No thx - I'm finding out more and more that it's more about the players (and well, admins to some extent) and not devs. Vanilla post campaign never even changed and people still played it. A lot. In single player.
I don't see a dev solution tho this really, it has to come from players to be willing to let new guys win from time to time.
And @Jeuge this is what people told me why they don't log as much - because they just get steamrolled constantly without getting successes along the way.
Lemon mentioned match-making, we could bring old connecticut, that all home-systems/factions can reach to this location, very big system(30k grid, bigger if possible) that with a short-time pvp-timer. like 5 or 10 minutes.
to make it more interesting, we can place double earning PvE zone mission locations that always send you the center. that will bring activity and a big oppurtunity around this area.
Jump holes entrances will be available to any class except transports
Jump holes exists will be usable each by specific faction (Like Nomad JHs in Iota)
System will have each faction station/structure in this system
(06-26-2021, 11:29 AM)Relation-Ship Wrote: Coup the devs lol xD
Every time there was a "coup" or "I'm taking my ball and going home" situation, the successors ended doing everything the same way their predecessors did. Who is dev or admin has never been about changing things for the better. It's always about control, ego, and conformity. Even when there was a "coup", it was long term staff removing other staff. So nothing really changed.
(06-26-2021, 11:29 AM)Relation-Ship Wrote: And @Jeuge this is what people told me why they don't log as much - because they just get steamrolled constantly without getting successes along the way.
And it has been like this since 4.85. The problem is that in 4.85, things were intentionally geared to drive new players off (as well as anyone not popular with staff, mostly because they weren't sycophantic enough), and the way of balancing fights (no compensating skill with numbers or gear! caps cant shoot snubs!) was one of the greatest tools in that. Others tools were:
- making rules hard to understand and overly complex
- stacking IDs which are not invite-only with restrictions that make them unattractive. Most of the invite-only factions disappeared when they were tarred and feathered by the community for their selfishness, but the crappyness of the other IDs stayed
- making lore almost invisible ingame so only the forum dwellers could enjoy it
- providing little to no help for learning game and combat mechanics
- only processing rule violation reports of people friendly with staff
- sticking noobs into an isolated and boring region where they hide in a nebula instead of "bothering the pros" with the noobiness
- generally catering to conforming vets instead of noobs or critical thinkers in every aspect of the game and community
Because staff was always populated with people who conformed to all that and were either incapable of understanding it as a problem or wanted to conform above everything else, very little of this got changed. There were hundreds of people who pointed out all of these problems for 10+ years (hello), but ignoring or censoring/banning them just became another ritual that staff members must conform to so they can "fit in", which you can add to the list. The most common excuse for keeping everything as is was this: "but the biggest problem is that Freelancer is an old game, and problem X is only a small problem, so lets do nothing about it". But there is not 1 problem X, there are more than 20, all of which make a small impact when fixed, which would make a larger impact when combined.
But even if you wrote a book about it with pictures that even children should be able to understand, the kinds of people that managed to grasp a little bit of "power" by conforming to all the stupidity and nastiness of disco still wouldnt change anything for the better because of ego and peer pressure issues. And god forbid they permitted someone else fix to things, letting others succeed where they failed, that would be the worst of all.
Posts: 873
Threads: 73
Joined: May 2020
Staff roles: Story Developer
New guys don't leave because they get stomped in PvP. New guys leave, because this server is advertised as RP server, yet when they try it ingame - they get shamed or get stuck with some character/ID which has interesting faction, but has nothing to do ingame besides getting stomped. Or they join some faction Discord and their interest in game is killed by vets who rant how Disco is bad and how they would be better off with playing other games.
My friends who came with me in here a year ago were really enthusiastic about this game, yet their interest ran out when they were basically forced to play 'NPCs' over and over again.
I remember times when aces were laughing on other aces for shooting on noobs. But I don't remember how we lost that. It was gone when first one of us said: Let's meme this or that group of retarded noobs.
I also remember it was hard to join some battle after it started already. Blue messages were on both sides. Now it's easy. Join ones that are winning, cuz why not. Meme fukin' loosers. Meme them until they go play something else.
Cuz ruining is so cool.
Try to build something just to be stoned by unhappy players. Building suks.
Posts: 6,312
Threads: 489
Joined: Nov 2014
Staff roles: Art Developer
(06-26-2021, 12:05 PM)Erremnart Wrote: New guys don't leave because they get stomped in PvP. New guys leave, because this server is advertised as RP server, yet when they try it ingame - they get shamed or get stuck with some character/ID which has interesting faction, but has nothing to do ingame besides getting stomped. Or they join some faction Discord and their interest in game is killed by vets who rant how Disco is bad and how they would be better off with playing other games.
My friends who came with me in here a year ago were really enthusiastic about this game, yet their interest ran out when they were basically forced to play 'NPCs' over and over again.
Right?
People need to stop chimping out and deciding what people's opinions are and what they're allowed to have fun with or not. We're allowed to enjoy the game, even if population is declining and that there's less stuff to do.
(06-26-2021, 12:05 PM)Erremnart Wrote: New guys don't leave because they get stomped in PvP. New guys leave, because this server is advertised as RP server, yet when they try it ingame - they get shamed or get stuck with some character/ID which has interesting faction, but has nothing to do ingame besides getting stomped. Or they join some faction Discord and their interest in game is killed by vets who rant how Disco is bad and how they would be better off with playing other games.
My friends who came with me in here a year ago were really enthusiastic about this game, yet their interest ran out when they were basically forced to play 'NPCs' over and over again.
Boosting the signal.
On that note, there's something that is repeated fairly often that makes me raise an eyebrow - where are the topics of people crying on the forums about getting stomped in PvP? I've been here about a month and a half and I can't seem to recall any such topic...
We just left instead of bitching about it. It's not worth it at this point.
It's not even about wins and losses, either. I don't mind getting my butt kicked, some of the best RP/fun I've had has been through L's. It's the aces that log in, no RP kill, and get the bounty board which has driven me and a lot of other people away to do other things. I've only been logging lately to help a friend.
I hope that either all of us or none of us are judged by the actions of our weakest moments. But rather, by the strength we show when, and if, we're ever given a second chance.
Pretty much - I see it a lot, newer guys log, then they find out how they get stomped fast with little RP - they don't make any fuss on the forums, they just appear less and less until they don't log at all.
(06-26-2021, 12:46 PM)Racerdude Wrote: We just left instead of ***** about it. It's not worth it at this point.
It's not even about wins and losses, either. I don't mind getting my butt kicked, some of the best RP/fun I've had has been through L's. It's the aces that log in, no RP kill, and get the bounty board which has driven me and a lot of other people away to do other things. I've only been logging lately to help a friend.
Yeah. Most new people don't post on the forum, and what are they going to do? Half of the people steamrolling them have yellow, green, or orange names here.
I don't mind getting my butt kicked either, and while always losing was not much fun for the numerous people I tried to recruit and train (I stopped doing that more than a year ago because it amounted to turning them into cannon fodder), the worst part was always the constant bickering of those who were killing us, before, during, and after the fights, and later on discord.
The "RP" of the goon squads almost exclusively consisted of saying we were crappy pilots for not winning, cowards for not fighting them on terms where we were sure to lose, and "gankers" for defending ourselves or our route/mining ground with greater numbers or ships class, even while we were losing.
On discord, they later posted incomplete logs claiming we were attacking without RP, little RP, or that we "ganked them with caps or numbers" in fights where we all died and they didnt lose 1 guy.
And when I posted the full chat logs and gave the full picture of what happened, guess what happened next. (yeah. censored and banned.)
One guy, who tells people that I am horrible for telling caps on my team to shoot enemy snubs, (while I was getting shot at by enemy caps on my snub while I was typing, in a fight were were losing), also prided himself with instakilling 3 snubs with his cruiser in another fight, which he won. That's disco.
And yeah, what people say on discord does matter ingame. It makes people "Punish" factions including new members that just got here for their "bad behaviour".
For example I and others get blown while typing and stopping to RP "because your faction never RPs". Another time someone I had literally never met merrily flew up to my POB kept triggering the shield, "RPing" "haha look at all that fuel being wasted you horrible person" later telling me how they are surprised I even talked to them and how they are so open minded to even talk to me after all the horrible things people told them on discord.
![[Image: 3tN2x9Z.png]](http://i.imgur.com/3tN2x9Z.png)
![[Image: kauket.gif]](https://sig.grumpybumpers.com/host/kauket.gif)
