Well , you asked if there was one thing i could change.
that would be the one thing i'd change.
why can't more people state that they'd do the same?
that was a rhetoric question btw.
Note; This thread isn't simply to talk about removing or adding new rules. If people have ideas about changing or supplementing current rules, those suggestions are desired as well.
For example, how do you see making registering easier or harder. Do you think the 1m minimum is enough, do you think it should be more or less? Etc.
Just as a note so that everyone is on the same page here, I'm going to make some comments regarding how we have to do things now. And before you say, Carl, you don't know what you're talking about ... think about what faction I've been a member of for 4 years, and leading for the last two.
First off, thank you Dab, for stating that blanket bounties won't be going away. You all remember why they showed up, don't you, or have you forgotten?
' Wrote:Keep blanket bounties,
Why?
Because people use /rename a lot.
Just a note, since people think blanket ones are a bad thing.
Please go hunt names only and see how much you enjoy...
That was the situation PRIOR to blanket bounties - ha, that bounty was valid on Ima.Pirate, not Meso.Pirate ...
Even now, if you are a serious (or Sirius) bounty hunter or merc, under the current bounty rules you pretty much need to keep a notebook telling you where you can shoot someone. After all, if there's no bounty on the person you're planning on shooting where you are, under the rules you cannot engage him or you will be subject to a PvP abuse sanction.
' Wrote:I have some suggestions that are centered around 3 main ideas:
> Make bounty hunting worthwhile for the hunters (in terms of payment but also rp)
> Reduce the number of hunters that use the bounty hunter "rp" for easy "no rp"-pvp.
> Restrict the amount of "sirius wide" bounties as they are not logical in most cases.
Consequently, these are my suggestions:
Remove sirius-wide blanket bounties.
Restrict all blanket bounties to the (slightly increased) ZoI of the faction that pays for the bounty: I'll use an IMG example: IMG could bounty Outcast in Tau23 and T37 (our mining operations) but not in Alpha (as we do not have any business to be there, it's the OC homesystem). IMG would bounty Corsairs in Stu, O7, O3, O11, Came perhaps but not in the deeper Omegas...
Up the minimum payment to 3-5 million instead of 1 (at least for blanket bounties). One million bounties are simple "give people a cheap reason to cheap shoot easy targets" and invite the pvp-madness instead of a bounty hunter. The server needs less pvp and more rp imo.
Allow targets to "bribe" the merc away. I was told by merc veterans that there have been sanctions against the merc that took money to not shoot the target. That's stupid and reduces the only chance for a non-combat target to avoid a pvp interaction. As I said before: the server would profit from more rp solutions and less pvp centrism.
Make MercNet a transparent system like all other boards. Since the victim has to prove abuse, MercNet cannot be allowed to consequently hide the data to check whether the rules have been broken.
Sirius wide bounties are staying, as Dab said. If IMG were putting bounties on Corsairs or Outcasts - they should put a bounty of, say, 1 million on any Corsair or Outcast dead anywhere in Sirius (under the premise that's one less pirate in existence), with a bonus of 2 - 3 million if it occurs in a system where you have operations or within your ZOI. Quit being a bunch of cheapskates. The hunter in RP is risking his life for your companies credits - the least you can do is pay him.
Up the minimum payment? Yeah, definitely.
Bribe the merc - touchy subject. If the MERC makes the suggestion that if he gets paid to go away by the target bountied, that's simply pirating. (Quite literally, 2 mil or dai.) If the TARGET makes the suggestion, then it's a simple bribe. (Will you take 2 mil to let me go?) I know it's being anal of me - but by changing the subject and word structure, it is what it is.
MercNet or any other bounty system would be greatly assisted by automating the bounty system, and making it an FLHook command if possible. I would imagine that a simple database for existing bounties could be generated, and each of them given an expiration date. Then all the merc or hunter would have to do is target someone and type /openbounty (OB for short) and a list of valid bounties for that target would show up on screen. A screenshot would still have to be taken of those bounties, because our kill system still sucks, and there would still have to be a way to collect payment via the forum.
I do think that discussing things with the factions that pretty well make their living hunting bounties - Reavers, Mandos and BHG| should be the priority. (If there's a merc faction or hunter group I missed, apologies.) We're the ones who have to operate under these rules the most.
Oh, and one thing I'd change - no unlawful bounties on house military units from pirate organizations. THOSE are excuses for PvP. The LN shouldn't have to wonder if that merc in Liberty is going to attack them because some Corsair posted a bounty upon them. House police forces - yeah. NOT the Navies - it's one thing to piss off the police, even though they have decent firepower. Seriously - would ANY pirate base still exist if a Navy battleship squadron came sailing up? Don't think so ...
(11-21-2013, 12:53 PM)Jihadjoe Wrote: Oh god... The end of days... Agmen agreed with me.
' Wrote:Note; This thread isn't simply to talk about removing or adding new rules. If people have ideas about changing or supplementing current rules, those suggestions are desired as well.
For example, how do you see making registering easier or harder. Do you think the 1m minimum is enough, do you think it should be more or less? Etc.
I would agree Jack in increasing the minimum payment to 3-5 million instead of 1 (at least for blanket bounties)
I would like to see much payment on the person who is carrying,for example,more than Cap.Armor 6.
For example if a Battleship kill is 5 million,it should be 8 million if the battleship is carrying Cap.Armor 6 or higher,same should happen to all ships,which can carry Cap.Armor 6 or higher.
About blanket bounties,i would let all the groups (officials/unofficial) to make blanket bounties.
Also,i'd let the pirates to collect the bounties of criminal organisations.I mean pirates in bretonia should hunt the BAF for Mollys. Or pirates in Liberty should hunt the Navys for Lib.Rogues.
I would change it so its easier to find the bounties.
I would have it so it was sorted by WHO was being bountied. So if you kill an outcast, you go to the bounty board, scroll down to "outcast" and you get a list of all the bounties on outcasts, which you can then see which ones you can claim for. Instead of it being sorted by who is posting. There used to be athread kinda listing all the bounties, and it was very useful.
Also having seperate forums for single, and blanket bounties might be good.
User was banned for: Griefing others
Time left: (Permanent)
For all of you who want to have blanket bounty posted by all, it will be a mess. A huge mess of abuse.
Also, Jack, all MercNet contracts are approved by admins prior to being posted in the system as far as I am aware.
At any rate, I'd increase the minimum bounty. 1 million is, like many said, a mere excuse for a pvp with very little RP.
Also, I'd allow more IDs to collect bounties, and the ability for a freelancer or a mercenary to have his equipment reflected in those he work for by "upgrading" the system Agmen suggested. Add to each bounty collected a sort of "points", after you gain a certain (high) number of points the nerfs with that faction would decrease slightly, which could reflect your loyalty to them and their trust in you (as a freelancer).
I scanned the BB rules and found some things that should/could be changed, clarified.
Quote:5. All blanket* bounties must identify a target and set the total amount to be paid out. Evidence that this amount has been set aside for payment is also required. Blanket bounties may only be issued by official factions.
=> Delete the: "Evidence that this amount has been set aside for payment is also required" part. If you post a blanket bounty and you cannot pay, the mercs will show you what roleplay consequences are. There does not have to be a rule.
Quote:"Blanket bounties may only be issued by official factions."
Keep that, ofc.
=> Clarification kindly requested:
Is it true that an individual (so just a "normal player" not an official faction) can post a blanket bounty by using MercNet? I have heard conflicting versions and there has been no information anywhere. What I heard was: Individuals can post blanket bounties via MercNet because the MercNet (that is part of Reavers = official) makes the individual's bounty a legitimate one. One could say, MercNet legitimises the circumvention of this rule IF (!) the rumors are true.
Quote:8. Rule 6.10 states that player reputation and conduct must match player actions.
6.10 doesn't exist any more. Changing it to 6.9 might fix it.
Quote:8. (continued) Players must be at least neutral to their employer.
[...]
People posting bounties are obliged to ensure that the persons they are hiring have a suitable reputation. This means no hiring or paying people who would be hostile to you based on previous actions.
=> I'd ask for clarification here: How does MercNet solve this 6.9/6.10 issue?
The employer is anonymous. The employer is in my interpretation the party that ordered the killing and paid for it. Fictional example that could easily happen: IMG wants a group to be shot. They go to MercNet, order the bounty, pay. Now RR and MM claim on MercNet (without knowing, but still on a contract from IMG). But RR and MM are not able to claim for IMG due to being fully red hostile. No board would allow their enemies from hunting for them... as it would be a break of bb rule 8.
Quote:9. There are no anonymous bounties. Administrators may post bounties on behalf of people wishing to remain anonymous and may request that persons sponsoring bounties identify themselves to Administrators.
Either there are anonymous bounties or not. I assume we are talking about oorp-ly anonymous bounties. I have not seen any anonymous bounties that were posted by Admins in 1 1/2 years. I have seen many anonymous bounties now via MercNet. I doubt they were posted by Admins and there are only rumors that admins visit the MercNet. I would like to have a short Admin statement about that aspect.
In my opinion, there should be no oorp-ly anonymous bounty, not even one posted by Admins. In a system in which the victim of a rule-break has to prove that a rule was broken, there is no room for anonymity and an oorp lack of information.
Quote:11. An individual or group may only collect on a bounty which that person or group has sponsored or funded (fully or partly) so long as it is open to others to collect**.
Allowing hunting organisations to post bounties that they work on themselves... somehow sounds not right for me. An example of a case in which theoretically the rule was followed was the Samura| hunt. A ton of possible IDs that can claim, but most of these actually could not, would not realistically and no one except the sponsoring faction did when I checked last.
Completely restricting hunters from offering bounties theselves is not really reasonable, either, as they ofc have a right to e.g. enforce their own political goals by the means of issuing a bounty. But... hm. I don't have a solution. I just see that it somehow isn't perfect and can be easily abused as a method of "self-employing" your faction.
' Wrote:Sirius wide bounties are staying, as Dab said.
You misread Dab. He said: "blanket bounties" are staying.
And I have no problem with blanket bounties. Name bounties just fail and are impossible to keep track of. The hunter wants fun, too, and not scan lists of thousands of names.
What I want is: Remove siriuswide blanket bounties.
Quote: If IMG were putting bounties on Corsairs or Outcasts - they should put a bounty of, say, 1 million on any Corsair or Outcast dead anywhere in Sirius (under the premise that's one less pirate in existence), with a bonus of 2 - 3 million if it occurs in a system where you have operations or within your ZOI. Quit being a bunch of cheapskates. The hunter in RP is risking his life for your companies credits - the least you can do is pay him.
I find it extremely "cheap" (as in: unfair, not logical) to fund stupid actions like e.g. Gamma raids by offering a bounty multiplier by a board of a faction that is not even close to Gamma. Why would e.g. IMG pay for a Corsair killed in their own home system? Our next base is... so many jumps away that I don't even know the way there. So offering 1 million for that is just what hunters love, not what realistic gameplay asks for.
It's much more realistic to bounty the targets that hurt your operations in your ZoI with much higher sums (we agree here) instead of offering a bounty everywhere for cheap. Of course Mercs love the siriuswide bounty because they do not have to check who they pvp where. But I have to check my ZoI, too, before I pvp. So...
Quote:Bribe the merc - touchy subject. If the MERC makes the suggestion that if he gets paid to go away by the target bountied, that's simply pirating. (Quite literally, 2 mil or dai.) If the TARGET makes the suggestion, then it's a simple bribe. (Will you take 2 mil to let me go?) I know it's being anal of me - but by changing the subject and word structure, it is what it is.
Yep, touchy. Thank you for pointing it out.
Yet, I think it has to be allowed because: Imaging a transport with a cargo of 20 million. He is cheap-ass bountied for 1 million per pop. So the merc gets 1 million for destroying 20 million. The trader could easily pay that hunter off and it would perfectly make sense economically for both parties.
My suggestion: The bribe can't be more than twice (?) the target is worth on a BB?
So a merc could still make money by saying: "So, you are willing to pay me off? Alright... you are worth 2 to me. Make me an offer and I never saw you and now shove off!" and still get his pay (even up to 2 times it) while the non-fighting ship can continue, has no pvp death, doesn't lose cargo and got out of an unwanted pvp situation by roleplay. It would create a win-win situation for a real rp hunter (not for the griefer, not for the pvp cheapshooter) and easy targets like transports.
It would like to add a roleplay escape for a situation in which only pvp was a rulewise solution before.