okay okay, we all good when we discuss, but what about any actions?
are you planning to do it in closer time?
well then make a conference with leaders of MR , BAF, BPA, IMG , BMM and everyone else, to discuss this idea and put it ingame.
why not?
It isn't just an issue for the factions to decide.
If it were, it wouldn't be on these forums.
If I be right, I'm assuming Dieter is looking for this to go into the mod lore as canon.
This makes it not just a player faction question but an entire NPC faction shift.
We're basically talking about the Mollys accepting a divided Dublin, instead of an independent Dublin.
As much as I'd love to use Ireland in the real world as an example, the Mollys aren't in any kind of similar situation really, aside from names.
The Mollys are the majority in Dublin but they are still a minority compared to Bretonia.
' Wrote:Go to Bretonian or IMG space as Molly and you die, go to Molly space as one of the mentioned and you die. I'd say thats how it should have been all the time. This whole Molly-Bret no pew pew thing always was quite far fetched in my eyes...
You are right about that. The mollies before 6 months could blast every bretonian that stays on their way or is interrupting their piracy (taxes). The molly faction is a key element of Dublin, without it, Dublin is just another Mining Heaven, if we dont consider the "enemies" (cannibals, sushi-eaters, red-skinned men aka Indians, crazy ecologists, greedy mercenaries and a lot more pets and friends who hate Bretonia).
My oppinion is you guys, "mollies", to rebuild your faction again, form the start, but not as separated groups of MR, MS and Garda. Combine it in one big Council faction and I believe then even you will like it more. In that way, bretonians and mollies will have more encounter moments together while in Dublin. Bretonians will be more active, in order to stop the mollies who interfere in their sectors. Mollies will be more active in order to take more taxes and defend from the bretonians. And once a single/multiple "enemy/enemies" (check above who they may be), arrive in Dublin, we can wipe him/them down quickly (together) and go back to our "faction problems of hostility" just like before.
So I like the idea of splitting the sectors in that way only if it will make the Mollies more active. Here may be not the right place to mention it, but BAF| cant handle alone the combines forces of daily raids from "Corsairs, Gaians, Kusarians and the increased numbers of Indies: Pirates, Mollies, Outcasts (who dont follow the treaties). That explains why people from BAF are less active these days, because once they log in, they got engaged, and we all dont want that right?
This is an interesting idea, but it will almost kill Molly unlawful roleplay I fear. The zones as Dieter projects do not include the two fields where BMM miners most often mine - if Mollies could no longer go there, what's the point of being a Molly? The drive towards Dublin's independance, and the removal of BMM from the entire system are the cornerstones of the Molly faction.
Suggestions therefor:
- Extend the "mixed" ZOI to include both the independent fields. Graves, the gate, and Essex should be no-go zones for the Mollies.
- Hood in the neutral zone is fine. However, how is this handled diplomatically? Is the "NFZ" still considered Bret sovereign space? Or a bit of "independent" space inside a system? Reason being, if we're out there on practically our own, we might want a cap there in case hostile caps show - and the Brets are making a fuss about the indy that already showed up there.
Quote:- Mollys don't enter Bret space. BAF and BPA don't enter Molly space. Anyone who enters the other side does so at their own risk. And no, I cannot guarantee that some HMS's will not go charging over to Arranmore. Basically a Bretonian ship that enters the Molly Zone is fair game to blow up. As is any Molly that wants to enter and/or tax in the BAF zone.
This'll get the conflict going again - with Mollies taxing being deemed unlawful by the BAF, causing a bit of fighting.
Quote:- BAF will protect all neutral or BMM miners in BAF space.
Or try to. They serve mostly as BMM guards.
Quote:- Mollys can tax, and protect any miners which wish to try their luck on the Molly side. If BMM miners want to mine over there, and will pay the Mollys tax, so be it.
The Molly stance is, correct me if I'm wrong, that anyone without explicit permission to be around Arranmore is summarily booted from that field. It took IMG some doing to allow our (official faction) miners to work that field. I very much doubt that any independent, and certainly no BMM miners, will ever be allowed around that area. Mollies -despise- BMM.
Quote:- BAF and Mollys may end up co-operating to defend miners in the neutral area. Or they may tussle over taxation rights there. Or who knows. BAF should, at the very least, defend BMM miners in the neutral zone.
That tussle is exactly the reason why I -strongly- advise keeping the independent gold fields neutral zone-ish.
Quote:- If common enemies enter Dublin, (like, I dunno, Corsair capswarms) the two can act in the common defense and enter each other's zones temporarily. Common enemies may include independant pirates, or Corsairs, or Kusari, or any other troublemakers deeemed by both sides to be needing killin.
Makes sense.
Quote:- IMG around the Hood, I don't know. I suggest that IMG make their base at the Hood and try to act to secure it. Again, common enemies may see BAF, IMG, and Mollys cooperate. Maybe the northern neutral zone is IMG-patrolled, and the southern neutral zone is like a no-man's-land.
Yea, we tried that. BAF indicated they'll oppose us stationing capital vessels there (we did make a formal request for it). IMG isn't in a position where they can challenge the BAF authority directly - that'd be the end of South Shields and Cardiff. If Bretonia relinquishes it's sovereignty claim on the area around Hood, IMG could become the principle authority around Hood, militarily. But both strategically and tactically it would be a bad idea for the BAF to relinquish sovereignty of that area. Hood's perimiter includes the jumpholes to Leeds and New London (some 12 K from the ship, we see who comes in and goes out).
IMG wouldn't mind seeing this happen (and in turn, work with Mollies and BAF to counter capital threats). But I don't see this happen from the Bret side.
' Wrote:Again, lore-wise IMG is a "loose confederation of miners who work those fields that have thus far remained undeveloped by the larger mining companies"; in fact, wiki pages for Cardiff and South Shields mostly answer the questions. Hood in Dublin somehow helps with maintaining a sort of stability in its part of Dublin, but roleplay-wise IMG operates under numerous restrictions and in the less rich ore deposits then BMM. Also, the conflicts between BMM and Mollys and BMM and Gaians will seriously endanger their work in such an area. (Here I summon some IMG players that know the conditions Guild operates there under, because they know them much better)
There are two things that confuse me that much. First one is what is Molly-that-is-not-a-pirate doing in proximity of BMM operations? Molly that is not a pirate is already a kind of oxymoron even in the light of recent changes.
And, uh, BMM in Molly space? Unpunished? Huh?
I am not aware of any restrictions to IMG in Bretonian space (short of not aiding Kusari and staying out of the Graves field). We're able to mine all the independent fields freely, but stick mostly to the northeast one to be a little further from the BuMMers. That was, until we got permission to the Arranmore field - nowadays we're more often over there. Yield is significantly higher on the field overlap.
' Wrote:<strike>DSE *trollface*</strike> Junkers. The perfect choice, to be honest. I would like to see Junkers buying Ore from Mollys much more then the same Junkers buying it from BMM and sitting at Essex to taunt haters.
Uh, at the same time, I believe that there are less documents like this one needed, but more attention from official Molly factions, since BAF| already oppresses bastards.
Mollies have stationed a barge near Hood to act as a trading station. Lorewise this makes sense - Mollies according to lore use the Hood as a trading post. IMG transports, junkers, and freelancer traders would likely be the principle buyers. Maybe Gateway as well, to some degree (IMG uses Gateway as it's primary shipper, IMG is friendly with the Mollies, thus the connection can be made).
' Wrote:Go to Bretonian or IMG space as Molly and you die, go to Molly space as one of the mentioned and you die. I'd say thats how it should have been all the time. This whole Molly-Bret no pew pew thing always was quite far fetched in my eyes...
Mollies shoot on sight in IMG space? Err... we're practically friendly to eachother, but at the very least neutral. Mollies use IMG for supplies, there's a shared hatred towards BMM's expansionism.
Wide awake in a world that sleeps, enduring thoughts, enduring scenes. The knowledge of what is yet to come.
From a time when all seems lost, from a dead man to a world, without restraint, unafraid and free.
Mostly retired Discovery member. May still visit from time to time.
Quote:Mollies shoot on sight in IMG space? Err... we're practically friendly to eachother, but at the very least neutral. Mollies use IMG for supplies, there's a shared hatred towards BMM's expansionism.
Right, forgot about that one ;)
But in the light of that the whole Bretland-Molly-we-dont-shoot-each-other-that-much-anymore makes no sense. Mollies should be pie ratting the hell out of every Bretonian that goes to Dublin. Maybe that would even make Dublin a bit of a better place. Right now its just Miners and their protectors (BAF,BPA, and sometimes even Mollies) against the other bad boys. Mollies actively joining the bad boy group again could change some things.
Anyone yelling about making the Mollys 1 single faction again so they can claim Dublin properly needs a slap.
The idea is that the seperate factions deal with every area of the Mollys.
If you want to defend Dublin, there are folks doing that already.
If you don't want to defend Dublin, there are folks doing that already.
There is no need to join these groups together, so that they can ignore everywhere but Dublin.
Sprolf somewhat drilled the idea of hardcore Mollys into most MR folks head's.
No surrender, no divide, free Dublin.
Dieters idea has merit,
Creating these zones, in my view, increases rp.
As stated, the Molly/Crown thing is not helping the Mollys at all so, if i read right, lets reignite the old fights. Doing this will help. How? Mollys going to the indie fields to rob,tax,pirate or generaly finding any excuse to shoot at the BMM. Got to dodge the BAF, security patrols and the miners own escorts, welcome back the Mollys:)
As in the days of all out pew pew between the Crown and the Mollys, Dublin is still regarded as Bretonian,and always will be. I believe all we are trying to do here is make Dublin more managable for everyone since it became a miners heaven.
Bad guys come into Dublin on the west side? BAF is gonna step back and let the Mollys/IMG deal with them until they stroll over to our side then we will deal with them either together or apart then probably go our own ways throwing the odd insult or , if insults get too bad, shoot the bejesus out of each other again:)
Anything that gets this hell called Dublin more managable has got to be good, right?
My two cents, as a player:
Molly-Bretonian truce/ceasefire/whatever is a bad thing and should not happen.
I suggest: reverting to a situation where the Mollies seek to avenge Bretonian intrusions and tea-drinking. Molly pugilism should be met with Bretonian stiff upper lip and extreme violence.
Also, get genuine Irish folk to play Mollies in the style of the most mental republican splinter groups in recent history. No one worth his republican salt would kowtow to the Anglo-Saxon invaders and would instead hunger-strike, blow up commercial centres, use proxy bombs and generally be beastly about the cause of national sovereignty to a degree that would (and should) shock anyone civilised.
Letting other folk chew up your natural resources is silly and possibly not roleplaying properly.
' Wrote:This is an interesting idea, but it will almost kill Molly unlawful roleplay I fear. The zones as Dieter projects do not include the two fields where BMM miners most often mine - if Mollies could no longer go there, what's the point of being a Molly? The drive towards Dublin's independance, and the removal of BMM from the entire system are the cornerstones of the Molly faction.
I must second this.
Scenario 1:
We accept the proposal without changing the mining field droprates:
The idea of the game is to have interactions. If the Mollys stay in their Zone and BMMs mine in their zone mollys are useless since they would not interact with the BMMs.
If the Mollys will go in the BAF/BMM zone and pirate then it will be the same chaos situation like now, and wont change the BAF position according Mollys- hostile. It is hard to be neutral with BAF and help them against let say indie pirates if the same BAF people shoot you when you try to pirate the hated BMMs, so mollys team with the indie pirates in this case and it makes the situation worst for both sides. So the proposal like the old one proposed by Mike is useless since it wont change anything in the system.
Scenario 2:
We accept the proposal but nerf all BMM fields by half and buff the Molly field, it is not necessary to be exactly the Aaramore field. It could be the O.49 Field for example but it should be the best field around where the BMMs would make the biggest profits, the field would be in Mollys zone so BAF wont protect the BMMs there.
What this change will accomplish?
1: Mollys hate BMM not BAF. Mind this! It will reduce the oorp player hate between the both factions and will increase their cooperation against the common enemies.
2: BMM should be aggressive and territory hungry company in RP, it fits perfectly to risk more in order to gain more profits or stay in the nerfed fields in safety of BAF protectors. It will increase the activity of all Bounty hunters, Mercs etc, and BMM escorts who will try to secure the Molly field in order to have higher profits.
3: Mollys behaviour- it is a bit illogical for Molly to tax the BMM miners,or allow them to mine Gold in the molly Zone.
They should ask for the ore, Mollys should be able to trade with the Ore and to have their miners, after all they are former miners right?
4: External enemies: Kusari/Indie Pirates/ Corsairs etc.
If they are around the Mollys and BAF should team up to remove them. If the BAF and mollys dont shoot each other all the time, there is a big chance this to happen.
(10-09-2013, 10:51 AM)Knjaz Wrote: Official faction players that are often accused of elitism, never deploy them and have those weird, immersion killing "fair fight/dueling" suicidal hobbies. (yes, i've seen enough of those lolduels, where house military with overwhelming force on the field willingly loses a pilot in a duel. ffs.)
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