Binski, knock it off already, you stubborn man. Nobody but you wants your system.
And on to the points in the OP, as they all seem great to me but most of it is already quite successfully employed. If nothing else, something's got to be done to incentivise piracy, as that have long been a very underappreciated niche, for a few reasons, too. Improvements have been made for sure as there is now few more choke points but all in all, what a pirate can get from a trader during that encounter is, frankly, quite limited and not just by the rules or game mechanics but by... stereotypic approach. And even then, piracy, cargo or otherwise, is by far not as profitable as powertrading.
Add a minuscule chance of an actual encounter to that, and there's your formula of basically no incentive for a pirate to exist when there's a relatively cheaper solution that promises much greater profits and pays off in less than two hours. Something encouraging people to take up on that activity I'd be happy to see, as well as some actual corporate rivalry outside of House space.
Peace, being the distant dream it is, comes inevitably, and goes hand in hand with justice.
Cursed be the war.
I realized caring about pixels or Disco in any way but fun and the friends you make is hilariously absurd. And I can make good money IRL with the same effort I've put into organizing the big successful events I've worked on. Every single staff member in the last few years who focused on events burnt out and quit Disco sooner or later too.
Events are fine, they've all been well attended if designed well with current tools, these ideas can make them better but the difference will be only slight in the resulting attendance numbers. What is needed is people crazy enough to take the thankless events organizing/facilitating job. Which I would not recommend to anyone.
(08-14-2022, 06:38 AM)Relation-Ship Wrote: I realized caring about pixels or Disco in any way but fun and the friends you make is hilariously absurd. And I can make good money IRL with the same effort I've put into organizing the big successful events I've worked on. Every single staff member in the last few years who focused on events burnt out and quit Disco sooner or later too.
Events are fine, they've all been well attended if designed well with current tools, these ideas can make them better but the difference will be only slight in the resulting attendance numbers. What is needed is people crazy enough to take the thankless events organizing/facilitating job.
Pretty much what Lemon said.
Pixels and making Disco your priority is a very good way of making you miserable and making you end up playing this game out of spite rather than enjoyment.
Events are fine and really are the lifeblood of planned, organized, attendance on Discovery while providing interesting stuff to do for everyone involved, virtually regardless of the story behind it.
Ah yes, let the Outcasts siege Newark to make it an Outcast base.
RP/10
In the majority of cases, it wouldn't make any sort of RP sense for an unlawful organization to assault any but the farthest outlying stations due to the lawful forces being able to deploy crushing reinforcements. You must keep in mind that while the Outcasts have a sizeable presence in the far north Omicrons and the Taus, their physical presence in the Houses is negligible, save for the borders of maybe Gallia, Kusari and Bretonia.
The Rogues from an RP standpoint have the facilities to field one or two destroyers, that's it. The Xenos can't even maintain their snubs, let alone capital ships. Their total population is under 15,000.
In Kusari, the Dragons have one or two scrapheaps known as Togos in service, not nearly enough to threaten really anything in Kusari for any period of time. The GC might be able to disrupt supply lines to a station for a couple of days by using clouds for cover, but ultimately, they'd get roflstomped by KNF.
In Bretonia, well, they do have the single weakest military out of all of the houses at the moment, but even so, it would take a coordinated effort from the Corsairs and other local criminals to be any threat inside of House space. They might be able to take Sprague, but that's it.
In Rheinland, you have an interesting clusterf*ck. Hessians and Coalition on one side, Corsairs on another and then the Unioners over there doing their own thing. Hessians, with a sizeable navy of their own could probably take over Kruger's operations in Omega-7 and Daumann's in Omega-11. Would they be able to hold them, not a chance.
Nobody cares about Gallia and I know absolutely piss all about it so I'm not going to dive into that.
So, in closing, your system doesn't make any sense from an RP and lore perspective and poses no real benefit to anyone other than established players who have no lives. We've done a siege event in the past, it was mediocre at best. There was a ton of drama from all sides and ended up with Shooter going to the people on the Outcast side saying something to the effect of 'make it quick'. One side overpowers the other and it becomes unfun for everyone.
(08-14-2022, 06:44 AM)Greylock Wrote: Ah yes, let the Outcasts siege Newark to make it an Outcast base.
RP/10
So, in closing, your system doesn't make any sense from an RP and lore perspective and poses no real benefit to anyone other than established players who have no lives. We've done a siege event in the past, it was mediocre at best. There was a ton of drama from all sides and ended up with Shooter going to the people on the Outcast side saying something to the effect of 'make it quick'. One side overpowers the other and it becomes unfun for everyone.
But there are no possible solutions? Change the ID. Honestly, do you think any Outcast OF right now could take Newark if it were attackable with 800 million HP within 7 days? INRP it doesn't happen because it can't. Switch to a system, and its the same thing. Think of the defense arrays there, the proximity of allied ships, etc. Besides, after some time to think about their choices, it would probably be a better gamble of 1500 scidata units to try a less secure location that also would qualify, or a Corsair base elsewhere. Could the OC's even try if they were also under attack by Corsairs in the Omicrons?
Or just pass a sub-rule saying no OC sieges inside house space, so only the rogues would really be likely to do much inside Liberty, and the NY area would not likely be at risk much. The excuse of drama is as weak as it gets, and these games were always at the mercy of those with the most time to put into it. Open it up, and more people with time and interest would see stuff going on here, and play here more.
Whatever your grievance with the system, it can be adjusted. "Drama" being a reason to avoid using this game to play the game is just an excuse, it was never done right or fair. There's no drama to an empty server? No drama from forced story changes? Removed bases? Greylock I would think you would stand to benefit greatly from such a system. Let the Rogues regularly try to capture Pittsburg, or Houston. They can only try with cruisers, and with a huge scidata expense, it can only happen once in a while. But being able to plan on their part, and you guys needing to really pay attention to what they're doing (buying or mining scidata), would liven up the flow here big time. If you don't have the time, how about letting those that do take priority.
You think that if people checking out this mod, or used to play, hear that factions can invoke their own sieges to build up their holdings, fight for territory, they wouldn't want to come check it out? You guys need to stop thinking from the bias of players and look at the game from an impartial outside perspective. By not supporting more, you support keeping the place dead. At this point, everyone should be willing to try whatever it takes to keep it alive here, or it really is over.
(08-14-2022, 06:44 AM)Greylock Wrote: Ah yes, let the Outcasts siege Newark to make it an Outcast base.
RP/10
So, in closing, your system doesn't make any sense from an RP and lore perspective and poses no real benefit to anyone other than established players who have no lives. We've done a siege event in the past, it was mediocre at best. There was a ton of drama from all sides and ended up with Shooter going to the people on the Outcast side saying something to the effect of 'make it quick'. One side overpowers the other and it becomes unfun for everyone.
But there are no possible solutions? Change the ID. Honestly, do you think any Outcast OF right now could take Newark if it were attackable with 800 million HP within 7 days? INRP it doesn't happen because it can't. Switch to a system, and its the same thing. Think of the defense arrays there, the proximity of allied ships, etc. Besides, after some time to think about their choices, it would probably be a better gamble of 1500 scidata units to try a less secure location that also would qualify, or a Corsair base elsewhere. Could the OC's even try if they were also under attack by Corsairs in the Omicrons?
Or just pass a sub-rule saying no OC sieges inside house space, so only the rogues would really be likely to do much inside Liberty, and the NY area would not likely be at risk much. The excuse of drama is as weak as it gets, and these games were always at the mercy of those with the most time to put into it. Open it up, and more people with time and interest would see stuff going on here, and play here more.
Whatever your grievance with the system, it can be adjusted. "Drama" being a reason to avoid using this game to play the game is just an excuse, it was never done right or fair. There's no drama to an empty server? No drama from forced story changes? Removed bases? Greylock I would think you would stand to benefit greatly from such a system. Let the Rogues regularly try to capture Pittsburg, or Houston. They can only try with cruisers, and with a huge scidata expense, it can only happen once in a while. But being able to plan on their part, and you guys needing to really pay attention to what they're doing (buying or mining scidata), would liven up the flow here big time. If you don't have the time, how about letting those that do take priority.
You think that if people checking out this mod, or used to play, hear that factions can invoke their own sieges to build up their holdings, fight for territory, they wouldn't want to come check it out? You guys need to stop thinking from the bias of players and look at the game from an impartial outside perspective. By not supporting more, you support keeping the place dead. At this point, everyone should be willing to try whatever it takes to keep it alive here, or it really is over.
The point of Greylock is that regardless of how they try, neither LR, nor OC, nor their forces combined cannot take anything in a capitol system of Liberty or any other House. Imagine Honduras suddenly buddying up with Nicaragua and Costa Rica to attack the US. Would be a spectacular sight to behold. It just doesn't make sense for OC or any other unlawful organisation to capture anything from a House unless it is some remote listening outpost. It doesn't make any inRP sense and breaks the immersion. I for sure won't participate in anything like that bcs I play for RP not for shitty C&C style RTS base vs base. I have other games for that.
They're great. All of them tbh. Looking at past events, quite a lot of them could have been optimized if we had such code in the plugin already. Looking forward to see some (especially ship class restricted bonuses and the vendetta bonus) in play.
(08-14-2022, 08:27 AM)Shimamori Wrote: The point of Greylock is that regardless of how they try, neither LR, nor OC, nor their forces combined cannot take anything in a capitol system of Liberty or any other House. Imagine Honduras suddenly buddying up with Nicaragua and Costa Rica to attack the US. Would be a spectacular sight to behold. It just doesn't make sense for OC or any other unlawful organisation to capture anything from a House unless it is some remote listening outpost. It doesn't make any inRP sense and breaks the immersion. I for sure won't participate in anything like that bcs I play for RP not for ***** C&C style RTS base vs base. I have other games for that.
Right but again, we could set the system to excempt certain combinations. Not a big deal. Besides, if OC's are like Honduras/Costa Rica/Nicaragua, why do they have battleships, and ZOI inside Liberty? By that argument, the ID is OP. So which is wrong, letting the ID be OP, or the suggested siege system?
To me, it breaks immersion to tell players they can't try, or make oorp changes to bases and systems with fixed story. If you only want to RP, then fine, just do that, but there is Dungeons & Dragons for those who can't handle the pvp aspect of the video game. I wince at that argument, I never hear you complain about the lack of closed roleplay, 1 hour respawn timer, fixed outcomes to events, that all kill immersion here.
Everyone ask yourself; how many credits have you earned in the last 6 months? How many have you spent? Many many ships over 500 mil have you bought in the last 6 months? How many pieces of equipment over 250 mil have you bought in the last 6 months? How often do you use those ships and equipment? I'm at zero across the board because there is no need for any of it. This is Freelancer, not D&D, and we have a habit of hiding behind the RP shield to avoid stuff... when a system does nothing but add more real causes for real interactions and real rp.
(08-14-2022, 08:27 AM)Shimamori Wrote: The point of Greylock is that regardless of how they try, neither LR, nor OC, nor their forces combined cannot take anything in a capitol system of Liberty or any other House. Imagine Honduras suddenly buddying up with Nicaragua and Costa Rica to attack the US. Would be a spectacular sight to behold. It just doesn't make sense for OC or any other unlawful organisation to capture anything from a House unless it is some remote listening outpost. It doesn't make any inRP sense and breaks the immersion. I for sure won't participate in anything like that bcs I play for RP not for ***** C&C style RTS base vs base. I have other games for that.
Right but again, we could set the system to excempt certain combinations. Not a big deal. Besides, if OC's are like Honduras/Costa Rica/Nicaragua, why do they have battleships, and ZOI inside Liberty? By that argument, the ID is OP. So which is wrong, letting the ID be OP, or the suggested siege system?
To me, it breaks immersion to tell players they can't try, or make oorp changes to bases and systems with fixed story. If you only want to RP, then fine, just do that, but there is Dungeons & Dragons for those who can't handle the pvp aspect of the video game. I wince at that argument, I never hear you complain about the lack of closed roleplay, 1 hour respawn timer, fixed outcomes to events, that all kill immersion here.
Everyone ask yourself; how many credits have you earned in the last 6 months? How many have you spent? Many many ships over 500 mil have you bought in the last 6 months? How many pieces of equipment over 250 mil have you bought in the last 6 months? How often do you use those ships and equipment? I'm at zero across the board because there is no need for any of it. This is Freelancer, not D&D, and we have a habit of hiding behind the RP shield to avoid stuff... when a system does nothing but add more real causes for real interactions and real rp.
It is exactly because I care about RP that I disagree with you. Ok, the OC have ZOI in Liberty. ZOI is ooRP rules regulation and inRP representation of the regions of operation (do not confuse it with conquest). Your mentioning ZOI and having BS as arguments related to RP are quite laughable. Now look at the confrontation of the OC vs Liberty from the point of view of socio-political-economic situation: a few OC battleships far away from home with extremely stretched supply lines and limited support of the local allies are put against an absolute beast of a powerhouse of Liberty with multiple fleets of many battleships/battlecruisers/cruisers, etc, excellent supply lines at home, strong economy to support them with food/repairs/etc, know-how and expertise. Liberty can literally wipe any OC "fleet" out of existence if the OC show up openly in New York. The only chance for someone to breach in NY successfully is another House and even then it will suffer from supply lines and fighting at home of Liberty, so probably only an alliance of Houses can succeed there. Thus, it is just ridiculous to offer a system that would make an attack of OC on Newark possible if one cares about the RP. This is not "real" RP like you say, this is some Twilight fan-fiction level of plausability. Again, there are other problems with the system.
P.S. D&D allows for PvP and I have tried it too. Just do the meta with cleric with strength domain to oneshot ppl or a neutral unsmiteable druid with a 1lvl monk dip to also be OP. Well, if timestop is not allowed, otherwise - timestop and stomp.