I would consider them Corsairs just like any other, mostly. If some of them are there out of choice to *not* serve the empire and retreat from it all, then they can be judged on an individual basis without bringing that label to the entire community that exists there. Just because they're living (with permission, I assume) on a planet under the jurisdiction of the Zoners it doesn't immediately cut them off from the empire. You could argue it's little different from living on a far-away station, say, Rhodes Shipyard - It's entirely likely that some of the population there may not have ever set foot on Crete either. A little doubtful generally, but there'd always be a few people in any culture who've been born and raised on space stations or, in this case, a colony on Gran Canaria.
Right now, in the midst of this hostility between the two factions, I'd assume the position of these Corsairs is a little uncertain. I'd briefly toyed with the idea of shipping Light Arms or medical supplies etc there (and/or refugees/passengers out) to support this notion, but figured that fuelling conflict on GC is pretty counter-productive in the larger scheme of things. While some Zoners seem so eager to fight, I would think that IC just as many would want a peaceful resolution; I wasn't about to threaten that by creating tension on another front.
As for Nommies pewpew'ing the planet... I hope not! It's a nice gem amidst the rest of the Omegas. If anything tweak the Lore, but removing the planet altogether seems like a bigger negative impact than just leaving it as is D:
' Wrote:Warning - Zelot's post may contain humour...no links required!
But on topic - IF the situation with the ZOners vs. Corsairs continues - then war generally means internment of hostile foreign persons.
This could shift the focus of the conflict from the Freeports to GC. Its interesting - how much can the Corsairs spare in terms of RP resources to protect those people. Sure, they could send a fleet to smash everything up - but they cant do that if their bretheren are scattered among the Zoner facilites.
Not only that, but GC is a planet, able to station far larger forces than a Freeport. GC is also a lot further out, meaning and Corsair strike force risks being intercepted.
And if the Corsairs were to send overwhelming force - just how much would it leave their main front exposed to the Outcasts?
Finally, peace-loving, beatnik Zoners or not - if the Corsair minority on GC wants to resist being treated as hostages - history shows what happens to such attempts...
Wow, it used to be that people around here knew when I was making a joke. Go figure. The whole Corsairs GC thing is a great little intellectual discussion, we have a minority group that comes from a militant culture and a dominant group that comes from a more passive culture. Make whatever connections you like, but I would think it could be interesting. Here is the problem, this is all happening on a planet, it wont be played out in space like everything else we do here, at least for the most part it wont. This would be pretty much all Forum bases, which unfortunately means death to most ideas that its tried with.
But alright, lets they they are corsairs at some point. How about their offsprings? Are they concidered corsairs or just some kind of settlers of GC? How do zoners watch at them? Now they most likely do not have any goverment there, so I imagine there is few diffrent colonies up there. Similiar to now day countries and goverments or not. Do zoners have some sort of authority over corsair settlers there or don't?
There is a lot of questions and little answers concerning this issue.
If there is no zoner authority of corsair settlers and other settlers in genertal how come then zoners claim that planet to be theirs?
Now there might be an answer that all settlers fallows zoner way of life, but can such a corsair who lives like zoner be concidered a corsair? I would call that zoner of corsair origin that's it. Afterall a lot of zoners didn't born ones.
The way I have always envisioned it, is that there is a Corsair "Enclave" somewhere away from the urbanized area of GC. This is the main area of population among the Corsairs. In this enclave, the Corsairs create their own local government, take care of their own business, and generally control their daily lives, and keep closely to the Corsair traditions.
There are also Corsairs living in the City, representing Corsair interests there, making arraignments at the spaceport to transfer goods and food from the Corsair enclave to Corsair ships headed for Crete. These urban Corsairs also probably run other businesses in the City, but have no governmental and very little political power in the community there.
Heres another thinker for you, it's an idea I had quite a long time ago, and unsurprisingly, it has come up again. If the Corsairs and Zoners are to stay somewhat hostile, I cant imagine the Zoners massacring the GC Corsairs, and at this point, uprooting the Corsair enclave would be a long and hard effort. I thought a good way to deal with this opposing, divided population would be a second docking ring on GC, one Zoner controlled docking ring, and one Corsair controlled docking ring.
' Wrote:The way I have always envisioned it, is that there is a Corsair "Enclave" somewhere away from the urbanized area of GC. This is the main area of population among the Corsairs. In this enclave, the Corsairs create their own local government, take care of their own business, and generally control their daily lives, and keep closely to the Corsair traditions.
There are also Corsairs living in the City, representing Corsair interests there, making arraignments at the spaceport to transfer goods and food from the Corsair enclave to Corsair ships headed for Crete. These urban Corsairs also probably run other businesses in the City, but have no governmental and very little political power in the community there.
Heres another thinker for you, it's an idea I had quite a long time ago, and unsurprisingly, it has come up again. If the Corsairs and Zoners are to stay somewhat hostile, I cant imagine the Zoners massacring the GC Corsairs, and at this point, uprooting the Corsair enclave would be a long and hard effort. I thought a good way to deal with this opposing, divided population would be a second docking ring on GC, one Zoner controlled docking ring, and one Corsair controlled docking ring.
By the gods! Could it be that Freelancer might actually see a planet divided into more than one socio-political entity?
Whatever shall we call such an aberration?
A country, Sirius hasnt seen one of those for centuries! Didnt you know that each planet is supposed to be completely homogeneous politically and culturally?
Sairs, Nice try, but Gran Canaria is a world Zoner ... we are Pacifists not idiots. Our form of government is: there is a problem, specialists found a solution (usually without killing anyone). Your compatriots in Gran Canaria behave as Zoners or they take the first direct flight to Crete.
Do not live in a ghetto but there does not force anyone to abandon their culture.
Neither of them are hostages and there is none in prison. If they want to return to your "Empire" can do it whenever they want and, of course, will not pay for the crimes of others.
' Wrote:Sairs, Nice try, but Gran Canaria is a world Zoner ... we are Pacifists not idiots. Our form of government is: there is a problem, specialists found a solution (usually without killing anyone). Your compatriots in Gran Canaria behave as Zoners or they take the first direct flight to Crete.
Do not live in a ghetto but there does not force anyone to abandon their culture.
Neither of them are hostages and there is none in prison. If they want to return to your "Empire" can do it whenever they want and, of course, will not pay for the crimes of others.
Ive never seen it as black and white as this, or some of the other points from Corsair players either.
You have a planet with two sizable groups of people on it, Zoners in the Majority, Corsairs in the minority. But this is a planet that is a lot more fertile than Crete - a planet which folks often Role Play as having a substantial number of poorer citizens - which probably would attract migrants quite well. The Elders of Crete would pay lip service to the traditions of the Corsairs such as the initiation in the Malvada cloud etc. Yet, coming from a planet that has A) An increasing population and B) a lack of food I suspect the good Elders would have been subtly encouraging some of the poorer riff-raff to head on down to GC whenever possible.
These people would - as minorities often do - remain staunch and stubborn supporters of the people and culture they have left behind - but they wouldn't (for the most part) be idiots.
GC is their home. So you would probably see a multi-faceted approach by the Corsairs there, some would be quite entwined with the Zoners and working with them to ensure that everyone gets along, others - more militant - would probably cause problems in the event of a conflict. Others - the more pragmatic - would keep the appearance of obeying Zoner law and secretly do the opposite. And probably there would another group - perhaps some of the poorest of the poor from Crete - who actually like what they have on GC, dont want to screw it up and so don't get involved.
Personally I've always seen the planet as important to the Corsairs for a number of reasons: As a base against Dublin its (literally) Gold. It does produce food and is relatively easily accessible to the Corsairs, Its also a dumping ground for migrants.
In Corsair/Zoner relations though its both a curse and a blessing, depending on how players want to approach it.
' Wrote:By the gods! Could it be that Freelancer might actually see a planet divided into more than one socio-political entity?
Whatever shall we call such an aberration?
A country, Sirius hasnt seen one of those for centuries! Didnt you know that each planet is supposed to be completely homogeneous politically and culturally?
;)
I cant ever tell whether you like something I say or dislike it.
It might sound harsh - but a lot of this airy-fairy talk of pacifism ignores the truth of history.
In times of conflict, people look for scapegoats - people to blame. Crete is light years away for the man or woman, or community. There are also strategic reasons to target such minorities. Members of the group might be perceived as spies. The state may covertly endorse harassment of the minority group in order to exert political pressure on the hostile power.
Do people not read the news?
Remember the wars?
Remember the vilification of Arabs during the Gulf Wars?
The treatment of 'slopes' during Vietnam?
Remember the internment of Japanese-American citizens (yes thats right - full citizens not just foreign nationals) during WW2?
During times of conflict - minorities are a guaranteed target.
No we cant play out street riots and killings on a planet in-game.
Yes GC could play a much more important socio-political role in terms of Corsair-Zoner diplomacy.
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