Bret dessie is a perfect Challanger replacement. So how about when a good GRN bomber pilot enters the fight we tell devs to nerf him cuz he snacs 5 of our bombers in less than 5 minutes?
Also I will repeat once again! Only way to make gallic cruiser be decent is increasing it's hull AT LEAST to 390k and give it a 3-4 secconds faster turning speed than the bret dessie.
Bret dessie is fine. It's a good ship, makes up for the snubs. Size is about the same as Scylla, Storta, RM Cruiser, etc. It could handle a drop to the 1.8m power core but I would expect something in trade for it.
GRN cruiser is the same size as Vidar. Lot of people say the Vidar is a great ship. They have the same stats except for turning. Give the GRN cruiser the RM cruiser handling and it will be an awesome ship.
(12-08-2012, 04:44 PM)Ursus Wrote: Size is about the same as Scylla, Storta, RM Cruiser, etc.
Nope it is around half of their size in length actually and have smaller front profile due to the hole.
The gallic ship is just too big for cruiser.
(10-09-2013, 10:51 AM)Knjaz Wrote: Official faction players that are often accused of elitism, never deploy them and have those weird, immersion killing "fair fight/dueling" suicidal hobbies. (yes, i've seen enough of those lolduels, where house military with overwhelming force on the field willingly loses a pilot in a duel. ffs.)
Ursus-mate, vidar has more hull, heavy turrets are in the center of the ship and has a thinner front/side profile while it's back is huge. A well flown vidar will win against most avarage BS pilots while a gallic cruiser won't stand a chance. A vidar can shoot 4 cerberus on it's sides while a GRN cruiser 2.
Also vidar has a better shape for chasing/dodging or flanking while the GRN cruiser hasn't got that.
Also, vidar has the fluffy red turrets and heavy hardpoints with great arcs making it fairly good to defend against bombers while if you even mount 2 razors in the nose of the ship they will miss in 100m range, if the bomber is stuppid enough to get in the proper arc where you actually can fire both of them. The GRN primaries are the ultimate Discovery Freelancer FAILGUNS with a bulb that looks weaker than a transport turret, with 50m/s slower speed and placed on the worst arcs possible. I remember that even against 2 templars I was struggling to keep my shield up without solaris.
(12-08-2012, 04:44 PM)Ursus Wrote: Size is about the same as Scylla, Storta, RM Cruiser, etc.
Nope it is around half of their size in length actually and have smaller front profile due to the hole.
I just counted and it is 3/4 the length of scylla/storta/hel. It has a larger side profile than storta and hel, and is wider than scylla, The hole in the front is just something to make you mad, it is no different than the dead space around storta and vidar when you are trying to LM from the side. It could be a little longer. Probably should get the 1.8m core to compensate, so that it is more evasion oriented. Now what should we do to the snubs to make them more competitive?
Quote:The gallic ship is just too big for cruiser.
Yeah its too big. So is Vidar. Both should lose about 25% of size probably.
@All, If GRN| and most RNS indies really wanted to do a change for their Cruiser - they would have requested that long ago by: creating threads like this one, contacting the devs, creating a list of proposals for possible changes, requesting new model for the cruiser or simply request a second version - lighter GRN Cruiser. Only then the chances for something to happen are higher.
On the top of that they should considering the ship as it is and its problems, state them are request a change - not by comparing it with its equivalents. Nerfing bret dessi just to make GRN cruiser better will lead to nowhere cuz if we follow that logic - in the future wars between GRN and LN - LSC may need a nerf or buff comparing it to the GRN one. Are you going to request another buff for the cruiser? What if Kusari again is fighting GRN? Another buff for the GRN cu and more nerfs for the Ku dessi? And etc...I think you got my point. Comparison is good but only for slight statements not to be used as constant "that ship is better so nerf it".
-> I will give an example/advice of how we handled such "heavy" problem on the bret side. The heavy breatonian gunboat, no matter if buffed or not, have some huge disadvantages in the massive battles - especially against multiple snubs or bombers. After several requests where most of us stated the problems - the devs buffed it. We found the problem remains even if the ship was better - it was still huge and easy target. So we moved forward - its a vanila ship - which means it cant be changed in terms of resizing it. We've requested then a second ship to be build - ligther gunboat - to fill the gap. Possibly the ship will be in the mod of the next version. Still - all this was not an easy job.
The tip is this: GRN may request a second lighter cruiser to be build next to their current more heavy version. (In lore Rp, GRN may have 20 versions of cruisers cuz they were preparing for this war for ages. It may not be a problem if they have more variations of gunboats/cruisers and etc) or they may request the cruiser to become BC and the smaller version - Standart cruiser. A lot of possibilities are available but I think the officials and the indies must be together as group and say what they want, contact the devs and see if its possible. Speaking only here may lead to nowhere.
Here an image I made very fast just so you could see my point:
Perhaps that may be another good idea in this thread, which the devs may take under consideration.
my ideas:
Bret dessie must have 1.8 mil core,because his size is not size of heavy cruisers.He is medium cruiser.And his core must be 1.8 mil,but guns leave as they are,because houses has much more technology base than pirate factions,thats it must be little better,than pirate cruisers.
Heavy cruiser in vanilla > Rheinland Cruiser
Medium cruisers > Liberty\ Bretonia
Light cruiser > Kusary
Cruiser of Rheinland is bigger than Bretonia. This is like to give Bretonia BS 9 mil core.
About GRN cruiser
We must choose what it will be:
>Heavy cruiser or Battlecruiser
My point is to give Gallia battlecruiser. I mean move this "heavy" cruiser to Battlecruiser group.
Do little resize and give him 3.6 mil core,more armor such as battlecruiser must have.
AND completely fix all arcs.
as it must have
2 BS primary guns
4 cruiser heavy guns
1 flak place
5-6 normal cruiser guns
what will we have if we will move it to BC group and will change bretonian dessie?
We will have real 2 differend and balanced type of fleets.
Gallic fleet will be massive and heavy VS Bretonian agile and medium powered ships.
We will see differend tactics in game from both sides. Massive armada of heavy gallic fleet vs agile bretonian and powerful wings.
P.S. about Gallic heavy cruiser if it will not be moved to BC group.
Valor must have heavy support in medium ships. GBs cant take it role,so this must take cruisers. But gallic cruisers which is "heavy",but have similar (2.5 mil) core as bretonian, almost similar armor and much slower will not help valors. But size of Gallic cruiser is MUCH bigger than Bretonian,even if it will be resized near 3\4 from current size.
Why it called as heavy cruiser? Only because it is bigger?
Heavy - mean more heavy guns,bigger core and more armor.But not only the size...
So my point,lets move it to BC cruiser group.This is will be real 2 differend fleets and more balanced. Armada vs agile defenders.
(12-09-2012, 04:07 PM)FallenKnight Wrote: -> I will give an example/advice of how we handled such "heavy" problem on the bret side. The heavy breatonian gunboat, no matter if buffed or not, have some huge disadvantages in the massive battles - especially against multiple snubs or bombers. After several requests where most of us stated the problems - the devs buffed it. We found the problem remains even if the ship was better - it was still huge and easy target. So we moved forward - its a vanila ship - which means it cant be changed in terms of resizing it. We've requested then a second ship to be build - ligther gunboat - to fill the gap. Possibly the ship will be in the mod of the next version. Still - all this was not an easy job.
The tip is this: GRN may request a second lighter cruiser to be build next to their current more heavy version. (In lore Rp, GRN may have 20 versions of cruisers cuz they were preparing for this war for ages. It may not be a problem if they have more variations of gunboats/cruisers and etc) or they may request the cruiser to become BC and the smaller version - Standart cruiser. A lot of possibilities are available but I think the officials and the indies must be together as group and say what they want, contact the devs and see if its possible. Speaking only here may lead to nowhere.
Here an image I made very fast just so you could see my point:
Perhaps that may be another good idea in this thread, which the devs may take under consideration.
Oh so your gunship you made is still going to make it in? Glad to hear it I thought it got rejected by a bunch of negative responses about how another ship isn't needed or whatever. It's good to hear I really like that ship. It really fits well I would definitely play that.
so I recently started exploring Coronado. I must say you're all doing a wonderful job.
so I recently started exploring Koeln. I must say you're all doing an amazing job.
some time ago I explored Rousillon. Impressive. Particularly the music on the planet that was a nice surprise.
so I recently started exploring Omega-55. LOL... NOMADS. LOTS AND LOTS OF NOMADS. SHOOTING THINGS. I GOT THE HELL OUT OF THERE. (and I was thinking, jeez I can't remember what that one was from the news. I hope I don't run into a nomad system)
recently started exploring Omega-41. what did you guys do to the star? that new effect there, that's impressive.
Honestly the current cruiser should be a BC. Currently with its size, sluggish handling, and rather low armor rating, combined with its foward-focused arcs, make it a pretty lackluster contender in any battle. yes it looks nice, but thats really it.
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