Cloaks & Jump drives inhibit interaction or just deny it outright, they make people think twice about logging in for activity.
before cloaks, nomad ships would generate assloads of activity if they logged in, people either wanting to further their own RP by interacting with nomads, or just people looking to hunt them down and kill them.
the more nomads logged in the more people logged in to counter them. in the keepers, when the four original marduks logged in before Lamashtu and Zamaranum got made; Harbinger, Mammetum, Orouborus, Yggdrasil. holy hell you should have seen the amount of Order that logged in before we'd even left Iota, theyd be flooding in like a river.
what about now? who gives a damn if they log in, they have infinite cloaking devices. interaction completely denied. in role play i do honestly think that nomads should have cloaks, but again, what make sense in role play DOES NOT mean that it will not harm server game play.
I was incharge of security and turret placement of Kings Cross station in New London. that base made 100% sense in role play, and if you had asked me back then id have denied it. but now that ive seen the drastic impact bases like this have had, it seriously harmed game play in bretonia to have the base there the way it was.
and then we have Jump Drives, most notably the huge groups of jumping zoners in the past, and currently the Junkers Congress. interaction completely denied once again, and not even from a pirating or hostile perspective. Since i run (or will when i get my damn ship) 75th, a small outcast squadron, which has escorting cardamine smugglers as one of its main operational goals.
when the MAIN customer of your faction starts jumping across the galaxy in huge swarms it really, really hurts activity and is damaging in and out of role play. what do they need us for if they can just bypass every system and every potential threat out there?
and what did their jump trading achieve? it moved the sellpoint of premium scrap away from Alpha to Gallia, which meant that not only activity and oppertunity to escort smugglers with .:j:. was damaged, they completely crippled the cardamine trade, so now there is NOBODY to escort at all.
There was plenty of celebration when the sellpoint was moved to Gallia because now the junkers cant jump trade, but they hurt much more than themselves with their actions.
TL;DR
Anything that inhibits or denys interaction between players needs to be removed.
Quote:#removecloaks now , they have no place in a game that is only worth playing when player-player interaction takes place
Quote:This game is based around interaction, and a tool that deprives it, it completely silly.
Quote:Cloaks & Jump drives inhibit interaction or just deny it outright, they make people think twice about logging in for activity
As a player that owns, uses cloaks and interacts with other players that do the same I agree that cloaks should have no place in Disco. Remove them all, even nomad cloaks.
TL;DR
Anything that inhibits or denys interaction between players needs to be removed.
You do have some good points. However, even if Jump Trading was removed would that have any noticeable increase in activity around Alpha? I don't believe so. I myself haven't visited alpha at all since the changes in scrap, mainly because selling to the GMG allows me to pick up the H-3 trade, which avoids Tau-23, IMG, GRN, and all manner of annoying independent pirate.
In short, even if jump trading was removed, you (as in Outcasts) still have nothing economically to offer to lure any sort of trader to Alpha.
(02-23-2015, 05:35 PM)Captain_Nemo Wrote: You do have some good points. However, even if Jump Trading was removed would that have any noticeable increase in activity around Alpha? I don't believe so. I myself haven't visited alpha at all since the changes in scrap, mainly because selling to the GMG allows me to pick up the H-3 trade, which avoids Tau-23, IMG, GRN, and all manner of annoying independent pirate.
In short, even if jump trading was removed, you (as in Outcasts) still have nothing economically to offer to lure any sort of trader to Alpha.
The point was that Jump Trading like craaaaazyyy was the reason for the p scrap price changes. In short damage is already done, but that doesn't mean that JT groups/factions will not focus on other commodities in the future. It will certainly happen again if its not happening already.
Alpha has nothing to offer? ever heard of cardamine?
Cloaks are not a bad thing or idea. They just lack a suitable counter.
Making CDs interrupt cloaks just means more CD spamming.
All that is needed is a specific weapon or equipment designed to counter cloaks (special radar, special torp, etc.)
This prevents CDs from just being the kill-all weapon for both cruise and cloaks, and forces players to actually specialize their ships for counter-cloaking at the cost of something else.
(02-23-2015, 05:43 PM)Gondoros Wrote: Alpha has nothing to offer? ever heard of cardamine?
Yes, an illegal drug that will result in every lawful group and a few unlawful groups attempting to pirate/confiscate/fine from Malta to Huston, not a profitable trip at all, and that's not even touching the fact that the Malta doesn't import anything pricey. Again leading to most traders, such as myself, to finding more profitable routes.
(02-23-2015, 03:46 PM)Hidamari Wrote: Cloaks & Jump drives inhibit interaction or just deny it outright, they make people think twice about logging in for activity.
That's just not true. Anyone can speak their opinion like its fact. The server is still here and doing well so I don't subscribe to that line of thinking. To me its the other way around, and removing the fun stuff would make me think twice about logging. When I see a dozen ships gathered for a jump, they seem to get lots of interaction out of it. You say that inhibits interaction? Must interaction involve fighting? A cloak might work against you, it might wind up working for you if a friendly ship using one shows up to help you out. A cloak can control interaction, not necessarily avoid it. You can use your cloak for finding other ships as much as avoiding them. Its the same thing with JD's...there's always winners and losers, its about the ability, the tactics. Being able to get these things and use them well is part of the allure to a game like disco. You get to refine your interaction.
(02-23-2015, 05:43 PM)Gondoros Wrote: Alpha has nothing to offer? ever heard of cardamine?
Yes, an illegal drug that will result in every lawful group and a few unlawful groups attempting to pirate/confiscate/fine from Malta to Huston, not a profitable trip at all, and that's not even touching the fact that the Malta doesn't import anything pricey. Again leading to most traders, such as myself, to finding more profitable routes.
Some people on the server make their character and then decide how they can make money with it. For example myself and others like to play smugglers, cuz its fun running from the law and always being on your guard etc.
Roleplaying a trader is not always about taking the safer course. It is fun to meet pirates/traders/lawfulls to interact with them, ya know roleplay, not just grinding continuously. It's not only about the money.
(02-23-2015, 03:46 PM)Hidamari Wrote: Cloaks & Jump drives inhibit interaction or just deny it outright, they make people think twice about logging in for activity.
before cloaks, nomad ships would generate assloads of activity if they logged in, people either wanting to further their own RP by interacting with nomads, or just people looking to hunt them down and kill them.
the more nomads logged in the more people logged in to counter them. in the keepers, when the four original marduks logged in before Lamashtu and Zamaranum got made; Harbinger, Mammetum, Orouborus, Yggdrasil. holy hell you should have seen the amount of Order that logged in before we'd even left Iota, theyd be flooding in like a river.
what about now? who gives a damn if they log in, they have infinite cloaking devices. interaction completely denied. in role play i do honestly think that nomads should have cloaks, but again, what make sense in role play DOES NOT mean that it will not harm server game play.
I was incharge of security and turret placement of Kings Cross station in New London. that base made 100% sense in role play, and if you had asked me back then id have denied it. but now that ive seen the drastic impact bases like this have had, it seriously harmed game play in bretonia to have the base there the way it was.
and then we have Jump Drives, most notably the huge groups of jumping zoners in the past, and currently the Junkers Congress. interaction completely denied once again, and not even from a pirating or hostile perspective. Since i run (or will when i get my damn ship) 75th, a small outcast squadron, which has escorting cardamine smugglers as one of its main operational goals.
when the MAIN customer of your faction starts jumping across the galaxy in huge swarms it really, really hurts activity and is damaging in and out of role play. what do they need us for if they can just bypass every system and every potential threat out there?
and what did their jump trading achieve? it moved the sellpoint of premium scrap away from Alpha to Gallia, which meant that not only activity and oppertunity to escort smugglers with .:j:. was damaged, they completely crippled the cardamine trade, so now there is NOBODY to escort at all.
There was plenty of celebration when the sellpoint was moved to Gallia because now the junkers cant jump trade, but they hurt much more than themselves with their actions.
TL;DR
Anything that inhibits or denys interaction between players needs to be removed.
P R E A C H
(02-23-2015, 05:48 PM)Captain_Nemo Wrote:
(02-23-2015, 05:43 PM)Gondoros Wrote: Alpha has nothing to offer? ever heard of cardamine?
Yes, an illegal drug that will result in every lawful group and a few unlawful groups attempting to pirate/confiscate/fine from Malta to Huston, not a profitable trip at all, and that's not even touching the fact that the Malta doesn't import anything pricey. Again leading to most traders, such as myself, to finding more profitable routes.
Quote:This game is based around interaction, and a tool that deprives it, it completely silly.
Anyway, what you suggest will just end up with what Jack says. Sure, you enjoy cloak, because you can uncloak your pelican on players without it. But think that everyone had it, you'll uncloak, that player will cloak and hurray goes the interaction. Unless you think all interactions should be friendly chit-chats, and in that case I will say we aren't playing Pretty Princess in Ponyland.
Yes the game is "based around interaction" but why would somebody cloak right after you uncloak? If that person is not stupid, he'll do some RP with you (why wouldn't he, when this game is based around RP?), and if he does cloak, then let him. He clearly doesn't want to RP (or doesn't know how to) so there is no reason to waste your time talking to that person.
then let me re-tribute with the following - why should the cloak be the instant gateway out of combat? Combat is essential part of the roleplaying in the server. Take it out and in 2 days you'll have no one around here.
Let me even go further for you - fighting IS roleplaying.
Sure, but why shouldn't you have a chance to get out of combat "Alive"? If you see that the opponent is a better pilot, and you can't win the fight, why should you stay and risk your life?(inRP) Or does it mean that every fight has to end with a shiny blue message? I think that's one of cloak's purposes, so let it do what it was designed for, or remove it.