Rights lists

[JakeSG]

Because every single given situation can have a judgement made upon it before it has occurred. I'm sure the Admin's would appreciate having more work thrust upon them, especially on such a scale. It would be far easier to simply contact leaders within the target area.

As a side note, in most Houses there are leaders outside of the factions. I know the Outcast Dons and Corsair Elders aren't all from within their own factions, for example. A number of them are independents. And I've never heard of the dhammapada.

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For the Core.

[Exsiled_one]

Corsair elders are from OPG, Benitez and one independent. I dont get what you mean?

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<span style="color:#33CC00">I AM GIVING AWAY MONEY TO CREATIVE MINDS*</span>

[arvg]

the DP is Buddhist scripture.

You have never even heard of it, let alone know what it says, and yet what is in it can be considered common-sense teachings.

This is exactly my point, you go to a foreign Country you aren't expected to automatically know the laws, you are given a primer, and the opportunity to look it up.

I am not saying that every situation needs a decision, but there must be a higher authority in this than the Faction heads. They should not be the last word in matters of RP, that just simply isn't right. There must be a place to appeal, and to have serious matters decided on that is apart from the Factions control.

I am hardly saying that factions should have no say, nor that they shouldn't be informed. I am just saying final authority they should not be.

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[jammi]

Now what happens when two factions have similar claims?

again Bretonian Royal family, BAF and the Constabulary...? Who Adjudicates that, how is it decided?

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Edit= I could go so far as to point to Gran Canaria, which has two separate and unrelated factions laying claim to it.

That's actually a good question. That had been settled before I had gotten on the server. Now there was once a Molly group who RPd that they had the "true" King of Bretonnia within their ranks. Now, of course, in-game none of his declarations would be fulfilled by any Bret lawful but it served as the motivator for conflicts between the "Kings Men" and Bretonian authorities.

With this, Bretonia has a fully functioning player government. It predates the Outcast Commonwealth and is more effective than the Corsair Elders (in my opinion). There are players who represent minister of the government, and decisions regarding Bretonia's Cannon RP are made as a collective in our Skype chat. Of course, sometimes cannon RP is thrust upon us, so we just choose the direction we'll take in regards to this.

The Government itself includes the BAF, BPA, BMM, Bowex, Gateway and Planetform first and second in command as well as the various Ministers (who may or may not be the previous faction's first and second in command). Induviduals who have taken great expense to improve Bretonia may also be admitted, which is where indys become involved.

As for the Molly group, that was King George's revolutionaries. That was an interesting plot line, which ended with Mountbatten discovering that his father had planted false evidence about his heritage in the Cambridge genealogy records. George Mountbatten is currently the Prime Minister of Bretonia (played by Capt. Morgan). That's also a long story.

As for Gran Canaria, it's currently in a sort of political war between Bretonia, the Zoners, the Corsairs and other interested parties.

As for the indys in the government groups, I'd say these form pseudo-factions that should be given the rights as regular factions. After all, the Zoners have two threads in the Message Dump areas, which are considered a privilege for official factions. They should either be moved out or other governments should be allowed their own threads to be there too.

But then, this is majorly off topic.

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[eyvind]

If we are to follow the course of detailing rights, there is every reason to be complete about it. I may be a factionlancer -- now with 90% less freelancing -- but Discovery is just as much about unaffiliated and independent characters as it is about factions. There's little sense in arguing against that. If it isn't apparently true, then it's due to the lack of explicit support of independent characters.

The rights of unaffiliated players should be dead simple and fundamental, on the philosophical level of the American Bill of Rights. It should not be an extensive and precisely-defined list of duties and responsibilities attached to rights, such a document would serve little purpose. People need to be on the same page when it comes to what rights their fellow players and themselves have in the game world, but there should be some room for individual interpretation. Some level of interpretation is unavoidable and people-rights carry varying interpretations by nature.

Let me rephrase that -- without actually going back and rewriting: I think there should be rights common among all players, not specifically to independent characters.

I don't think these rights should be drafted by the admins, they should be put together -- likely over considerably time -- by the community and eventually elevated to supreme status by the community, accommodated by the admins.

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[Dab]

Avrg, you're asking for us to write down each and every single thing a player can do, a player can't do, a faction can do, and a faction can't do.. Do you realize that'll pretty much be a year-long project that the admins would have to do, who are already strapped for time? Especially when, as Jake said, most of those can be covered by common sense?

Really, this is completely unnecessary. Read the faction's backgrounds, goals, and the associated player factions backgrounds and goals. There you will find everything you need to make sure you're not breaking some faction law.

You're looking at this from a black-and-white standpoint and then demanding that someone give you this list, without considering the amount of work it would involve for a rather small return.

I personally would say it is a player's responsibility to find out what he is allowed and unallowed to do in these situations. If he doesn't know, then he doesn't know enough of the NPC faction roleplay to be using a character affiliated with it. We don't need to be holding everyone's hand while they play Discovery. They need to learn to do some of this on their own and act responsibly and appropriately.

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[arvg]

Seems the community just did exactly that for Faction rights, why then, is it so hard to consolidate into a guideline what players rights should be?

I don't want everything in black and white. But what I want is these "unwritten rules" written down and accessible.

Otherwise they are nothing more than suggestions buried in forums under mountains of other stuff.

No, you want to stop problems, stop headaches and stop things from happening outside of your purview, then write them down.

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[Dab]

Seems the community just did exactly that for Faction rights, why then, is it so hard to consolidate into a guideline what players rights should be?

We gave 5 guidelines for factions, as they were the most controversial and rule-oriented. We did not make a total and comprehensive list of what factions can and can't do. Five compared to hundreds.

I don't want everything in black and white. But what I want is these "unwritten rules" written down and accessible.

What unwritten rules? You've really not given us anything beyond 'player rights.'

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[arvg]

umm... have you not read the whole thread Dab?

This is about more than Faction rights.

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[Dab]

Which is why I asked you, what player rights are you looking for us to write down? What 'unwritten rights' are you looking for us to write down? You've called for it, but you won't tell us what you really want.

I've read the entire thread, you're avoiding my question.

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