're too damn lazy to defend it, that's your own fault, don't go crying about "filthy base siegers" if you knew the risks when you made the base. 2 out of 4 of those bases were sieged cause I was too busy or lazy to defend it, I deserved that. The others died because I got sick of how much of my time they consumed.

Defense of PoBs is just f***** up to give any proper chances for it being defended without resorting to 'Call sufficiently enough gank counter team' to demoralize attackers, with running like madman to get repair materials, which are usually quite far from place in most cases to have 3x regen.

but if you're not willing or able to defend it, life happens, make a new one

How are you supposed to defend against dedicated team of 20 dreadnoughts? They being destroyed, reappear again and spam themselves until pob dies. Defending fleet needs to have 24x7 online in considerably larger numbers to have enough online in whatever time attackers continue to spam.

3 zoner official factions, or any of the what 5-6 factions in general, you made a decision on their behalf. Questionable at best.

That's the only where I can agree with you, although bases being hard experience can agree too, because their mechanics is just f***** up to be playable in an enjoyable way in most cases. A path could be found though.

that's why GMs shouldn't go getting involved unless a faction with that ability is actually calling on them for action,

I think it shows them being at least not ignorant of the problem where some Rheinland pirates siege at the corner of their Zoi in different house to their 'lore', while lawfuls aren't allowed to do it, since it is not their House/House owned territory or other some weird reason.

Anyway, patiently waiting for some changes to happen, leveling the fields at rule / mechanics level.

[darkwind]

Yeeee..... Slappy should nuke this.

Oh, no, constructive critics.
Do you know that at least part of your 'siege everything' gank destroys with the noble goal to easy server FPS? I wonder will it be changed after relocated to new more powerful hardware.

Doubting, as everything is done for 'the greater good'.

Better just to have bases being able put back to some transporter with everything on it. Removed to NPC station, logged out and no problem there is. Hehe defenders are happy, attackers have no any reason to be not happy as it eliminates a lot of their goals for greater goods, except for bullies who want to destroy smth, just to feel having a change to a pixel world in their hands..

---

Interstellar	Autogit	Ctrl-V	Encryptor	Discovery At Linux
Dark Tools	DarkBot	DarkLint	DarkStat	DarkMap

[Hemlocke]

I posted that at the same time you posted yours darkwind, I didn't see it, do you love me or something? I must respectfully decline because I am betrothed to my irish garden gnome @"Darkstar_Spectre", but no, people are using words like "evil" now, which is I do believe to be the point of no return.

As to your "constructive criticism" every other word is bleeped by the forum's curse detector so it's highly unreadable, but I am aware fighting an entire fleet of siegers is fairly impossible if you don't have weapons platforms, which this base had a whopping 1 weapons platform. Though the entire fleet could've been avoiding by paying, which is again, ridiculously easy to do. Takes 1-2 hours out of your month.

[Hemlocke]

I'll bring in my personal issues here but,

I have tried a really interesting (at least the people that have interacted with me told) RP, and my RP required me to contact official zoners and acquire their permission. I have been cock-blocked instantly in every aspect when i tried that. They are pretty fast at declining requests from them, but they are non-existent when there's something they really need to login or hell even go to forums and do something about it.

Could the base saved? Absolutely not. The POB system is broken.
Could they at least revoke their docking rights from Freeport 1? Honestly, that should be the consequence of it. Demand a payment from RHA, hold their docking rights until they pay. Just like how they did to the PoB.

This game has become corrupted, and not necessarily *evil* with the power distributions. Some people hold a pretty influencive place in the hierarchy of factions but do nothing, some people are trying to do something but are actively blocked by these people. They are just there and occupying that seat.

I would've loved to be that administrator of Freeport. I could've done so many political things and negotiate with the Hessians really hard and I am sure just a semi-active player would feel the same way as well. It would make so many people happy that you get to RP your job.

A GM called for action, Freeport 1 Administrator is missing, Official Zoner factions are silent, and here we are. So, remind me again everyone, should we play the game or should we let GMs decide on the matters that a player should have done?
If that player is incompetent and inactive, get rid of him. If people are inactive get rid of them. Freeport 1 administrator did not step up, take him down and let's get a new one.

I mean hell the Freeport Administrator should've just drove the conversation and help out NoMe, which is clearly poor at English. It just screams incompetence.

See, Freeports have long existing relationships with the factions around them, in the case of this POB, it had a Zoner IFF, but no roleplay had ever been done for it, no zoner ships were seen especially not with how many times I've flown by it on that gold/aluminium route. The Administrator is only incompetent in your eyes because they've been there longer, put in far more effort than you have, and you don't agree with their decision. They were there witnessing the incident, overseeing it to make sure it posed no threat to the freeport directly. While that POB was inside the freeport, it is not the freeport.

Nobody's stopping you from roleplaying something that's already been taken and roleplayed quite well by another individual that is mostly inactive because zoners often aren't presented with anything to do. You can do that, most people will just not acknowledge the illegitimate admin that hasn't been agreed upon by the rest of the zoner playerbase. The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, you are the few and GMs shouldn't be forcing roleplay based off a single person that turned to a power coup when they were told that's not how the situation was going to be handled by the respective powers that be.

It was awhile back where I wished to roleplay the administrator of a freeport, to find out such administration was already handled by other players, I didn't go to the GMs, I didn't attempt a power coup. If the role is already filled you're being ludicrous and selfish by attempting to take it from another player that might not have as much time as you, but can still roleplay the character quite well. Again, this administrator was literally outside the freeport while this was happening, they handled it their way, because that is the station they administrate and behave accordingly based on what they deem the bigger threat to the people on board the freeport.

[Lusitano]

So ... one pob with Zoner IFF, that only benefits their owners and not the Zoner community, is shoot down in disrepect of the NFZ laws, that are constantly been violated in all FPs, and that factions receives one warning or something like this that looks like nobody understand, BUT ... Bretonia Armed Forces invaded Gran Canaria and it is all Ok chaps? where is the logic of this? One pob that is on hostile system, for the hessians, is a target like anyother that they already took down, but at least this time the owner could had avoid this if he had paid the hessians demands.

So .. first point ... this is pointless otherwise the Core and the Order would very red of so many NFZ violations on FP11, and also why such protection to one pob and nothing to a main base that was lost !!

[Hemlocke]

So ... one pob with Zoner IFF, that only benefits their owners and not the Zoner community, is shoot down in disrepect of the NFZ laws, that are constantly been violated in all FPs, and that factions receives one warning or something like this that looks like nobody understand, BUT ... Bretonia Armed Forces invaded Gran Canaria and it is all Ok chaps? where is the logic of this? One pob that is on hostile system, for the hessians, is a target like anyother that they already took down, but at least this time the owner could had avoid this if he had paid the hessians demands.

So .. first point ... this is pointless otherwise the Core and the Order would very red of so many NFZ violations on FP11, and also why such protection to one pob and nothing to a main base that was lost !!

You're failing to understand the politics behind the decision, which I don't blame you, I still don't really get it. It's basically only an issue solely because it was a POB and people didn't agree with how the Zoners handled a station that had a Zoner IFF but no actual Zoner roleplay, therefore just another POB using an IFF to attempt an avoidance of a siege.

Unfortunately, Zoners get bullied a hell of a lot in this game, so that kinda backfired.

[NoMe]

#hemlocke it has been fun to destroy my base, they cry now surprising isn't it

i bought this installation, 350 millions with the affirmation of all is ok with all

i lost in this affair, maybe more than 500 millions and they cry thhose extremist(i can't more)